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RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - GoAppsGo92 - 04-08-2014 11:28 AM
(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
Great observation, and I agree. That's why its going to take years to turn it around. It can be done, but its going to take time.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - arkstfan - 04-08-2014 12:13 PM
(04-08-2014 11:00 AM)WKUApollo Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
Very astute and I think you're right. On a related topic, I think that applies to WKU basketball to a similar degree. No offense to the SBC, but I think the move to CUSA for WKU was to address the same issue. Since the SBC was raided of UAB, VCU, ODU, Charlotte, etc. back in the early 90's, our fanbase hasn't been as inspired....although we've had some good seasons, we've not been relevant to the same degree we were in the 80's. I'm not a fortune teller so I don't know if we'll ever return to the level we were back then, but I know plenty of WKU faithful that are ecstatic about playing those teams again in basketball. It just wasn't the same atmosphere playing basketball against the newer SBC teams, except of course USA and ULL.
WKU wasted a decade or more kicking the dirt being pissed that all those schools got called and they didn't.
Immediately post-merger, the Sun Belt wasn't a bad league, the American South put two in the Dance and two in the NIT the year prior.
WKU went to the NCAA Tournament four times in the decade post-merger and even garnered an at-large bid, advanced to the second round twice and sweet 16 once but everyone was so busy grousing that it wasn't the Sun Belt they had joined no one seemed to notice that in the preceeding decade of the "better" Sun Belt WKU had made the NCAA Tournament twice, went round of 32 twice but no Sweet 16.
Of course if WKU had embraced the cards dealt, the 'Toppers would probably be in Valley now rather than playing FBS ball so I guess it worked out.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - redfan - 04-08-2014 12:18 PM
(04-08-2014 11:09 AM)GoAppsGo92 Wrote:(04-07-2014 03:34 PM)LexColonel Wrote:(04-07-2014 02:37 PM)redfan Wrote:Yes, for the THIRD time. First 15 million for various athletic improvements, including RK Stadium.(04-07-2014 12:45 PM)DawggoneEagle Wrote: Well, you can read the article for yourself, it was about EKU's funding from the legislative session. It had no specific spending targets other than stating that all sports would benefit.
So there are no specific amounts for stadium improvement that have been discussed. It sounds like this is just the very beginning of planning, with actual improvements several years away.I wish the school success if they do decide to make major renovations.
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And Last week President Benson said an additional 30 million for RK Stadium!
I like EKU, but they are no where near ready, and $30 million needed on the stadium alone... part of a $15 million budget allocation won't do it. This is going to take years, but there is time since there is no where for EKU to go right now. With Liberty rumors as the last member to get us to 12 in Football... EKU needs to plan for the future. Don't know what slots may or may not open up but EKU is on a 3-5 year plan based on what I see.
I agree that this effort by EKU will take several years. No quick fix here.
With regard to the $30m it was mentioned the source would be..
"Raise private monies. And he does mention a student athletic fee, but no specific amount was given. He assured students it would not be exorbitant."
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - WKUFan518 - 04-08-2014 12:29 PM
(04-08-2014 12:13 PM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 11:00 AM)WKUApollo Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
Very astute and I think you're right. On a related topic, I think that applies to WKU basketball to a similar degree. No offense to the SBC, but I think the move to CUSA for WKU was to address the same issue. Since the SBC was raided of UAB, VCU, ODU, Charlotte, etc. back in the early 90's, our fanbase hasn't been as inspired....although we've had some good seasons, we've not been relevant to the same degree we were in the 80's. I'm not a fortune teller so I don't know if we'll ever return to the level we were back then, but I know plenty of WKU faithful that are ecstatic about playing those teams again in basketball. It just wasn't the same atmosphere playing basketball against the newer SBC teams, except of course USA and ULL.
WKU wasted a decade or more kicking the dirt being pissed that all those schools got called and they didn't.
Immediately post-merger, the Sun Belt wasn't a bad league, the American South put two in the Dance and two in the NIT the year prior.
