(12-10-2011 10:22 AM)Hilltopper2K Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 10:13 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  good to see you Topper fans are finally seeing the world as it truely is.

Horse, I gotta tell you. My Dad has been taking me to WKU basketball games since before I can remember. WKU basketball is in my blood.

I didn't even go to a WKU football game until I was an upperclassman in college.

I got into football about the time the Titans came to Nashville and I started going to WKU games when we were in the OVC. Of course the move the Gateway was exciting and the 2002 championship was a huge thrill (I was there!).

But in the last couple of years I have felt something changing. And it is NOT just that our basketball team has been down.

Football is grand. It is played on a bigger scale. There is something about being outside on a fall day, and seeing those kicks that go a hundred feet in the air, and just the size and scope of it all.

Going to basketball games now feels "small" by comparison. Not that I have stopped being a basketball fan by any means... just that my eyes have definately been opened.

I never used to understand why Sunbelt fans were loathe to talk about basketball during football season. And there is still room on the board to talk aobut both.

But I do understand now why they felt that way.

man that's awesome 2K, i'm really excited for you! I played football from 5th grade until I graduated from highschool, started every season. I love football through and through and I can never get enough of it. Since I'm not a tall man I never got in to basketball, only played it for 3 seasons (7,8,9th grade) so I'll watch Troy and appreciate it...I just don't follow the sport outside of my Trojans. Basketball just seems small to me.

Since you are beginning to really appreciate American rules football for its grand scale, you should check out Canadian football. bigger field, 12 guys not 11, and all the offensive skill position players can be in motion in any direction prior to the snap. it's just bigger.

ask me in 4 years...

(12-10-2011 11:35 AM)Raider_ATO Wrote:  ask me in 4 years...

this

(12-09-2011 08:55 PM)HILTOPWKU Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 08:52 PM)HILTOPWKU Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 08:01 PM)CrushMI Wrote:  4 or 5 star DB (Florida commit) - his official WKU visit this weekend!!

(Alabama, Notre Dame, Florida St. recruiting him hard)

Brian Poole. #2 CB in nation (Scout)

He would go nice with our #1 safety Dowling.

Impressive stuff WKU! What's the story on Dowling?

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

True and not true. There are always five underrated players for every 50 but rainey is in no way one of the best in the nation nor doe these underrated 2 star players every win any national championships. Most the time the star rankings are spot on even though they have faults. Heck look at Matt Barkley, he was a five star recruit.

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

I understand what you are saying and agree, but those stars are for the fans to brag and helps with future recruiting. There are a very limited amount of 4 and 5 star player to choose from....so to get some of them is huge!!

(12-10-2011 04:24 PM)wkuhilltopperfan Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

I understand what you are saying and agree, but those stars are for the fans to brag and helps with future recruiting. There are a very limited amount of 4 and 5 star player to choose from....so to get some of them is huge!!

I will that for the most part they matter. But for us at Troy, the guys usually doing all the work during our run weren't 3,4, and 5 star players. What they were were kids who had won state championships in high school, or JUCO All Americans or All Conference, etc. They were champs in their previous endevours and they were champs here. Some of the 4 star talent we had weren't on great teams and didn't end up doing much here. A lot of them also couldn't make the grades here or follow the rules and never made on the field as a result.

(12-10-2011 02:16 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 08:55 PM)HILTOPWKU Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 08:52 PM)HILTOPWKU Wrote:  

(12-09-2011 08:01 PM)CrushMI Wrote:  4 or 5 star DB (Florida commit) - his official WKU visit this weekend!!

(Alabama, Notre Dame, Florida St. recruiting him hard)

Brian Poole. #2 CB in nation (Scout)

He would go nice with our #1 safety Dowling.

Impressive stuff WKU! What's the story on Dowling?

Here is the stuff on Dowling.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010...senior-day

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/footba...an-dowling

(12-10-2011 04:29 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 04:24 PM)wkuhilltopperfan Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

I understand what you are saying and agree, but those stars are for the fans to brag and helps with future recruiting. There are a very limited amount of 4 and 5 star player to choose from....so to get some of them is huge!!

