rocketfootball Wrote:Other than the fact that Toledo wins games and has a better football tradition, what is the difference between Toledo and Buffalo? Toledo hosted Syracuse in 1999 and it had nothing to do with New York State legislature. What if Buffalo's football program improves like their basketball program has? They could win the MAC title within a few years. Would you then think different of Buffalo?

No offense because you do have a good football team, but most of us don't want to add Toledo either.

QUOTE (texasorange @ May 31 2005, 04:37 PM)
No way for Buffalo. Do you want to know the real difference between Buffalo and Toledo (except for the size)? It's called the Buffalo Bills.



"The Detroit Lions play 30 minutes from Toledo. Your point?"

My point is the University at Buffalo is in Buffalo with the Buffalo Bills. Toledo & Detroit were not the same city, nor are in the same state. By the way; what does a Toledo fan care anyway? You aren't Big East and may never will be. Is the MAC board so boring you feel a need to post here?
Adding Buffalo would be a sad, sad confirmation that the NBE is a mess. Adding Toledo would not be much better.

I'm glad some of you see Buffalo for what it is.

Buffalo is the flagship of the SUNY system -- New York's equivalent of Rutgers or Berkeley.

They've struggled with football, but I'm still proud to have 'em in the MAC.

I agree that Buffalo is not ready for the Big East right now but in a couple years that could all change. As someone already pointed out, they are just now getting 1A athletes to fill out the roster and football is on the way up. They've brought in a well known consultant just to make recommendations to jump start the program. Basketball has made huge strides and the games are now a big event on campus. I guarantee that if they played Big East teams at home on a regular basis the attendance at football games would be great. The Big East is very well known in Western NY and all the teams have name recognition. Many of the UB students are from the Big East "footprint".

B/T/W...UB sports has been around since 1894 and the nickname "BULLS" was adopted in 1931. The other Bulls...USF started their football program in what...1997?? USF even ripped off the U with the bull horns logo.

CollegeCard Wrote:

rocketfootball Wrote:Other than the fact that Toledo wins games and has a better football tradition, what is the difference between Toledo and Buffalo?  Toledo hosted Syracuse in 1999 and it had nothing to do with New York State legislature.  What if Buffalo's football program improves like their basketball program has?  They could win the MAC title within a few years.  Would you then think different of Buffalo?

No offense because you do have a good football team, but most of us don't want to add Toledo either.

No offense taken. I already said a week ago that Toledo doesn't have a shot. If you think I am posting over here to beg for Toledo you are wrong. For one thing, schools don't get invited into conferences by fans. This is just having fun talking about stuff.

texasorange Wrote:By the way; what does a Toledo fan care anyway? You aren't Big East and may never will be. Is the MAC board so boring you feel a need to post here?

If I didn't post over here than all the 'Cuse fans wouldn't be able to gloat about their 2-0 all-time record against Toledo.

cuseroc Wrote:I dont think there is any need to come up with a smart remark. The fact is that Toledo has never beaten Syracuse. Bringing up your resume as to the bcs teams that you have beaten really means nothing.

Where was the smart remark? I never denied that Syracuse is 2-0 lifetime against Toledo. That also doesn't mean that our win over Pittsburgh in 2003 was a blind squirrel finding a nut, which I pointed out.

Noone in the BE gloats over beating Toledo, maybe Rutgers. :snore:

cuseroc Wrote:Noone in the BE gloats over beating Toledo, maybe Rutgers. :snore:

Tell TexanMark that.

rocketfootball Wrote:

cuseroc Wrote:Noone in the BE gloats over beating Toledo, maybe Rutgers. :snore:

Tell TexanMark that.

Did I ever specifically gloat over beating Toledo in this thread? No

Gloating would be stating mediocre Syracuse teams killed Toledo by a combined score of 69-19 over those two games.

Now you are correct I have gloated... :wave:

Hey, as a newbie team in the league, we were pretty happy to beat Toledo in the Motor City Bowl. :)

I'm currently a student at Kent St, live in Rochester, and my dad has season tix for SU football. I really don't see any benefit for the BE to take UB. I don't see any reason UB could compete in football in the forseeable future. Right now they're stuck recuirting a lot of NYS (I saw my friend from Aquansis, undefeated and defending and eventual state champs that year get smocked by a lossing Canton McKinley team a few years back) kids who can't compete with areas like Ohio, W Pa, Fla, NJ ect. If they get decent in the MAC they could tap Ohio and W. Pa, and the series w/ Rutgers could help in NJ (though I don't think RU and SU would want any more competition in NJ recuirting).