WKU went to the NCAA Tournament four times in the decade post-merger and even garnered an at-large bid, advanced to the second round twice and sweet 16 once but everyone was so busy grousing that it wasn't the Sun Belt they had joined no one seemed to notice that in the preceeding decade of the "better" Sun Belt WKU had made the NCAA Tournament twice, went round of 32 twice but no Sweet 16.
Of course if WKU had embraced the cards dealt, the 'Toppers would probably be in Valley now rather than playing FBS ball so I guess it worked out.
Nope we would have been in the A-10 and had an invite in the mid 90s...Our poor leadership at the time turned it down....Of course we probably would have dropped football but us declining the A10 was horrible for our basketball program..Thankfully we recovered and have done pretty well since, but the A10 has always been a very respectful basketball conf.......Than we finally got a president that cared about athletics and started building us up from the ground level and made improvements everywhere....We started overall planning around 1998, so it took us about 10 years to get to the point we felt good about where our atheltics program was going and jjoining FBS..The guy (Dr. Ransdall) who is still president already has building named after him as an active president, not sure many people can say that.....
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - WKUApollo - 04-08-2014 12:46 PM
(04-08-2014 12:13 PM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 11:00 AM)WKUApollo Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
Very astute and I think you're right. On a related topic, I think that applies to WKU basketball to a similar degree. No offense to the SBC, but I think the move to CUSA for WKU was to address the same issue. Since the SBC was raided of UAB, VCU, ODU, Charlotte, etc. back in the early 90's, our fanbase hasn't been as inspired....although we've had some good seasons, we've not been relevant to the same degree we were in the 80's. I'm not a fortune teller so I don't know if we'll ever return to the level we were back then, but I know plenty of WKU faithful that are ecstatic about playing those teams again in basketball. It just wasn't the same atmosphere playing basketball against the newer SBC teams, except of course USA and ULL.
WKU wasted a decade or more kicking the dirt being pissed that all those schools got called and they didn't.
Immediately post-merger, the Sun Belt wasn't a bad league, the American South put two in the Dance and two in the NIT the year prior.
WKU went to the NCAA Tournament four times in the decade post-merger and even garnered an at-large bid, advanced to the second round twice and sweet 16 once but everyone was so busy grousing that it wasn't the Sun Belt they had joined no one seemed to notice that in the preceeding decade of the "better" Sun Belt WKU had made the NCAA Tournament twice, went round of 32 twice but no Sweet 16.
Of course if WKU had embraced the cards dealt, the 'Toppers would probably be in Valley now rather than playing FBS ball so I guess it worked out.
I think you misunderstood my intent. I was referring to the "fans'" interest. Yes we had some success after the merger but many fans stopped caring about going to see, what they considered, "unknowns"....ala the EKU situation with football when the OVC changed membership. The excitement level from the fanbase changed. As nearly all SBC fans here will readily admit, the SBC is a football conference.....some even say it's a Football and Baseball Conference. To many diehard WKU fans, basketball is everything. I wasn't trying to slight the members of the SBC that were part of the merge. We true sports aficionado's know that there has been some quality over the years in the SBC but the average fan doesn't see that.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - EKUSteve - 04-08-2014 12:49 PM
(04-08-2014 10:17 AM)asupatch Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:08 AM)Liberty22 Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:05 AM)asupatch Wrote:(04-08-2014 09:56 AM)Liberty22 Wrote:(04-08-2014 09:35 AM)asupatch Wrote: Without looking I would bet a large sum of money that over the past decade EKU had higher average attendance than that Online school in Lynchburg.
Well patch. I just looked it up. When can I have that large sum of money? From 2005 to 2013 (Records are not as great in 2004) Liberty averaged 13,475. EKU averaged 8,110.