I will that for the most part they matter. But for us at Troy, the guys usually doing all the work during our run weren't 3,4, and 5 star players. What they were were kids who had won state championships in high school, or JUCO All Americans or All Conference, etc. They were champs in their previous endevours and they were champs here. Some of the 4 star talent we had weren't on great teams and didn't end up doing much here. A lot of them also couldn't make the grades here or follow the rules and never made on the field as a result.

Not trying to rebuttal you however, all those guys getting it done lost to nearly every AQ team they play. During our run most the wins came vs Sun Belt and Mac teams who did not have many 3,4,5 star players.

While you don't need them it is nice to have them......and it usually shows when you do.

(12-10-2011 08:00 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 04:29 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 04:24 PM)wkuhilltopperfan Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

I understand what you are saying and agree, but those stars are for the fans to brag and helps with future recruiting. There are a very limited amount of 4 and 5 star player to choose from....so to get some of them is huge!!

I will that for the most part they matter. But for us at Troy, the guys usually doing all the work during our run weren't 3,4, and 5 star players. What they were were kids who had won state championships in high school, or JUCO All Americans or All Conference, etc. They were champs in their previous endevours and they were champs here. Some of the 4 star talent we had weren't on great teams and didn't end up doing much here. A lot of them also couldn't make the grades here or follow the rules and never made on the field as a result.

Not trying to rebuttal you however, all those guys getting it done lost to nearly every AQ team they play. During our run most the wins came vs Sun Belt and Mac teams who did not have many 3,4,5 star players.

While you don't need them it is nice to have them......and it usually shows when you do.

A good point, I guess it what I tried to convey was that there's more to it. We had typically the same or slightly higher star ratings than our sunbelt brethren, yet in 2007-2009, with only a few exceptions, we were heads and tails better than our SBC opponents, +17 in 07, +19 in 08, +17 in 09, +8 in 10. Those are huge margins of victory. I think we had great coaching as well as some 2 and 3 star receivers that should have 3 and 4 star, jerrel maybe a 5 in terms of talent. But you're right, if we had rosters filled with 4 and 5 star guys, we'd compete better at the AQ level.

(12-10-2011 02:36 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

True and not true. There are always five underrated players for every 50 but rainey is in no way one of the best in the nation nor doe these underrated 2 star players every win any national championships. Most the time the star rankings are spot on even though they have faults. Heck look at Matt Barkley, he was a five star recruit.

.
Explain why not?

actually I got to say, I think Rainey is one of the best in the nation IN HIS CLASS. the guy is a BEAST and I wish Troy had him. I sure do pray the Titans draft the guy, he'll make one hell of a compliment to CJ2K. Go Blue.

(12-10-2011 10:28 PM)Franko Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 02:36 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

True and not true. There are always five underrated players for every 50 but rainey is in no way one of the best in the nation nor doe these underrated 2 star players every win any national championships. Most the time the star rankings are spot on even though they have faults. Heck look at Matt Barkley, he was a five star recruit.

.
Explain why not?

Rainey - 369 attempts and 1695 yards rushing in the Sun Belt.
LaMicheal James- 222 attempts and 1646 rushing yards in the Pac-12.
Andre Ellington- 213 attempts and 1062 yards in the ACC
Joseph Randall - 198 attempts and 1193 yards in the Big 12
Montee Ball - 275 attempts and 1759 yards in the Big 10
Chandler Harrish (this guy is a QB) - 185 rushing attempts 1382 in the MAC.
Trent Richardson- 263 attempts and 1583 rushing yards in the SEC

To answer your question rainey literally has two seasons worth of carries this year against not exactly the best conference. There are still many guys like Chris Polk and Micheal Dyer ahead of him. Just about all these guys would have 2000 yards with the amount of carries Rainey got.

Rainey is a great Sun Belt back. He is clearly a very tough and durable running back, but I think his lack of top end speed for his size, is what hurt him in the recruiting rankings. I think he is too small to be a power back in the NFL, and not fast enough to be a speed back. It will be interesting to see how he does at the combines, and how that effects his draft status.

