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+---- Thread: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy (/thread-698185.html)
Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - GaStPanthers - 08-12-2014 09:47 AM
http://mrcollegefootball.blog.ajc.com/2014/08/10/will-autonomy-obannon-ruling-change-college-football/
I've totally lost respect for the so called "Mr. College Football."
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 09:53 AM
(08-12-2014 09:47 AM)GaStPanthers Wrote: http://mrcollegefootball.blog.ajc.com/2014/08/10/will-autonomy-obannon-ruling-change-college-football/
I've totally lost respect for the so called "Mr. College Football."
Knee jerk reaction based on water cooler talk.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - CAJUNNATION - 08-12-2014 10:04 AM
Quote:But if you’re the parent of a scholarship athlete, your life is about to get a little better.
Unless, of course, you're the parent of a scholarship athlete who just lost his scholarship because his school had to drop football because of this....right Tony?
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 10:06 AM
I cant see any FBS school dropping football over this. Think of what Tulane went through as a result of Katrina and they are still playing. This is what I just posted on PT this morning:
Quote:A lot of people on message boards and in the blogosphere are acting like the sky is falling. But what is the real impact? We were not competing with Michigan last week for players and we still are not this week. The 2* or 3* we offer isnt going to go to Georgia because we cant offer up more snacks because Georgia wasnt offering them anyway.Cost of full attendance is not insurmountable at all and most FBS schools will go to that. Where we wont be able to match the P5 is millions of dollars in "snacks" and personal travel expenses for players and their families. Regarding payday games, they (P5) can rattle their saber all day but Indiana, Wake Forest, Oregon State and Iowa State are not going to sign a death warrant that relegates them to permanent 4-8 or worse records. Even if they did, so what? At most its $2M from your overall budget, We would adjust. But it will not come to that. They will still play us. The reality is that for the G5 not much will change at all. P5 t-shirt fans had no idea we existed last week and they still wont. The real impact is for the next Louisville because the price to enter the P5 is about to go WAY up.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - Georgia_Power_Company - 08-12-2014 10:10 AM
(08-12-2014 09:47 AM)GaStPanthers Wrote: http://mrcollegefootball.blog.ajc.com/2014/08/10/will-autonomy-obannon-ruling-change-college-football/
I've totally lost respect for the so called "Mr. College Football."
Article really makes no sense to me. I guess we will just have to wait to see how it will all shake out.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - msm96wolf - 08-12-2014 10:25 AM
I think this may be similar to the Title IX impact. Football will stay at these schools but Olympic sports, especially men's will be cut. The sad part, most of these kids were the true student athlete. :(
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - StanMolsonMan - 08-12-2014 10:48 AM
I honestly believe the only thing the P5 could come together was on autonomy. I think they will eat themselves up with the details. "Cost of Attendance"... ha. I guarantee you the "Cost of Attendance" at UCLA or Washington is more than Alabama or Ohio State. Then what? Is Alabama or Auburn going to argue that it isn't fair that they don't play somewhere where the cost of living is higher when they begin to lose recruits who goes for the "Cost of Attendance" that is 3x Alabama? The cost of attendance for GA Tech will easily be twice as much as UGA. Can you imagine that in state fight? The free for all hasn't nearly begun. I give it a year before the hand holding and kumbaya singing stops, but when it does it is going to turn into the War of the Roses.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - GaStPanthers - 08-12-2014 11:00 AM
(08-12-2014 10:48 AM)StanMolsonMan Wrote: I honestly believe the only thing the P5 could come together was on autonomy. I think they will eat themselves up with the details. "Cost of Attendance"... ha. I guarantee you the "Cost of Attendance" at UCLA or Washington is more than Alabama or Ohio State. Then what? Is Alabama or Auburn going to argue that it isn't fair that they don't play somewhere where the cost of living is higher when they begin to lose recruits who goes for the "Cost of Attendance" that is 3x Alabama? The cost of attendance for GA Tech will easily be twice as much as UGA. Can you imagine that in state fight? The free for all hasn't nearly begun. I give it a year before the hand holding and kumbaya singing stops, but when it does it is going to turn into the War of the Roses.
Yep and Cost of Attendance is a number required by the Feds for federal student loan programs. So there isn't much to mess around with there. If you start messing around with that number, then you start messing around with all of the non-athlete, average Joe students' financial aid. And, I don't believe ruining constituents' financial aid packages is something Congress or State Legislatures want to happen. So the P5/NCAA will be treading lightly.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - StanMolsonMan - 08-12-2014 11:06 AM
(08-12-2014 11:00 AM)GaStPanthers Wrote:(08-12-2014 10:48 AM)StanMolsonMan Wrote: I honestly believe the only thing the P5 could come together was on autonomy. I think they will eat themselves up with the details. "Cost of Attendance"... ha. I guarantee you the "Cost of Attendance" at UCLA or Washington is more than Alabama or Ohio State. Then what? Is Alabama or Auburn going to argue that it isn't fair that they don't play somewhere where the cost of living is higher when they begin to lose recruits who goes for the "Cost of Attendance" that is 3x Alabama? The cost of attendance for GA Tech will easily be twice as much as UGA. Can you imagine that in state fight? The free for all hasn't nearly begun. I give it a year before the hand holding and kumbaya singing stops, but when it does it is going to turn into the War of the Roses.
