Anyone watch the series premiere last night? Last night's episode was "What if the Nazis won WWII?"

I thought it was really interesting and I'm looking forward to future episodes, I can't remember what all they're taking on though, the only one I can remember was "What if dinosaurs survived extinction." That one sounds interesting, but I doubt it will be good as the Nazi episode. I don't want to ruin it for anyone who might watch, but in the Nazi episode they were citing specific examples of technology and other things the Nazis had that they didn't take advantage of that would have likely swung the war in their favor.

They're re-airing last night's episode pretty often over the next week, so set your DVRs, or you can watch it online. Alternate History

(08-25-2011 11:21 AM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  Anyone watch the series premiere last night? Last night's episode was "What if the Nazis won WWII?"

I thought it was really interesting and I'm looking forward to future episodes, I can't remember what all they're taking on though, the only one I can remember was "What if dinosaurs survived extinction." That one sounds interesting, but I doubt it will be good as the Nazi episode. I don't want to ruin it for anyone who might watch, but in the Nazi episode they were citing specific examples of technology and other things the Nazis had that they didn't take advantage of that would have likely swung the war in their favor.

They're re-airing last night's episode pretty often over the next week, so set your DVRs, or you can watch it online. Alternate History

Sounds pretty good, and right along my alley of TV. Thanks for the heads up

Reminds me of the Harry Turtledove alternate history books I read.

I will have to check it out as well.

(08-25-2011 11:21 AM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  Anyone watch the series premiere last night? Last night's episode was "What if the Nazis won WWII?"

I thought it was really interesting and I'm looking forward to future episodes, I can't remember what all they're taking on though, the only one I can remember was "What if dinosaurs survived extinction." That one sounds interesting, but I doubt it will be good as the Nazi episode. I don't want to ruin it for anyone who might watch, but in the Nazi episode they were citing specific examples of technology and other things the Nazis had that they didn't take advantage of that would have likely swung the war in their favor.

They're re-airing last night's episode pretty often over the next week, so set your DVRs, or you can watch it online. Alternate History

actually sounds interesting...I get tired of going to the History Channel and seeing Ice Road Truckers or some program about the end of the world according to the Mayans in 2012, or Chariot of the Gods type ancient aliens...

(08-25-2011 04:50 PM)SpaceRaider Wrote:  I get tired of going to the History Channel and seeing Ice Road Truckers or some program about the end of the world according to the Mayans in 2012, or Chariot of the Gods type ancient aliens...

tell me about it.

here is a movie based on the Harry Turtledove alternate history story of "If the South had won the Civil War."

(08-25-2011 08:44 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  here is a movie based on the Harry Turtledove alternate history story of "If the South had won the Civil War."

That's another one Alternate History will be doing.

(08-25-2011 08:44 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  here is a movie based on the Harry Turtledove alternate history story of "If the South had won the Civil War."

Glad you brought this up - I've seen it and it is pretty thought provoking - just couldn't remember the name of it.

personally I think the Turtledove book about the South winning is a bit far-fetched and very racist.

the reason the South held on to slavery so long is because machinery that could match and replace the labor output of the slave populace was not readily available. It is my opinion that slavery would have eventually been phased out regardless of the outcome of the Civil War. it would be cheaper in the long run to purchase newly created farm equipment that doesn't require housing, feeding, and guarding. Slavery would become more and more rare as farmers jumped on board with modernization.

and I don't want anyone to read in to this and think I am racist or an advocate for slavery. slavery is a black eye of our nation's history and something I consider to be embarressing. At the time however, it was the norm across the globe and those in this country who believed in it were not considered extremist in that day.

(08-26-2011 12:23 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  personally I think the Turtledove book about the South winning is a bit far-fetched and very racist.

the reason the South held on to slavery so long is because machinery that could match and replace the labor output of the slave populace was not readily available. It is my opinion that slavery would have eventually been phased out regardless of the outcome of the Civil War. it would be cheaper in the long run to purchase newly created farm equipment that doesn't require housing, feeding, and guarding. Slavery would become more and more rare as farmers jumped on board with modernization.

and I don't want anyone to read in to this and think I am racist or an advocate for slavery. slavery is a black eye of our nation's history and something I consider to be embarressing. At the time however, it was the norm across the globe and those in this country who believed in it were not considered extremist in that day.

It was a horrible thing that should have never happened, but a lot of people also lose focus and think that it was the only motivation for the civil war because it's become the most visible due largely to the inflammatory nature of slavery.

It should also be noted, that while it doesn't make it any better, we were far from the last country to utilize slave labor and many countries did not outlaw the practice until the twentieth century.

the Civil War (a.k.a. The War of Northern Aggression) was fought over the two ideologies of American politics that still exist today, where does the power lie? the States or the Fed. Unfortunantly, that truth is trumped by the fact that Lincoln used the issue of slavery (which we all agree was wrong) to unite the Northern States and give them a demonizing focus to turn Southerners in to "evil people" who "had to be stopped."