Small backs seem to be the new niche trend in the NFL. Woodhead of Patriots, Sproles of Saints. Rainey's best attributes for the NFL as a third down back are his ability to catch, ball security and kick returns. I could see him getting a strong opportunity from one of the Harbaugh brothers.

(12-11-2011 11:28 AM)CrushMI Wrote:  Small backs seem to be the new niche trend in the NFL. Woodhead of Patriots, Sproles of Saints. Rainey's best attributes for the NFL as a third down back are his ability to catch, ball security and kick returns. I could see him getting a strong opportunity from one of the Harbaugh brothers.

Rainey doesn't have the speed of a Sproles, or other small backs in the NFL. If you are going to be a small back and make it in the NFL, you have to have great speed and hands to catch out of the backfield. Just my opinion. I hope I'm wrong. I want him to succeed at the next level.

(12-11-2011 11:35 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(12-11-2011 11:28 AM)CrushMI Wrote:  Small backs seem to be the new niche trend in the NFL. Woodhead of Patriots, Sproles of Saints. Rainey's best attributes for the NFL as a third down back are his ability to catch, ball security and kick returns. I could see him getting a strong opportunity from one of the Harbaugh brothers.

Rainey doesn't have the speed of a Sproles, or other small backs in the NFL. If you are going to be a small back and make it in the NFL, you have to have great speed and hands to catch out of the backfield. Just my opinion. I hope I'm wrong. I want him to succeed at the next level.

Do you have stats to back that up? He looks fast to me. NFL stats are always padded.

(12-11-2011 03:56 AM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:28 PM)Franko Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 02:36 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(12-10-2011 10:26 AM)Franko Wrote:  We don't need to get too caught up in how many stars a player garners in high school to a degree. It doesn't always mean this player is going to be great. I do believe WKU had or have a couple of guys who only had 2 stars by their name, Rainey and Jackson. It is bascially something for forum posters to brag about.

True and not true. There are always five underrated players for every 50 but rainey is in no way one of the best in the nation nor doe these underrated 2 star players every win any national championships. Most the time the star rankings are spot on even though they have faults. Heck look at Matt Barkley, he was a five star recruit.

.
Explain why not?

Rainey - 369 attempts and 1695 yards rushing in the Sun Belt.
LaMicheal James- 222 attempts and 1646 rushing yards in the Pac-12.
Andre Ellington- 213 attempts and 1062 yards in the ACC
Joseph Randall - 198 attempts and 1193 yards in the Big 12
Montee Ball - 275 attempts and 1759 yards in the Big 10
Chandler Harrish (this guy is a QB) - 185 rushing attempts 1382 in the MAC.
Trent Richardson- 263 attempts and 1583 rushing yards in the SEC

To answer your question rainey literally has two seasons worth of carries this year against not exactly the best conference. There are still many guys like Chris Polk and Micheal Dyer ahead of him. Just about all these guys would have 2000 yards with the amount of carries Rainey got.

Yeah I'd have to agree with this. He is a fantastic back, but the above did more with less attemps, and against much better defenses. Hard to argue that. But I will say if he has anything going for him, its his durability. That's a lot of carries, good god.

Yeah I wasn't trying to call him out because like others said I would love to have him on our team. But we all need to get better as a league especially with recruiting.

(12-11-2011 12:11 PM)BlueRaiderFan. Wrote:  

(12-11-2011 11:35 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(12-11-2011 11:28 AM)CrushMI Wrote:  Small backs seem to be the new niche trend in the NFL. Woodhead of Patriots, Sproles of Saints. Rainey's best attributes for the NFL as a third down back are his ability to catch, ball security and kick returns. I could see him getting a strong opportunity from one of the Harbaugh brothers.

Rainey doesn't have the speed of a Sproles, or other small backs in the NFL. If you are going to be a small back and make it in the NFL, you have to have great speed and hands to catch out of the backfield. Just my opinion. I hope I'm wrong. I want him to succeed at the next level.

Do you have stats to back that up? He looks fast to me. NFL stats are always padded.

I have the fact that I've watched him play, and I didn't feel he had great breakaway speed. Hopefully he will prove me wrong and preform well at the combines.

Does anyone know how many 60 TD runs Rainey had posted at WKU?