Yep and Cost of Attendance is a number required by the Feds for federal student loan programs. So there isn't much to mess around with there. If you start messing around with that number, then you start messing around with all of the non-athlete, average Joe students' financial aid. And, I don't believe ruining constituents' financial aid packages is something Congress or State Legislatures want to happen. So the P5/NCAA will be treading lightly.
And this doesn't even include the can of worms of unionization of student athletes for the private schools. Vandy or Northwestern or (shutter) Miami could decide to embrace that ruling since they are private institutions, and make cost of attendance look like welfare.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - HCJag - 08-12-2014 11:09 AM
I don't know how much if any of this will really have a negative effect on the average G5. At least as far as stipends and the O'Bannon case. If the stipends are only for head-count sports, the extra money each school gets under the new playoff system should cover it. Right?
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - arkstfan - 08-12-2014 11:11 AM
Of course the P5 could come together on putting more money in players pockets so they don't leave school with debt. They are making as much off TV as some of us spend and they are getting sued in multiple venues because people perceive it as unfair that a university generates $100 million athletics and spends less than 10% on the the athletes even accounting for tuition, books, meals, lodging, gear, and tutoring.
They were in a dangerous crack and had to do something.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - The4thOption - 08-12-2014 11:28 AM
(08-12-2014 10:06 AM)panama Wrote: I cant see any FBS school dropping football over this. Think of what Tulane went through as a result of Katrina and they are still playing. This is what I just posted on PT this morning:
Quote:A lot of people on message boards and in the blogosphere are acting like the sky is falling. But what is the real impact? We were not competing with Michigan last week for players and we still are not this week. The 2* or 3* we offer isnt going to go to Georgia because we cant offer up more snacks because Georgia wasnt offering them anyway.Cost of full attendance is not insurmountable at all and most FBS schools will go to that. Where we wont be able to match the P5 is millions of dollars in "snacks" and personal travel expenses for players and their families. Regarding payday games, they (P5) can rattle their saber all day but Indiana, Wake Forest, Oregon State and Iowa State are not going to sign a death warrant that relegates them to permanent 4-8 or worse records. Even if they did, so what? At most its $2M from your overall budget, We would adjust. But it will not come to that. They will still play us. The reality is that for the G5 not much will change at all. P5 t-shirt fans had no idea we existed last week and they still wont. The real impact is for the next Louisville because the price to enter the P5 is about to go WAY up.
Panama, I think the big thing is that if we don't elect to match what the P5 do - we ARE going to see a bigger separation between us and them. It is going to make any path for moving upward much harder. It is going to make becoming a Boise State, and receiving "bcs" offers or seeing a Louisville climb even fewer and further between.
BECAUSE - much of their rise is due to Winning against the P5. Directly in national respect and in so developing a National following because people like an underdog that wins. AND because alumni and other donors respond when you do those things.
So why do we (G5's) get some of those athletes that make such a big impact on our programs and perform so well against the P5? Lots of answers to that question. BUT - don't think that we as a group never sign players that receive offers from the P5. Playing time is one big factor - almost guaranteed starts, big man on campus, not getting loss behind two other blue chip guys etc.
OR - maybe just maybe - What is best for the student athlete --- They decide to come play for one of us because our University offers them the best opportunity to not only play ball, but get a degree in the field of study that they would like to go into.
$$$$ changes everything. IF we didn't match that part or didn't offer any. THEN - how many guys (especially if they've never had any $ in their pockets) are going to come play for us when they could ride the bench at a P5 and be putting 5 grand in their pockets?
I fear that we would see a lot of guys do just that, and THAT would/could effectively lower our talent pool in the G5.
And (I know nobody cares around here) - but oh my - What is that going to do to FCS Football - WHEN - we offer $ as well - even if it is slightly less than the P5 offer.
I think the writing on the wall is clear. We have to offer the $, and we are going to almost certainly have to match the amount the P5 offer.
HOW?
We hold a meeting as the G5 and all agree to price set any games with us at 3Million per game. They need the games against us - to keep their donors happy with the W/L records and to be bowl eligible. The numbers support that.
NEXT UP: Anti-Trust lawsuit against the G5 for conspiring to set the price for games with the P5.
How far is this rabbit hole going to go?
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 01:51 PM
But we are not offering the same kids as Georgia and Auburn. Its not like they are sitting the going, hmm do I go to WKU or Kentucky. In that case they are going to Kentucky 999 times out of 1000. If you are somehow beating P5 for players then congratulations and I shall call you Louisville. As far as creating a bigger gap well yes I think that's what I was trying to say by saying that the entrance fee to P5 just went WAY up. The main thing we can all do is make sure our individual houses are in order and build our own individual facilities and local fan bases so that we are nt one of the two or three schools that drop football.
