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RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 07-26-2016 09:11 AM
(07-26-2016 08:27 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: I agree the move makes sense for both parties IMO. Cubs arguably duplicated the Yanks model of "get me through 6" and now have Strop/Rondon/ Chappy as a pretty lethal 7,8,9. And they were able to get him without giving up any of their MLB ready young talent.
Yep. People sometimes want to always claim one side "ripped off" another in every trade, when sometimes there are actually trades where both sides get an "A". This could be one of them.
Reminds me of the Mets-Tigers trade last year. The pitcher the Tigers got in the deal was one of the Mets top prospects at the time, righty Michael Fulmer, who is currently 9-2 with a 2.71 ERA in the bigs and a top rookie of the year candidate for Detroit. Meanwhile, Cespedes led the Mets to the World Series last year, and they were able to keep him around at least one additional season. Both teams have to get an "A" for that trade.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - bricksnivy - 07-26-2016 09:54 AM
I've read a lot of different opinions, and I appreciated this perspective. The Yankees "won" the trade, but the Cubs were in it to win games. They had two different objectives, so SNO08, to your point, both can win.
A lot of Cubs writers think Chicago will make one more move for an outfielder, to compensate for how awful Heyward has been. Reddick seems like the most obvious target.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 07-26-2016 10:54 AM
(07-26-2016 09:54 AM)bricksnivy Wrote: I've read a lot of different opinions, and I appreciated this perspective. The Yankees "won" the trade, but the Cubs were in it to win games. They had two different objectives, so SNO08, to your point, both can win.
A lot of Cubs writers think Chicago will make one more move for an outfielder, to compensate for how awful Heyward has been. Reddick seems like the most obvious target.
Agree. And this will help the Cubs immediately, whereas, the help to the Yanks will be in the future after people long forget the trade.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 07-26-2016 11:20 AM
(07-26-2016 09:54 AM)bricksnivy Wrote: I've read a lot of different opinions, and I appreciated this perspective. The Yankees "won" the trade, but the Cubs were in it to win games. They had two different objectives, so SNO08, to your point, both can win.
Exactly. And while a lot of teams have made trades in an effort to "win now", not all trades are made equal. Sometimes you can tell before a guy even arrives that it was a bad decision to deal for him. This is not one of those situations. Getting a guy with a unique skillset like Chapman's is rarely a bad call.
Now, I can understand the ethical/moral argument a lot more. It's the same reason I was reluctant to support the Mets signing Jose Reyes. It kind of sucks that men who beat women can still find work if they have talent. My preference would be that ALL of them become unemployed to send a firm message. A lot of people praise NFL teams for not signing Ray Rice, but the simple truth is his play was declining steeply, and the pros did not outweigh the cons. Had Ray Rice hit his wife, say, in 2010, there'd have been teams lining up to sign him once the situation "blew over."
But that's not a knock on the Cubs. It's a knock on how money and wins can trump just about everything. Michael Vick killed dogs but got a $100M+ contract a few years later. Ben Roethlisberger and Kobe Bryant probably had non-consensual sex with women, yet the former got off with a slap on the wrist, and the latter got a farewell tour and is widely considered one of the top 10-15 players in NBA history, with barely a mention anymore of what happened in that Colorado hotel room. Unless your name is Aaron Hernandez, you can pretty much get a 2nd chance every time if you have talent.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - bricksnivy - 07-26-2016 01:15 PM
(07-26-2016 11:20 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote: Now, I can understand the ethical/moral argument a lot more. It's the same reason I was reluctant to support the Mets signing Jose Reyes. It kind of sucks that men who beat women can still find work if they have talent. My preference would be that ALL of them become unemployed to send a firm message. A lot of people praise NFL teams for not signing Ray Rice, but the simple truth is his play was declining steeply, and the pros did not outweigh the cons. Had Ray Rice hit his wife, say, in 2010, there'd have been teams lining up to sign him once the situation "blew over."
