(08-19-2011 06:24 PM)Paul M Wrote:  I see no difference in "family planning" and ending a life in the womb and deciding after 12 years "yeah, I can't do this" and pushing your child's head under water in the bathtub.

I don't want the government deciding family planning decisions for other people. Want one kid, 9 kids, 0 kids, your decision. I do want the government telling those who don't understand, we don't allow killing other people. Grandpa has Alzheimer, can't kill him. Wife has a stroke and can't wipe her ass, can't kill her. Don't want a child right now but can't be bothered with simple "planning", can't kill your baby.

So you support family planning education and funding including contraception? Just curious.

And of course, since we not in the process of government intervention, I assume you'd support repealing idiotic legislation that allows some crazy pharmacist (even those that work for others) to arbitrarily deny prescription filling if he or she wants to overrule the patients doctor using his/her religious beliefs.

If the above two items were better employed, then the number of abortions would fall. And if the GOP takes away funding for young mothers who can't afford them, then that will increase abortion.

And if someone can't afford health care, should they receive it anyway? And if not, how is that pro-life?

(08-19-2011 06:23 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  And for the record, Goldwater was a schmuck.

(08-19-2011 06:32 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Guy's........ I love the embarassed yourself angle btw. A fetus does not exhibit all the characteristics of life.

Yes it does.

You just don't understand what the terms mean.

Quote: Therefore it is not living. It's the same as a bud on a tree. It has the capability of life, but it's not there yet. NO IFS ANDS or BUTS about it. Ask any Biology professor.

And when we do, and you're wrong, what are you going to do?

(08-19-2011 06:41 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  So you support family planning education and funding including contraception? Just curious.

Yes

Quote:And of course, since we not in the process of government intervention, I assume you'd support repealing idiotic legislation that allows some crazy pharmacist (even those that work for others) to arbitrarily deny prescription filling if he or she wants to overrule the patients doctor using his/her religious beliefs.

Wait how is the government forcing someone to do something less intervention? Should a woman doctor who thinks that perfection in body images hurt girls be forced to do a breast augmentation? Should an African American be forced to rent to a clan member?

Not all flowers become buds. Not all buds become apples. Not all apples become trees. The answers that you seek should come from within. No one is going to convince you otherwise because it doesn't fit "your" pre concieved notions. Life is life. Human or an amoeba and the definition of life would still exist. I do agree that metabolism can be anabolic and catabolic in nature. However animals must catabolize before they can carry out any anabolic reaction. You are mistaken when you say "glucose" is not the basis for all foods. FATs "tri" glycerides has at it's basic element glucose. Proteins are basically glucose with Nitrogen. Your body breaks down organic molecules be they fats, proteins, or sugars into basically glucose. Humans in the first stage of respiration be it aerobic or anaerobic break down glucose through a process of glycolysis. From there in the prescence of oxygen it will enter the Krebs cycle where it will produce 4 ATP and many NADH and FADH2's. Those reduced carrier molecules will then enter the electron transport chain where they can generate up to 38 ATP. All of the catabolism comes from the mother. A blastopore or fetus can not catabolize on it's own. Hence and therefore it is not living.

(08-19-2011 07:36 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Not all flowers become buds. Not all buds become apples. Not all apples become trees. The answers that you seek should come from within.

Not all babies become toddlers, not all toddlers become children, not all children become adolescents, and not all adolescents become Adults...

Quote:I do agree that metabolism can be anabolic and catabolic in nature. However animals must catabolize before they can carry out any anabolic reaction.

And from the moment of conception the baby does both.

Quote:You are mistaken when you say "glucose" is not the basis for all foods. FATs "tri" glycerides has at it's basic element glucose. Proteins are basically glucose with Nitrogen.

Hydrogen sulfate is not, yet there are single cell organisms that survive on it. BTW Glucose is also the base of what the baby feeds off of from moment one.

Mach will define life. Anything outside his definition isn't life. Doesn't matter that he's wrong.

Gotcha.

babies....life....... toddlers...... life

fetus.... not life

Once the fetus can exhibit the seven characteristics of life. It's ALIVE.

Tell me at the moment of conception how a cell catabolizes. What metabolic pathway is it utilizing?

Wish there were some board, say an education board, where such incompetence could be reported.

Threatening someone's place of employment. You are a class act Paul. I believe you would. These are the type of actions that will encourage open discussion.

Wish there were some board, say an education board, where such incompetence could be reported.

1) All opinions are welcome in The Spin Room.

2) Threats against other NCAAbbs users or people not affiliated with NCAAbbs are not permitted and will result in an immediate ban and reporting to law enforcement if it is deemed necessary by the staff of NCAAbbs.



Paul you are the lowest form of a human being. I already know you have no interest in common courtesy. I have you on ignore for a reason, but this time you crossed the line.