2013: LU - 15,031 EKU-8,617
2012: LU - 16,318 EKU-9,800
2011: LU - 16,419 EKU-6,578
2010: LU - 14,630 EKU-6,220
2009: LU - 14,931 EKU-6,520
2008: LU - 13,147 EKU-8,483
2007: LU - 14, 190 EKU-8,560
2006: LU - 11,128 EKU-9,780
2005: LU - 5,419 EKU-8,440
Figures compiled from http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/football_records/Attendance/2013.pdf
Just change the date to whatever date you want to look at to see attendance.
Guess I was a couple years off. Pre 2006 Liberty couldn't break 10 while EKU was better and pulling in more fans.
OOOO better yet show me that stat where you guys have less playoff wins than EKU's NC's.
Yep we sucked back then, but now we don't. That was 2006, this is now.
How well have you fared against real competition. The Big South is cute and all.....but beat someone. Make it to the playoffs and beat someone......give me something more than a bloated record it a crap conference.
We got hammered the last couple of years by UofL and Purdue. In 2011 we lost to Kansas State by 3. KSU went to the Cotton Bowl that year. Indiana was a 19 - 13 loss.
Attendance wise EKU has been down due to the lack of any marquee teams coming in. Last close to sell out was the last time WKU came to town. Biggest attendance game this past year with for Coastal Carolina.
I would suspect an uptick in attendance with play Georgia Southern and App St as well as the occasional games with Western, MTSU and Marshall. Those games would draw. With the changes in the OVC, we really lack a true meat an potatoes rival that the fans can get into.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - arkstfan - 04-08-2014 01:26 PM
(04-08-2014 12:46 PM)WKUApollo Wrote:(04-08-2014 12:13 PM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 11:00 AM)WKUApollo Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
Very astute and I think you're right. On a related topic, I think that applies to WKU basketball to a similar degree. No offense to the SBC, but I think the move to CUSA for WKU was to address the same issue. Since the SBC was raided of UAB, VCU, ODU, Charlotte, etc. back in the early 90's, our fanbase hasn't been as inspired....although we've had some good seasons, we've not been relevant to the same degree we were in the 80's. I'm not a fortune teller so I don't know if we'll ever return to the level we were back then, but I know plenty of WKU faithful that are ecstatic about playing those teams again in basketball. It just wasn't the same atmosphere playing basketball against the newer SBC teams, except of course USA and ULL.
WKU wasted a decade or more kicking the dirt being pissed that all those schools got called and they didn't.
Immediately post-merger, the Sun Belt wasn't a bad league, the American South put two in the Dance and two in the NIT the year prior.
WKU went to the NCAA Tournament four times in the decade post-merger and even garnered an at-large bid, advanced to the second round twice and sweet 16 once but everyone was so busy grousing that it wasn't the Sun Belt they had joined no one seemed to notice that in the preceeding decade of the "better" Sun Belt WKU had made the NCAA Tournament twice, went round of 32 twice but no Sweet 16.
Of course if WKU had embraced the cards dealt, the 'Toppers would probably be in Valley now rather than playing FBS ball so I guess it worked out.
I think you misunderstood my intent. I was referring to the "fans'" interest. Yes we had some success after the merger but many fans stopped caring about going to see, what they considered, "unknowns"....ala the EKU situation with football when the OVC changed membership. The excitement level from the fanbase changed. As nearly all SBC fans here will readily admit, the SBC is a football conference.....some even say it's a Football and Baseball Conference. To many diehard WKU fans, basketball is everything. I wasn't trying to slight the members of the SBC that were part of the merge. We true sports aficionado's know that there has been some quality over the years in the SBC but the average fan doesn't see that.
That was my point.
Post-merger, the Sun Belt was a hoops conference, football came a decade later but because the fans were reeling from the raids, they missed that it was a good hoops league. Remember we lost members post-merger because those members weren't ready or willing to compete at the Sun Belt level. WKU fans just missed that in their frustration and I think that gave the WKU administration of the day cover to not do what it took to push the program to a higher level.