I agree. Not sure who said it, but that is the danger with professional sports. Eventually, your team will be the team employing the person with character issues.
You're right on with Rice too. Just look at the difference between Hardy and Rice. I suppose I'm part of the problem. If John Lackey is starting game 7 of the WS, and Chapman comes in to close it out, I'll be the biggest hypocrite.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 07-26-2016 02:02 PM
(07-26-2016 01:15 PM)bricksnivy Wrote: I agree. Not sure who said it, but that is the danger with professional sports. Eventually, your team will be the team employing the person with character issues.
You're right on with Rice too. Just look at the difference between Hardy and Rice. I suppose I'm part of the problem. If John Lackey is starting game 7 of the WS, and Chapman comes in to close it out, I'll be the biggest hypocrite.
That was me that said it, haha.
The only team I don't withhold criticism from are the Cowboys. It seemed like they were collecting awful personalities for a while there. I can accept when a team signs one guy like a Chapman, Reyes, etc, because its really just part of sports at this point. The most successful teams out there tend to have 1-2 sociopaths on them. Just look at Jerome Harrison for the Steelers.
But when you get to a point where you're making a habit of signing sociopaths....you've gone down the wrong path and deserve all the criticism you get.
2016 MLB Thread - B_Hawk06 - 07-26-2016 10:10 PM
The Cowboys are their own anomaly, if you even want to call it that. Jerry Jones runs an absolute circus. He loves collecting anyone that will give him media attention. For example, signing the homosexual dude last year or the year before that couldn't hack it with the Rams in training camp.
It almost makes you feel sorry for Tony Romo, a guy who has put up with a lot of undue (not all, but a lot) criticism from stupid "America's Team" fans that don't understand the majority of that team's problems rest on the unethical dealings of Jerry Jones.
Sorry. Didn't mean to entirely change the subject I just felt it there for a minute.
Go Cubs.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 07-27-2016 07:42 AM
Jerry Jones: Making rational people actually sympathize with Tony Romo since 2006.
That says something about how awful an owner he is.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 07-27-2016 08:50 AM
If you are a Cowboy hater, you should like "NFL Memes" on facebook. They are the favorite target. (08, seems like you like to hate them, and i know you hate the Pats) you'd really like them Pats are prob favorite target #2
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 07-27-2016 10:22 AM
(07-27-2016 08:50 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: If you are a Cowboy hater, you should like "NFL Memes" on facebook. They are the favorite target. (08, seems like you like to hate them, and i know you hate the Pats) you'd really like them Pats are prob favorite target #2
I hate teams full of cheaters and thugs. The Patriots qualify in both categories, the Cowboys in the latter.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 08-01-2016 12:14 PM
Mets are about to acquire OF Jay Bruce from the Reds for OF Brandon Nimmo and 2 low-level prospects.
The expectation with this move is that Cespedes will be leaving via free agency this offseason.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 08-03-2016 09:01 AM
(08-01-2016 12:14 PM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote: Mets are about to acquire OF Jay Bruce from the Reds for OF Brandon Nimmo and 2 low-level prospects.Really? Because Bruce couldn't hold Cespey's jock!
The expectation with this move is that Cespedes will be leaving via free agency this offseason.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 08-03-2016 09:06 AM
(08-03-2016 09:01 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: Really? Because Bruce couldn't hold Cespey's jock!
Cespedes has an opt-out in his deal with the Mets following this season. It's very likely he'll test free agency again. The Mets would also get another 1st round pick if he walks (like they did with Murphy).
Couple that with the fact that Bruce's deal comes with a $13M club option for 2017, which is relatively cheap, plus the fact that the Mets will likely need to extend Neil Walker's deal after trading away 2B Dilson Herrera, and the writing is on the wall: Ces will be gone.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 08-03-2016 09:13 AM
(08-03-2016 09:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:I tend to agree that Cespy will test the FA market especially after the years he is having. That said, one of the biggest busts in the last 10 years is a less than adequate replacement IMO.(08-03-2016 09:01 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: Really? Because Bruce couldn't hold Cespey's jock!