(08-19-2011 08:13 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  babies....life....... toddlers...... life
fetus.... not life

LOL so now you're back to "not aive"

Quote:Once the fetus can exhibit the seven characteristics of life. It's ALIVE.

List your criteria please, clearly..

Quote:Tell me at the moment of conception how a cell catabolizes. What metabolic pathway is it utilizing?

I suggest you read "Cracking the egg: molecular dynamics and evolutionary aspects of the transition from the fully grown oocyte to embryo"

You do realize the embryo from teh moment of fertilization to the moment of implantation divides some hundreds of times over. That mitosis takes a great deal of energy, where do you think it comes from..

Bull,

I do appreciate you trying to have a "reasonable" discussion about this. As reasonable as one can be in such a heated topic. I don't feel comfortable now talking freely about this because I've been threatened. I believe the energy comes from the mother obviously. The oocyte is not utilizing any metabolic pathway. I do wonder though when mitochondria start working. Hypothetically they could be starting up early in that process. Good night.

(08-19-2011 08:40 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Wish there were some board, say an education board, where such incompetence could be reported.

1) All opinions are welcome in The Spin Room.

2) Threats against other NCAAbbs users or people not affiliated with NCAAbbs are not permitted and will result in an immediate ban and reporting to law enforcement if it is deemed necessary by the staff of NCAAbbs.



Paul you are the lowest form of a human being. I already know you have no interest in common courtesy. I have you on ignore for a reason, but this time you crossed the line.

Your a riot. Threating your punk ass?
I'm sure someone will be by shortly answering your PM to tell you to stop bothering them with your nonsense.

I have an extremely long memory for personal attacks from ******** like you. You can stop with playing the victim.

You are correct. I tried a couple of apologies and well wishes. Didn't work. No more courtesy for you.

(08-19-2011 08:48 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I don't feel comfortable now talking freely about this because I've been threatened.

Good grief, go change your diaper.

(08-19-2011 08:48 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Bull,

I do appreciate you trying to have a "reasonable" discussion about this. As reasonable as one can be in such a heated topic. I don't feel comfortable now talking freely about this because I've been threatened. I believe the energy comes from the mother obviously. The oocyte is not utilizing any metabolic pathway. I do wonder though when mitochondria start working. Hypothetically they could be starting up early in that process. Good night.

Mach, I understand wehre you're coming from but you're dead wrong.

The energy comes stored in the egg. If you want to make the case that its not metabolism because the mother (technically the mothers mother since a woman's eggs are formed in the womb) provided food storage to an embryo then you'll have to consider a baby who is breast fed as "not metabolizing"

The fertilized embryo receives no nutrients or energy until implantation (actually not till a bit after that but now were just nitpicking. There is no chemical nutrition in the fallopian tubes where cell mitosis begins, none, nada.. All that energy is stored in the egg and metabolized sans any input from mommy. Even if the embryo fails to implant it will continue to divide until it's expelled..

Paul,


Honestly. I don't want anything to do with you. I've spelled it out. You've crossed a line. You never threaten a person's place of employment. Do you think that fosters a place of healthy discussion. ESPECIALLY on a topic like this. I usually try to avoid them, but the Libertarian angle of this perplexes me. I don't understand how RP can be pro life but I surely can appreciate that he is. We are all entitled to our own opinion. Not our own facts. A fetus can not survive without the mother. A baby, a toddler, an adolescent can. I was trying to have this discussion until you threatened me. I don't understand it, but i don't feel as comfortable now as I did 30 minutes ago. You threatened my place of employment. I just wish you did your thing and let me do mine. I will NEVER comment on something you write. Never have I said. I wonder what Paul M thinks about this. Your opinion means nothing to me. However, you can threaten me and it will silence me. Three school board members are as pro life as you can be. I never talk about topics like this in public. WAY too toxic.

(08-19-2011 09:11 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  A fetus can not survive without the mother.

A limitation of technology... A diabetic can't survive without insulin, someone with kidney disease might need dialysis (sp?). Hell before the advent of formula (technology) a baby really could not survive with a mother to nurse them until they were arount 8 weeks old, and even then just barely.

And forget Paul, hes being a...

Again, stop with playing the victim. You f*cked with me. Threatening your place of employment? I said you suck at teaching. I've said it many times. As has many others. I'm not alone. And being incompetent isn't cause for termination in the education field. You know this. Stop feigning fear of losing your livelihood. Would have already happened if it were possible.

You sure do like to ramble on and on about having me on ignore. A little help since your incompetent. You actually can. I wrote the instructions, mainly for you, years ago.

http://ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=391601

You are correct Bull. I'm being an ass. Mach deserves it. He's not had a hard-on to screw with you. He got personal with me long ago.

Bull, your trying and I'm interfering. I'll move along.