It is far easier to be an administrator when the fans aren't holding your feet to the fire. I remember on the old Prodigy boards, and Usenet groups the WKU fans didn't give a d@mn if they won the league most just tried to figure out how to get into the Metro or Great Midwest or Valley or a few even the MAC and that distraction made it easy to avoid accountability.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - Colonels12 - 04-09-2014 12:12 PM
Been lurking for a while but this will be my first post. EKU is currently working on the facilities.
Phase 2 of our new science building will start in August. They have plans on building a new College of Education.
On the athletic side they just added lights to the Turkey Hughes Field and Gertrude Hood Field, baseball and softball stadiums. In fact, baseball hosted their first ever night game on Friday in front of 550 fans. The softball team will have their first night game on Saturday.
The basketball court is getting replaced in Alumni Coliseum sometime this month. They will also upgrade the lights in AC.
Roy Kidd Stadium and Alumni Coliseum both got new HE video boards and audio systems this past summer.
Roy Kidd Stadium will also have the visitor side will be getting new seating and amenities. They will release a design for that project soon.
EKU has been and will continue to keep upgrading the facilities.
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RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - LexColonel - 04-09-2014 12:59 PM
Colonel12 and EKUSteve. Thank you for backing me up. I have been swimming up stream for months on here.
Thanks too to the WKU fans who seem to understand the battle we have fought at EKU in regard to attendance and lack of interest since the OVC has changed so much. All of us old fans miss games against WKU, Marshall, and Middle Tennessee. Not gonna sugar coat it, it hurt when we no longer had those games on our schedule. I don't know if Western will be back if we move, some of their fans say not, but I think it would be a good thing for the state and both of us to renew a very old rivalry at some point. No one except EKU fans know how having the Administration we have had for 30 years has hurt us. EKU should have made the move in the early 80's, but we had a president at the time who had not Roy Kidd been a great coach and so well liked, would have dropped sports to D2. It was battle that no one outside the EKU community realizes. Thankfully, now we have a president and BOR who gets it.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - The4thOption - 04-09-2014 02:24 PM
I'd like to have Kentucky (State/market) in the footprint. I have a lot of respect for EKU going way back to the "old" days of 1-AA.
I have no preference in having WKU back over EKU - if they get their stuff together and fund the move. No reason to wait on them though, I don't have a problem with going to 14 or even 16 at some point as I expect the CFP to be expanded and more money to pour in from it.
I'd like to have EKU,JMU,MSU,UTC,Liberty and maybe Coastal Car. (some gotta increase attendances)- minus Idaho - bring in NMSU all sports. Is that 16?
Anyway - just keep preparing your fields for rain!
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - GoApps70 - 04-09-2014 03:04 PM
Would think if EKU moves to the SBC that WKU-vs-EKU would be a great attendance generator for both schools.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - Colonels12 - 04-09-2014 03:07 PM
The schools would need to agree to play. Most WKU people would rather not.
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RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - WKUYG - 04-09-2014 03:20 PM
(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
The football stadium and basketball arena had nothing to do with being small-time or big-time. Both building had to be budgeted as educational buildings. If it was only about sports neither would have been built. As a matter of fact the stadium was referred to as classrooms with a stadium on top. The same thing at Western with one difference...
Western basketball was a national name at that time especially in the northeast so in a sense the classrooms were build around our basketball arena. That's why the state gave Western a educational building that would seat 14,000 basketball fans and EKU only 6500.
Actually that's one reason I think EKU will have a harder time making this move than Western. In the state of KY politics plays a huge role in funding and just as Western found out when we tried to get state help in funding the upgrade....
EKU will find out it's almost impossible to get any help from the state and will need private funding. As others pointed out it took Western many years to do this. I don't know if EKU can get it done at least not in enough time to make a move or to sell the school to a conference to take a chance on them. Western started a building fund with a goal of 100 million and I think that campaign reached the 300 million mark....
that a long with working with the city of Bowling Green to get creative with some bond funding to go ahead with the upgrade on Diddle.