Cespedes has an opt-out in his deal with the Mets following this season. It's very likely he'll test free agency again. The Mets would also get another 1st round pick if he walks (like they did with Murphy).
Couple that with the fact that Bruce's deal comes with a $13M club option for 2017, which is relatively cheap, plus the fact that the Mets will likely need to extend Neil Walker's deal after trading away 2B Dilson Herrera, and the writing is on the wall: Ces will be gone.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 08-03-2016 09:50 AM
(08-03-2016 09:13 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: I tend to agree that Cespy will test the FA market especially after the years he is having. That said, one of the biggest busts in the last 10 years is a less than adequate replacement IMO.
Which bust are you talking about? Jay Bruce is leading the NL in RBI....
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 08-03-2016 10:12 AM
(08-03-2016 09:50 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:(08-03-2016 09:13 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: I tend to agree that Cespy will test the FA market especially after the years he is having. That said, one of the biggest busts in the last 10 years is a less than adequate replacement IMO.
Which bust are you talking about? Jay Bruce is leading the NL in RBI....
He's a career .249 hitter who has been touted as the next big thing for years. He's playing in a park that gives up about a quarter less of a HR per game now. His Defense is a liability, his Dwar has been horrible.
So you can pick out your one stat, I'll take the rest
And if you did like the trade, and it sounds like you did, out of the 5 friends i have that our Mets fans you are the only one.
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 08-03-2016 10:14 AM
(08-03-2016 10:12 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: He's a career .249 hitter who has been touted as the next big thing for years. He's playing in a park that gives up about a quarter less of a HR per game now. His Defense is a liability, his Dwar has been horrible.
So you can pick out your one stat, I'll take the rest
And if you did like the trade, and it sounds like you did, out of the 5 friends i have that our Mets fans you are the only one.
Jeez, someone is overly critical. I thought the move was pretty "meh" at the time, and that he's a decent consolation prize if Cespedes walks as expected. The Mets have been among the worst teams in baseball at batting with runners in scoring position, and we just got a guy with 80 RBI's. So to all the other stuff you said about him....meh.
But if you're gonna go out of your way to rip it this much, I like it a lot more now!
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 08-03-2016 10:24 AM
(08-03-2016 10:14 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:Ha! There was talk of him coming to the Yankees before and i wanted no part of him.(08-03-2016 10:12 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: He's a career .249 hitter who has been touted as the next big thing for years. He's playing in a park that gives up about a quarter less of a HR per game now. His Defense is a liability, his Dwar has been horrible.
So you can pick out your one stat, I'll take the rest
And if you did like the trade, and it sounds like you did, out of the 5 friends i have that our Mets fans you are the only one.
But if you're gonna go out of your way to rip it this much, I like it a lot more now!
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawk Nation 08 - 08-03-2016 01:43 PM
(08-03-2016 10:24 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: Ha! There was talk of him coming to the Yankees before and i wanted no part of him.
Well for the first time in decades, and about 6 years overdue from doing so, the Yankees were sellers this year. And made out like bandits with the haul they got. So yeah, Bruce wouldn't fit what you were doing even if you liked him....
RE: 2016 MLB Thread - Seahawkhoops - 08-04-2016 06:53 AM
(08-03-2016 01:43 PM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:The talk was before this year. I do however agree they made out very well. I'm actually happy ownership let Cashman do his job for once.(08-03-2016 10:24 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote: Ha! There was talk of him coming to the Yankees before and i wanted no part of him.
Well for the first time in decades, and about 6 years overdue from doing so, the Yankees were sellers this year. And made out like bandits with the haul they got. So yeah, Bruce wouldn't fit what you were doing even if you liked him....