They are the best and largest of the SUNY systeme, but they're not the designated flagship. Local billionare and Sarbes owner Tom Golisano othered to throw down some fat change if UB changed it's name to New York State Univeristy and pushed from them to go to the BE. However, the rest of the SUNY systeme would flip out with the establishment of a true flagship and SUNY was funding the ammount of cash needed to compete in the BE. I was thinking UB could start refering it's self to State University of New York, like UC-Berkley promotes its teams as California.

Facilities would be ok. UB Stadium seats 30K. Off the top of my head i think RU seats 35k so it wouldn't be much of an issue. It has a track that could be taken out if their was need to expand and I don't think it would be hard to add another or expand the current upper deck. Alumni Arena seats 6,000 and was renovated last year. Again it's kind of small, but a simular situation to RU or Nova's gym. Games could be moved the Ralph or HSBC if their was a real need.

If UB somehow did get a BE invite and got decent, SU would be in serious competition. Their would be a high potential for SU fans in Buffalo and Rochester to defect. Having a state school you could afford to go to or have your kids go to is more appealing than rooting for a school filled w/ rich kids from downstate and NJ. So SU would be smart to block a hypothetical move.

Coverage of UB in Rochester sucks a whole lot. Games get about a paragraph right up in Area Results that clump togeather teams like Brockport and Cortland. St. Bonna gets decent coverage despite having nothing of note happen sence the scandle, being located 2 hrs from Rochester, and having such small enrollment and therefor alumni when compared to UB. Canisus and Niagra get better coverage too. Might change if recent or near future alumni who experienced the b-ball upswing how now have an intrest in UB sports started to complain.

Very nice post funkmeister. What part of Rochester do you live in? I live iin the Northeast part of town on the city/Irondequoit border.

I forgot about golisano wanting to have Buffalo named new York St University. I think he offered like 20 million if they would change the name. That guy has too much money. I can help him spend it on better needs, namely mine. :D If he really wanted to help, why not push some of that money towards the proposed Big Apple Bowl?

The one thing that I take somewhat of an issue with is that I dont think there will be too many defectors from SU to Buffalo. Buffalo would have to get really good, and Cuse would have to get really bad. Buffalo will always be either 2nd or 3rd, after Army.

TexanMark Wrote:

rocketfootball Wrote:

cuseroc Wrote:Noone in the BE gloats over beating Toledo, maybe Rutgers. :snore:

Tell TexanMark that.

Did I ever specifically gloat over beating Toledo in this thread? No

Gloating would be stating mediocre Syracuse teams killed Toledo by a combined score of 69-19 over those two games.

Now you are correct I have gloated... :wave:

I only wish we could have played our home game against Syracuse in any season other than 1999. We went 6-5 that year by winning our last 4 games of the season when the head coach decided to give a young QB named Tavares Bolden a chance. He went on to go 24-3 as a starter at Toledo. Unfortunately the guy starting the first 7 games in 1999 went 2-5 and left the team at the end of the season......he was so bad he didn't even go to I-AA. 1999 was our worst season since the last time we didn't have a winning season which was 1993 or 1994. I would have loved to see that UT/Syracuse game in 2003 played in Toledo instead of at Syracuse. I know what you guys are going to say, but Toledo beats everyone at home and losses to teams like Ball State on the road.

We have gone into road games against Ball State ranked as high as 18th in the country and lost by over 30 points. I wish I could explain it, but our record on the road isn't very pretty and we have only lost 1 game at home in the last 5 years........that was to a very good Miami team (w/ Ben Roethlisberger).

FunkmasterFlash Wrote:St. Bonna gets decent coverage despite having nothing of note happen sence the scandle, being located 2 hrs from Rochester, and having such small enrollment and therefor alumni when compared to UB.

It helps that Bonaventure's radio network has a Rochester affiliate and that it plays a game at the War Memorial every other year.

Folks keep bringing up the fact that Louisville was not always successful. Do you think we would have been chosen to join the BE solely on our potential....I think not. We're not South Florida. Nobody is interested in Kentucky as a destination place to play or recruit. We had to put together a little history of success at least to get our foot in the door. It's been a long haul and a slow climb and no one was interested in us talking about our potential. So please stop bringing up what Louisville "was" to justify bringing dead beats into the Big East because of what they can become. When they do a little something on the field or courts....that's when they'll deserve consideration.

