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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribal - 10-12-2020 02:21 PM

(10-12-2020 01:39 PM)Old tribe Wrote:  
(10-12-2020 12:14 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  Declining philanthropy contributed to W&M budget woes, decision to cut sports. John O'Connor
https://richmond.com/sports/college/william-and-mary/declining-philanthropy-contributed-to-w-m-budget-woes-decision-to-cut-sports/article_aea550b4-aedb-50e6-a830-2110a0b38430.html

After reading this article, it appears that perhaps the withheld donations resulted in some unintended consequences. The same thing is going to happen in the future if people continue to withhold donations. The sports other than football and basketball are going to be the ones that suffer the most.
You'd better increase your donations then.


Withholding donations and voicing concerns finally moved the problem out of W&M Athletics. Well worth collateral damage.

Suddenly couldn't raise money for mbb...just last year and last year alone. Gee, I wonder why? Who took the independent decision to fire Shaver. This is all Huge's fault. Time to rebuild.

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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - nj alum - 10-12-2020 02:34 PM

(10-12-2020 01:39 PM)Old tribe Wrote:  
(10-12-2020 12:14 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  Declining philanthropy contributed to W&M budget woes, decision to cut sports. John O'Connor
https://richmond.com/sports/college/william-and-mary/declining-philanthropy-contributed-to-w-m-budget-woes-decision-to-cut-sports/article_aea550b4-aedb-50e6-a830-2110a0b38430.html

After reading this article, it appears that perhaps the withheld donations resulted in some unintended consequences. The same thing is going to happen in the future if people continue to withhold donations. The sports other than football and basketball are going to be the ones that suffer the most.

I wouldn’t call the resignation of the AD an unintended consequence for some.

Moving on ... I thought this was a structural problem that started before March, 2019? Yes or no?

To blame this on something that happened a little over a year ago would be like blaming the Shaver firing on a first round loss to Delaware.

Finally, wake up! Football and hoops are catching a lot of heat because decades-old tensions have been unleashed. It is in the interests of ALL sports to solve this NOW. Patriot and/or D-3 are being talked about in the community more and more because D-1 is an absolute money pit.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - nj alum - 10-12-2020 02:44 PM

Look, the College has framed the issue: sustainability of all sports in the framework of D-1, budget, and TitleIX.

The issue is deeper. The issue is that D-1 is not sustainable ... for all but maybe a dozen schools. When you have PAC and BIG schools cutting sports, that means D-1 is not working for the big boys. It sure as heck isn’t going to work for the College.

D-1 needs complete reformation.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Blow Gym rat - 10-12-2020 02:45 PM

(10-12-2020 01:39 PM)Old tribe Wrote:  After reading this article, it appears that perhaps the withheld donations resulted in some unintended consequences. The same thing is going to happen in the future if people continue to withhold donations. The sports other than football and basketball are going to be the ones that suffer the most.

Now that “For the Bold” has run its course, they’re probably looking for a new fundraising slogan.

“Give us your money or we’ll shoot this kitten” has a nice ring to it....

Fortunately I’m more of a dog guy, so it won’t work on me.

Maybe something more like, “Nice little tennis team ya got here. Be a shame if sumptin’ happened to it ...”


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - zablenoise - 10-12-2020 02:55 PM

(10-12-2020 02:34 PM)nj alum Wrote:  Moving on ... I thought this was a structural problem that started before March, 2019? Yes or no?

That's the $64,000 question. Exactly how much of the budget shortfall is due to donation drop offs during Huge's tenure and are those donations coming back?

Either way, NJ is right that we need to build a sustainable funding/allocation model that won't just get us through this crisis but is robust enough to get us through the next crisis as well.


W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribal - 10-12-2020 03:16 PM

How to give: https://giving.wm.edu/give-now/?appealcode=XX400&allocation=0200




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W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribal - 10-12-2020 06:43 PM

Most sports saw double-digit decrease in giving. WBB and a few of the cut 7, did not. MBB, following firing Shaver, fell quite a bit. I'm sorry to see baseball take such a big hit.