Re: RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - ark30inf - 08-12-2014 02:14 PM
(08-12-2014 01:51 PM)panama Wrote: But we are not offering the same kids as Georgia and Auburn. Its not like they are sitting the going, hmm do I go to WKU or Kentucky. In that case they are going to Kentucky 999 times out of 1000. If you are somehow beating P5 for players then congratulations and I shall call you Louisville. As far as creating a bigger gap well yes I think that's what I was trying to say by saying that the entrance fee to P5 just went WAY up. The main thing we can all do is make sure our individual houses are in order and build our own individual facilities and local fan bases so that we are nt one of the two or three schools that drop football.
If you aren't offering kids Auburn and Georgia are offering....then you don't have much ambition.
A kid who chose UK over WKU the last couple of years made a bad choice...and got beat by WKU.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - GoApps70 - 08-12-2014 02:20 PM
✰ So far everything have seen indicates the Sun Belt will follow in lock step with the P5s.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - Pounce FTW - 08-12-2014 02:23 PM
Surprised to see this coming from Mr. Barnhart. I still don't get how our situation changes all that much until the day the P5 says they won't play us anymore, which I don't see happening anytime soon.
If I were AD at Cincinnati or UConn, though, I'd be a little disappointed.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 02:32 PM
(08-12-2014 02:23 PM)Pounce FTW Wrote: Surprised to see this coming from Mr. Barnhart. I still don't get how our situation changes all that much until the day the P5 says they won't play us anymore, which I don't see happening anytime soon.
If I were AD at Cincinnati or UConn, though, I'd be a little disappointed.
Exactly. Cincinnati just spent $86M and that might not be enough.
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 02:35 PM
(08-12-2014 02:14 PM)ark30inf Wrote:(08-12-2014 01:51 PM)panama Wrote: But we are not offering the same kids as Georgia and Auburn. Its not like they are sitting the going, hmm do I go to WKU or Kentucky. In that case they are going to Kentucky 999 times out of 1000. If you are somehow beating P5 for players then congratulations and I shall call you Louisville. As far as creating a bigger gap well yes I think that's what I was trying to say by saying that the entrance fee to P5 just went WAY up. The main thing we can all do is make sure our individual houses are in order and build our own individual facilities and local fan bases so that we are nt one of the two or three schools that drop football.
If you aren't offering kids Auburn and Georgia are offering....then you don't have much ambition.
A kid who chose UK over WKU the last couple of years made a bad choice...and got beat by WKU.
If you are consistently beating Auburn and Georgia for recruits then you have a top 30 class because you likely have 4 or 5 four star players. Get back to me when you have a waterfall in your locker room...lol
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - GoApps70 - 08-12-2014 02:37 PM
(08-12-2014 02:35 PM)panama Wrote:We do. It's called a shower. You guys might want to add them. jk(08-12-2014 02:14 PM)ark30inf Wrote:(08-12-2014 01:51 PM)panama Wrote: But we are not offering the same kids as Georgia and Auburn. Its not like they are sitting the going, hmm do I go to WKU or Kentucky. In that case they are going to Kentucky 999 times out of 1000. If you are somehow beating P5 for players then congratulations and I shall call you Louisville. As far as creating a bigger gap well yes I think that's what I was trying to say by saying that the entrance fee to P5 just went WAY up. The main thing we can all do is make sure our individual houses are in order and build our own individual facilities and local fan bases so that we are nt one of the two or three schools that drop football.
If you aren't offering kids Auburn and Georgia are offering....then you don't have much ambition.
A kid who chose UK over WKU the last couple of years made a bad choice...and got beat by WKU.
If you are consistently beating Auburn and Georgia for recruits then you have a top 30 class because you likely have 4 or 5 four star players. Get back to me when you have a waterfall in your locker room...lol
RE: Barnhart on P5 Autonomy - panama - 08-12-2014 02:39 PM
(08-12-2014 02:37 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:LOL. Nice recruiting pitch provided they dont visit Tuscaloosa.(08-12-2014 02:35 PM)panama Wrote:We do. It's called a shower. You guys might want to add them. jk(08-12-2014 02:14 PM)ark30inf Wrote:(08-12-2014 01:51 PM)panama Wrote: But we are not offering the same kids as Georgia and Auburn. Its not like they are sitting the going, hmm do I go to WKU or Kentucky. In that case they are going to Kentucky 999 times out of 1000. If you are somehow beating P5 for players then congratulations and I shall call you Louisville. As far as creating a bigger gap well yes I think that's what I was trying to say by saying that the entrance fee to P5 just went WAY up. The main thing we can all do is make sure our individual houses are in order and build our own individual facilities and local fan bases so that we are nt one of the two or three schools that drop football.
If you aren't offering kids Auburn and Georgia are offering....then you don't have much ambition.
A kid who chose UK over WKU the last couple of years made a bad choice...and got beat by WKU.
If you are consistently beating Auburn and Georgia for recruits then you have a top 30 class because you likely have 4 or 5 four star players. Get back to me when you have a waterfall in your locker room...lol