This has gone way too far. UB has no place in the Big East right now, anyone who says differently is looking at it with Blue and White colored glasses. Buffalo is fine in the MAC, the MAC is a good non-BCS league with alot more talent than people give them credit for, if buffalo can start to be consistant, i think they should stay, as it is a fine league which alot of people are starting to respect after all the talent it has been putting into the NFL.

Give Buffalo until 2010, than take a peek at where they are....if they are winning, think about it....and watch them another 5 more to show they can stay consistant....then and only then contemplate offering them.

BTW, here is a very important article about UB football and the future as reported on by Gene Corrigan, alot of Big East fans know the name already so i wont go into who he is. Its long, but a very good read, if you really are interested in all about Buffalo's athletic situation.

<a href='http://www.ubathletics.buffalo.edu/headlines/news/uba06-01-2005-report.shtml' target='_blank'>http://www.ubathletics.buffalo.edu/headlin...05-report.shtml</a>

rocketfootball Wrote:

CollegeCard Wrote:

rocketfootball Wrote:Other than the fact that Toledo wins games and has a better football tradition, what is the difference between Toledo and Buffalo?  Toledo hosted Syracuse in 1999 and it had nothing to do with New York State legislature.  What if Buffalo's football program improves like their basketball program has?  They could win the MAC title within a few years.  Would you then think different of Buffalo?

No offense because you do have a good football team, but most of us don't want to add Toledo either.

No offense taken. I already said a week ago that Toledo doesn't have a shot. If you think I am posting over here to beg for Toledo you are wrong. For one thing, schools don't get invited into conferences by fans. This is just having fun talking about stuff.

No, I assume you are just a college football fan in general as well.

FunkmasterFlash Wrote:I'm currently a student at Kent St, live in Rochester, and my dad has season tix for SU football. I really don't see any benefit for the BE to take UB. I don't see any reason UB could compete in football in the forseeable future. Right now they're stuck recuirting a lot of NYS (I saw my friend from Aquansis, undefeated and defending and eventual state champs that year get smocked by a lossing Canton McKinley team a few years back) kids who can't compete with areas like Ohio, W Pa, Fla, NJ ect. If they get decent in the MAC they could tap Ohio and W. Pa, and the series w/ Rutgers could help in NJ (though I don't think RU and SU would want any more competition in NJ recuirting).

They are the best and largest of the SUNY systeme, but they're not the designated flagship. Local billionare and Sarbes owner Tom Golisano othered to throw down some fat change if UB changed it's name to New York State Univeristy and pushed from them to go to the BE. However, the rest of the SUNY systeme would flip out with the establishment of a true flagship and SUNY was funding the ammount of cash needed to compete in the BE. I was thinking UB could start refering it's self to State University of New York, like UC-Berkley promotes its teams as California.

Facilities would be ok. UB Stadium seats 30K. Off the top of my head i think RU seats 35k so it wouldn't be much of an issue. It has a track that could be taken out if their was need to expand and I don't think it would be hard to add another or expand the current upper deck. Alumni Arena seats 6,000 and was renovated last year. Again it's kind of small, but a simular situation to RU or Nova's gym. Games could be moved the Ralph or HSBC if their was a real need.

If UB somehow did get a BE invite and got decent, SU would be in serious competition. Their would be a high potential for SU fans in Buffalo and Rochester to defect. Having a state school you could afford to go to or have your kids go to is more appealing than rooting for a school filled w/ rich kids from downstate and NJ. So SU would be smart to block a hypothetical move.

Coverage of UB in Rochester sucks a whole lot. Games get about a paragraph right up in Area Results that clump togeather teams like Brockport and Cortland. St. Bonna gets decent coverage despite having nothing of note happen sence the scandle, being located 2 hrs from Rochester, and having such small enrollment and therefor alumni when compared to UB. Canisus and Niagra get better coverage too. Might change if recent or near future alumni who experienced the b-ball upswing how now have an intrest in UB sports started to complain.

We seat 41,500 in our stadium. We seat 8300 in our BBall arena (apparently something was done that our new official capacity went up 300 seats.)

I live in Scottsville (south side, across the River from Henrietta and Rush if you don't know). Defecting from SU to UB would be a decades long process. I don't think UB is going anywhere to anywhere, so I wouldn't worry about it.

Part of the reason college football is not as big in the Northeast compared to the Midwest or South is that besides from PSU, and UConn very recently, the flagship State school's were not playing 1a football. Syracuse was my first love in college sports, but once I realized I couldn't afford it, it put a damper on my spirit. Ended up at a very nice mid-west school that was desperate for quailified out of state students and offered a lot of aid, and the rest is history.