(08-26-2011 12:37 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  the Civil War (a.k.a. The War of Northern Aggression) was fought over the two ideologies of American politics that still exist today, where does the power lie? the States or the Fed. Unfortunantly, that truth is trumped by the fact that Lincoln used the issue of slavery (which we all agree was wrong) to unite the Northern States and give them a demonizing focus to turn Southerners in to "evil people" who "had to be stopped."

You should read "Team of Rivals", the Abraham Lincoln biography by Doris Kearns Goodwin. You would see that Lincoln did more than you think in terms of trying to hold the country together and did not demonize the South. He really was nearly as great a man as he is made out to be.
And the US was the last of the industrialized nations to outlaw slavery, decades behind most of the other modern nations of Europe. Definitely an embarrassment.
I read that Turtledove book years ago and I didn't think it racist at the time. I thought it very interesting that he had the leadership of the South coming to the conclusion on their own after the war that slavery needed to be ended.

here is another one of Turtledove's stories turned into film, this one concerning the Nazis winning WW2. It isn't a documentary style film like the Confederate State of American movie, it's more like a cop drama set in Nazi Europe in the 60's. Very entertaining and there are some recognizable faces playing major roles in it.

FYI

This CSA movie is a "mockumentary" written and directed by Kevin Willmott and has nothing to do with Guns of the South or Turtledove's 191 Timeline Series.

Fatherland is an HBO movie based off of Richard Harris's 1992 book of the same name. It has nothing to do with either Turtledove's Man with the Iron Heart or In the Presence of Mine Enemies.

To date none of Turtledove's works have gone past print.

(08-26-2011 06:03 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  FYI

This CSA movie is a "mockumentary" written and directed by Kevin Willmott and has nothing to do with Guns of the South or Turtledove's 191 Timeline Series.

Fatherland is an HBO movie based off of Richard Harris's 1992 book of the same name. It has nothing to do with either Turtledove's Man with the Iron Heart or In the Presence of Mine Enemies.

To date none of Turtledove's works have gone past print.

oh ok, well good stuff. my brother had shown these to me and told me they were Turtledove adaptations. since I never read the books I didn't know any better. thanks for the heads up.

they are both still interesting and along the same lines as this new Spike series.

(08-26-2011 12:58 PM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  

(08-26-2011 12:37 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  the Civil War (a.k.a. The War of Northern Aggression) was fought over the two ideologies of American politics that still exist today, where does the power lie? the States or the Fed. Unfortunantly, that truth is trumped by the fact that Lincoln used the issue of slavery (which we all agree was wrong) to unite the Northern States and give them a demonizing focus to turn Southerners in to "evil people" who "had to be stopped."

You should read "Team of Rivals", the Abraham Lincoln biography by Doris Kearns Goodwin. You would see that Lincoln did more than you think in terms of trying to hold the country together and did not demonize the South. He really was nearly as great a man as he is made out to be.
And the US was the last of the industrialized nations to outlaw slavery, decades behind most of the other modern nations of Europe. Definitely an embarrassment.
I read that Turtledove book years ago and I didn't think it racist at the time. I thought it very interesting that he had the leadership of the South coming to the conclusion on their own after the war that slavery needed to be ended.

What would college football be like today if the Great Emancipator had been able to get the freed slaves sent to British Empire colonies?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...onies.html

(08-27-2011 06:56 AM)WinstonTheWolf Wrote:  

(08-26-2011 12:58 PM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  

(08-26-2011 12:37 PM)Burn the Horse Wrote:  the Civil War (a.k.a. The War of Northern Aggression) was fought over the two ideologies of American politics that still exist today, where does the power lie? the States or the Fed. Unfortunantly, that truth is trumped by the fact that Lincoln used the issue of slavery (which we all agree was wrong) to unite the Northern States and give them a demonizing focus to turn Southerners in to "evil people" who "had to be stopped."

You should read "Team of Rivals", the Abraham Lincoln biography by Doris Kearns Goodwin. You would see that Lincoln did more than you think in terms of trying to hold the country together and did not demonize the South. He really was nearly as great a man as he is made out to be.
And the US was the last of the industrialized nations to outlaw slavery, decades behind most of the other modern nations of Europe. Definitely an embarrassment.
I read that Turtledove book years ago and I didn't think it racist at the time. I thought it very interesting that he had the leadership of the South coming to the conclusion on their own after the war that slavery needed to be ended.

What would college football be like today if the Great Emancipator had been able to get the freed slaves sent to British Empire colonies?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...onies.html

He was a man of his time in terms of his feelings of racial equality. I'm sure most people knew of his support to set up the country of Liberia in Africa as a place to send all the former slaves since he would rather they weren't in the USA. The changes he went through as the war progressed were quite remarkable. I really suggest giving that book a read.

ah Liberia, the paradise that never was.