No_Bull Wrote:Most rumors swirl arounf Western Ky going to the MAC along with Temple, but I also hear that Middle Tenn. would accept if offered...

Middle Tennessee has no desire to belong to a northern based conference. You will not see Middle Tennessee in the MAC with or without wku.

Quote:1) The Mac teams don't share any geographic or cultural fit with the southern CUSA teams. The Mac Folks seems to be endeared to the notion of "busing" to away games. The Mac's recruiting base isn't in the south. Thus that would be an ill-fitting marriage of the two.

See HerdZoned's answer which is pretty much the same as I would have said with these added comments:

You can't really define the MAC's recruiting base. Look at Toledo. In the last four recruiting classes, the five states that consist of most of our recruits are Ohio, Michigan, New York, Florida, and Pennsylvania. We have also averaged a couple of recruits per year from California, 1 to 2 recruits per year from Texas and Georgia, and we have got recruits from Alabama, Oklahoma, North Carolina, Kentucky, New Jersey (2 this year from NJ), Washington, Kansas, Indiana, Illinois, and Canada. We don't just recruit in our "geographical or cultural area." In fact, many MAC schools have been recruiting the states of Florida, Georgia, Mississippi, Texas, and Alabama for quite a few years now.

Of the 81 recruits in the past four years, 27 of them come from states that are considered "Southern states." That is one third of our recruits from where you don't think MAC schools do much recruiting.

western is going to them mac. dahbeed has it from a very good source. this will be an upgrade in football but the 'beed thinks it will hurt us initially in hoops. right now we recruit the south hard and a move to the mac will hurt that. plus it has the image of a bus league much like the ovc when we were in that conference. kids don't get excited about bus trips.

mark it down, western is going to the mac.

dahbeed Wrote:but the 'beed thinks it will hurt us initially in hoops.  right now we recruit the south hard and a move to the mac will hurt that.

Actually it should'nt if you make the move. The MAC has Kent, Western Mich. Eastern Mich. Central Mich. Toledo, Miami OH and Ohio that should be tough every year.

the 'beed didn't word that very well. right now our primary recruiter has connections all over the south. we have always had some very good players from georgia. it will be harder to get a kid from georgia when u tell him u will be playin' in ohio and michigan on a regular basis. right now we play teams in the south like middle, ualr, usa, asu, uno and fiu and the kids can relate to that. that said our 2 best players this year are from the hoosier daddy state.

'beed has no doubt that the competition in the mac hoops will be very good and the league could become a multi-invite league more years than not and the sun belt hasn't been that for awhile. when we moved to the belt it was an up and coming league and did get multi-invites but when charlotte and so. fla. and uab and such left it hurt the conference and we haven't had a multi-invites since dahbeed don't know when.

'beed actually thinks the belt is getting stronger every year in hoops but hoops ain't what's drivin this move. the pointy shaped ball is.

HerdZoned Wrote:

dahbeed Wrote:but the 'beed thinks it will hurt us initially in hoops.  right now we recruit the south hard and a move to the mac will hurt that.

Actually it should'nt if you make the move. The MAC has Kent, Western Mich. Eastern Mich. Central Mich. Toledo, Miami OH and Ohio that should be tough every year.

What makes you think they will win the MAC? They can't win in the Sun Belt now and according to everyone on Hillbilly Haven, the MAC is by far more superior to the SBC.

rocketfootball Wrote:See HerdZoned's answer which is pretty much the same as I would have said with these added comments:

You can't really define the MAC's recruiting base. Look at Toledo. In the last four recruiting classes, the five states that consist of most of our recruits are Ohio, Michigan, New York, Florida, and Pennsylvania.

Of the 81 recruits in the past four years, 27 of them come from states that are considered "Southern states." That is one third of our recruits from where you don't think MAC schools do much recruiting.

you are giving me two sets of facts that seem to be at odds here. You are telling me that most of your recruiting consists of midwestern (Ohio, Michigan) or Northeastern (New York, Penn) areas which to me would constitute a base, by then you also say 1/3 of your recruits are from southern states. those two statements seem at odds. I'm sure you're getting some great players from the south but without the bread and butter from those midwest and northeast areas you wouldn't be putting up the win totals you have.

I'm not trying to denigrate Toledo or the MAC or the Sunbelt. My perspective is drawn from the experience ECU has had in CUSA. It has been tough for an ECU crowd to get excited about playing a Houston or TCU (and vice versa, I'm sure) when that team is half the country away from us, that we will never travel to. Toledo has an excellent football team but I'm sure the same would be true if they were to join CUSA.

Cajunman02 Wrote:

HerdZoned Wrote:

dahbeed Wrote:but the 'beed thinks it will hurt us initially in hoops.  right now we recruit the south hard and a move to the mac will hurt that.

Actually it should'nt if you make the move. The MAC has Kent, Western Mich. Eastern Mich. Central Mich. Toledo, Miami OH and Ohio that should be tough every year.

What makes you think they will win the MAC? They can't win in the Sun Belt now and according to everyone on Hillbilly Haven, the MAC is by far more superior to the SBC.

Where in my post did I say they would win The MAC

HerdZoned Wrote:

Cajunman02 Wrote:

HerdZoned Wrote:

dahbeed Wrote:but the 'beed thinks it will hurt us initially in hoops.  right now we recruit the south hard and a move to the mac will hurt that.

Actually it should'nt if you make the move. The MAC has Kent, Western Mich. Eastern Mich. Central Mich. Toledo, Miami OH and Ohio that should be tough every year.

What makes you think they will win the MAC? They can't win in the Sun Belt now and according to everyone on Hillbilly Haven, the MAC is by far more superior to the SBC.