I hope it doesn't take 5+ years to recover from a Huge disaster. Make no mistake, fans love our main teams but couldn't make themselves give to anything tied to Hurricane Sammy.

[Image: f94ef745da552b90fc3ce2728710b2a1.jpg]

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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - WMInTheBurg - 10-12-2020 06:58 PM

(10-12-2020 02:45 PM)Blow Gym rat Wrote:  
(10-12-2020 01:39 PM)Old tribe Wrote:  After reading this article, it appears that perhaps the withheld donations resulted in some unintended consequences. The same thing is going to happen in the future if people continue to withhold donations. The sports other than football and basketball are going to be the ones that suffer the most.

Now that “For the Bold” has run its course, they’re probably looking for a new fundraising slogan.

“Give us your money or we’ll shoot this kitten” has a nice ring to it....

Fortunately I’m more of a dog guy, so it won’t work on me.

Maybe something more like, “Nice little tennis team ya got here. Be a shame if sumptin’ happened to it ...”

What about "Look, she's gone now okay? W&M 2021"


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribe32 - 10-12-2020 07:19 PM

She pissed so many people off, I can't tell you how many. Go ask the big givers close to Shaver. Me, a strong giver for years was treated like a nobody by her and Henderson. One of my friends in the Tribe Club apologized. I will give you some leading indicators of how bad it was with her in charge:

1) Gold lot for football used to be something that you couldn't get unless you were high on the list. Last year it was a third full for every game except homecoming when it was 2/3 full. The end of the season it was mostly empty. The party line was that the pass holders were protesting. When I found out that nobody wanted to renew and they simply didn't resell in hope that people would come back this year I almost puked.

2) 50 yard line seats for football. Comfy chairs had people, maybe 2/3. My section in the level below was a third full. Student athletes sat in the open seats. Those are premium seats.

What happened? Come on. We know Laycock was forced to retire. What a joke. People were upset.

She caused so much destruction that we will probably never recover. Given the financial situation, we may actually be forced to go D3 because of her. At least we will have a new basketball arena.

ONCE LONG TIME FANS AND ALUMNI DECIDE TO WALK AWAY, THEY DON'T COME BACK.........WAKE UP.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - zablenoise - 10-12-2020 07:38 PM

(10-12-2020 07:19 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  She caused so much destruction that we will probably never recover. Given the financial situation, we may actually be forced to go D3 because of her. At least we will have a new basketball arena.

ONCE LONG TIME FANS AND ALUMNI DECIDE TO WALK AWAY, THEY DON'T COME BACK.........WAKE UP.

Well this got dark

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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Biggjohn43 - 10-12-2020 07:42 PM

(10-12-2020 07:19 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  She pissed so many people off, I can't tell you how many. Go ask the big givers close to Shaver. Me, a strong giver for years was treated like a nobody by her and Henderson. One of my friends in the Tribe Club apologized. I will give you some leading indicators of how bad it was with her in charge:

1) Gold lot for football used to be something that you couldn't get unless you were high on the list. Last year it was a third full for every game except homecoming when it was 2/3 full. The end of the season it was mostly empty. The party line was that the pass holders were protesting. When I found out that nobody wanted to renew and they simply didn't resell in hope that people would come back this year I almost puked.

2) 50 yard line seats for football. Comfy chairs had people, maybe 2/3. My section in the level below was a third full. Student athletes sat in the open seats. Those are premium seats.

What happened? Come on. We know Laycock was forced to retire. What a joke. People were upset.

She caused so much destruction that we will probably never recover. Given the financial situation, we may actually be forced to go D3 because of her. At least we will have a new basketball arena.

ONCE LONG TIME FANS AND ALUMNI DECIDE TO WALK AWAY, THEY DON'T COME BACK.........WAKE UP.