Where in my post did I say they would win The MAC

Your right. I should have said "What makes you think they will win IN the MAC?" That's what I was aiming for. You mention some very good basketball teams in the MAC, but you don't think playing those teams will hurt WKY's chances for an at-large bid. That's what WKY wants; a chance to get into the tourney if they don't win the conference. The last time I checked, you still had to win games in the conference to get an at-large bid. WKY is having trouble winning in the Sun Belt, so what makes you think they can games against the mentioned teams?

No, what our administration wants is increased revenue. The MAC will provide increased media exposure which equates to $$$$$$$$$$. That is what this is about.....$$$$$. If Temple comes on board in BB there might be a chance for an at-large but if we just wanted to increase our chances of an at-large we would have joined the MVC. THIS IS ABOUT MONEY. MONEY. MONEY MONEY. MONEY.

Cajunman02 Wrote:Your right. I should have said "What makes you think they will win IN the MAC?" That's what I was aiming for.

Everyone wants a chance to move up in the "Food Chain", and truth be told if you look at the next round of conf moves WKU may try and set themselves up for a shot at CUSA. It may not be all about basketball. You have to look at the bigger picture, and how the "Food Chain" went this time.

ACC
BE
CUSA--------MWC
MAC

SUNBELT
I-AA

So if WKU jumps to the MAC and start to get a fan base they may set thereself up to be a possible canidate for the next round. You can't just look at the basketball program.

MAC and Sun Belt TV revenue is nearly identical.

The only edge the MAC has in revenue is basketball units from tournament wins. However unlike the Sun Belt, the MAC uses that revenue to help pay for marketing agreements with bowls. Based on what I've learned, the MAC used nearly $800,000 of that revenue to get Miami in the Independence Bowl, and paid more to the Silicon Valley than the Sun Belt did, except the Sun Belt didn't pick up that cost, Movie Gallery came in and picked it up.

Since we have non-football members the Sun Belt will not and cannot use basketball revenue to support football ventures.

cajunman02, u keep using snide little comments about we can't win in the conference now. the conference season is only half over. u drink some serious hater juice on western. is it because of the dominance of 3 straight conference titles from 01-03?

'beed will type this very slow so u can try to understand where our program is right now. it's in transition. darrin horn inherited a dennis felton slow plodding, pound it down low team last year. our defense was terrible. this ended up in a 15-13 year. nobody was happy but we understood. darrin played on the sweet 16 team that was built for pressing and trapping and 3 point shooting. it's amazing that he has transformed them in his second year into something that resembles this now. u don't seem to be old enough to remember the horn teams. 'beed bets that puppet face marty fletcher remembers them.

we only lose one player off of this team and have some very highly regarded recruits and transfers coming in. what has killed us this year is the lack of a power forward. we thought we had one but even though he had his core requirements and had passed his act he had failed one section of the ga. exit exam. this kid was a stud and the coaching staff thought he was as good if not better than courtney lee. so now we get to play a 6'4 two guard, anthony winchester at the four spot. it is killin us inside.

u keep on hatin'. remind dahbeed of the last win ya'll had in the ncaa........still waitin'. the toppers will be back on top, and every time u see western on the winning end of a score remember about that wise ole hilltopper poster that told u so.

'beed don't know if this move to the mac will be the end all. like another poster said, it could be positioning for the next round of moves. what dahbeed does know is that the current university president and a.d. do have vision. u should see the transformation that president ransdell has done to the campus, then diddle and now maybe this move. who knows if it will work out but if ransdell wants it to happen it will happen. he's an incredible prez that loves his alma mater and would never do something to harm it.

GQPirate Wrote:

rocketfootball Wrote:See HerdZoned's answer which is pretty much the same as I would have said with these added comments:

You can't really define the MAC's recruiting base.  Look at Toledo.  In the last four recruiting classes, the five states that consist of most of our recruits are Ohio, Michigan, New York, Florida, and Pennsylvania. 

Of the 81 recruits in the past four years, 27 of them come from states that are considered "Southern states."  That is one third of our recruits from where you don't think MAC schools do much recruiting.

you are giving me two sets of facts that seem to be at odds here. You are telling me that most of your recruiting consists of midwestern (Ohio, Michigan) or Northeastern (New York, Penn) areas which to me would constitute a base, by then you also say 1/3 of your recruits are from southern states. those two statements seem at odds. I'm sure you're getting some great players from the south but without the bread and butter from those midwest and northeast areas you wouldn't be putting up the win totals you have.

I'm not trying to denigrate Toledo or the MAC or the Sunbelt. My perspective is drawn from the experience ECU has had in CUSA. It has been tough for an ECU crowd to get excited about playing a Houston or TCU (and vice versa, I'm sure) when that team is half the country away from us, that we will never travel to. Toledo has an excellent football team but I'm sure the same would be true if they were to join CUSA.

I included Florida as one of the top states........Florida is in the South.


I said 33.5% of our recruits come from Southern states, therefore a larger portion, 66.5% come from the East and Midwest.

theboro Wrote:I don't think anyone outside of UNT would want to join C-USA.

It's a Texas League.

ECU - North Carolina
Marshall - West Virginia
Memphis - Tennessee
UAB - Alabama
UCF - Florida
Southern Miss - Mississippi
Tulane - Louisianna
Tulsa - Oklahoma

That sure sounds like a Texas League to me.

Yes there are four texas teams but to of those are small private schools and two are large state schools. Even if they formed a coalition and wanted to rule the league they only have 33% of the votes. This aint the SWC with only one non texas member. also, while highly unlikely, Texas retains the option of splinting into as many as five states if they so desire. If that were to happen Houston and Rice would be in one state, SMU in another, and UTEP in a third. CUSA could end up with a 12 team eleven state conference without any change of membership.