I share your observations about snubbing you. She did the same thing to me at a basketball gams when she came up the stairs on the way to the Pearson room. Everyone around me was as zho med as I was. That lost any respect I had for her!!


W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribal - 10-12-2020 07:43 PM

No use in looking back. I hereby swear to never mention Huge again. I hope she can't get an assistant basketball coaching gig at a public HS. She us dead to me.

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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - nj alum - 10-12-2020 08:12 PM

(10-12-2020 06:43 PM)Tribal Wrote:  Most sports saw double-digit decrease in giving. WBB and a few of the cut 7, did not. MBB, following firing Shaver, fell quite a bit. I'm sorry to see baseball take such a big hit.

I hope it doesn't take 5+ years to recover from a Huge disaster. Make no mistake, fans love our main teams but couldn't make themselves give to anything tied to Hurricane Sammy.

[Image: f94ef745da552b90fc3ce2728710b2a1.jpg]

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So, we’re cutting three of our top five sports in terms of donations?

Can someone please explain the logic of this.

If we’re going to stir the hornet’s nest, shouldn’t we be cutting the bottom seven sports in terms of donations?


W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribal - 10-12-2020 08:42 PM

Tennis, VB, LAX and golf cost very little but lose money. Seems they'd be the sports to cut if trimming programs is the motive. Title 9 issues if W&M cut just those. W&M would have to cut MSoc or baseball to break even on the #s.

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RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - nj alum - 10-12-2020 08:52 PM

Oh, I get it.

They cut three of the top five sports in terms of donations.

In other words, sports with significant donor involvement.

And just like post 629, donor relations has hit rock-bottom the past couple of years, and no one in a position of authority seemed to care.

First, let’s tick off the Laycock folks. For an encore, let’s tick off the Shaver folks. That takes care of our two big sports.

Now, let’s go for the rest of the top 5, and cut those sports, and tick off the remainder of the donor base.

Hello?

Just have to ask- has all of this this been intentional financial suicide? Or sheer incompetence?


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - nj alum - 10-12-2020 09:04 PM

And to add another thought ...

The old “looked under every rock” ...

Three of the top five in terms of donations ... very active donor bases ... very generous donor bases ... and zero attempt to go to those donor bases, and give them a charge to save their programs.

Just ... incomprehensible!


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - A Quest Called Tribe - 10-12-2020 09:41 PM

Full disclosure, I am not a licensed CPA. However, I think those really big numbers in red are bad.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribe3455 - 10-12-2020 09:56 PM

Just a note about the numbers. Why are M and W swimming and M and W golf lumped together on this chart but M and W soccer separate? Track, gymnastics, tennis, same thing...separate.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribe4SF - 10-13-2020 06:37 AM

(10-12-2020 09:56 PM)Tribe3455 Wrote:  Just a note about the numbers. Why are M and W swimming and M and W golf lumped together on this chart but M and W soccer separate? Track, gymnastics, tennis, same thing...separate.

Swimming and golf have a shared team budget and shared coaching staffs.


RE: W&M Cuts 7 Sports - Tribe3455 - 10-13-2020 08:44 AM

(10-13-2020 06:37 AM)Tribe4SF Wrote:  
(10-12-2020 09:56 PM)Tribe3455 Wrote:  Just a note about the numbers. Why are M and W swimming and M and W golf lumped together on this chart but M and W soccer separate? Track, gymnastics, tennis, same thing...separate.

Swimming and golf have a shared team budget and shared coaching staffs.

Got it. Thanks. So Golf raised more money per student-athlete than swimming and would, logically, cost less in other overhead costs. Less training staff needed. less academic support (though both, especially swimming have great students), less weight room needs, etc. And twice as many teams compete in the CAA (and around the country) in golf than in swimming. I'm not going to deep dive into the numbers of every sport but the decision between the two sports here make sense to me. The impressive fundraising number LAST year to me was men's gymnastics. But there just aren't enough schools competing.