As 518 pointed out it was a lot easier getting people to part with their money for donations in the early parts of the 2000s than it is today.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - JoeJag - 04-09-2014 03:23 PM
I'm not totally opposed to EKU as I am to Liberty, but I believe the SBC can and will do a lot better in an upcoming addition. Just my honest opinion.
Re: RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - Colonels12 - 04-09-2014 03:24 PM
(04-09-2014 03:20 PM)WKUYG Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
The football stadium and basketball arena had nothing to do with being small-time or big-time. Both building had to be budgeted as educational buildings. If it was only about sports neither would have been built. As a matter of fact the stadium was referred to as classrooms with a stadium on top. The same thing at Western with one difference...
Western basketball was a national name at that time especially in the northeast so in a sense the classrooms were build around our basketball arena. That's why the state gave Western a educational building that would seat 14,000 basketball fans and EKU only 6500.
Actually that's one reason I think EKU will have a harder time making this move than Western. In the state of KY politics plays a huge role in funding and just as Western found out when we tried to get state help in funding the upgrade....
EKU will find out it's almost impossible to get any help from the state and will need private funding. As others pointed out it took Western many years to do this. I don't know if EKU can get it done at least not in enough time to make a move or to sell the school to a conference to take a chance on them. Western started a building fund with a goal of 100 million and I think that campaign reached the 300 million mark....
that a long with working with the city of Bowling Green to get creative with some bond funding to go ahead with the upgrade on Diddle.
As 518 pointed out it was a lot easier getting people to part with their money for donations in the early parts of the 2000s than it is today.
Benson and the regents spent a full weekend in Frankfort getting politics on our side. They are a step ahead of where you think they are.
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RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - GoApps70 - 04-09-2014 03:27 PM
(04-09-2014 03:07 PM)Colonels12 Wrote: The schools would need to agree to play. Most WKU people would rather not.That could change fast when you are FBS.
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RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - WKUYG - 04-09-2014 04:02 PM
(04-09-2014 03:24 PM)Colonels12 Wrote:(04-09-2014 03:20 PM)WKUYG Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
The football stadium and basketball arena had nothing to do with being small-time or big-time. Both building had to be budgeted as educational buildings. If it was only about sports neither would have been built. As a matter of fact the stadium was referred to as classrooms with a stadium on top. The same thing at Western with one difference...
Western basketball was a national name at that time especially in the northeast so in a sense the classrooms were build around our basketball arena. That's why the state gave Western a educational building that would seat 14,000 basketball fans and EKU only 6500.
Actually that's one reason I think EKU will have a harder time making this move than Western. In the state of KY politics plays a huge role in funding and just as Western found out when we tried to get state help in funding the upgrade....
EKU will find out it's almost impossible to get any help from the state and will need private funding. As others pointed out it took Western many years to do this. I don't know if EKU can get it done at least not in enough time to make a move or to sell the school to a conference to take a chance on them. Western started a building fund with a goal of 100 million and I think that campaign reached the 300 million mark....
that a long with working with the city of Bowling Green to get creative with some bond funding to go ahead with the upgrade on Diddle.
As 518 pointed out it was a lot easier getting people to part with their money for donations in the early parts of the 2000s than it is today.
Benson and the regents spent a full weekend in Frankfort getting politics on our side. They are a step ahead of where you think they are.
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Maybe EKU can get it done but till it actually get to a finial budget and passes..don't count on it. At one point Western had state funding for the Diddle project then it didn't. If you can sell it as a educational expense maybe but if this is only about sports I will believe it when I see it passed in the finial budget.
Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - galojah - 04-09-2014 07:19 PM
Looking at EKU's fundraising numbers, alumni participation rate, past campaigns, endowment, etc., I don't see it is possible for EKU to raise $30M for a stadium. It will have to come from other revenue streams. Even WKU, who has a much higher alumni giving rate, higher endowment, higher annual fundraising totals, etc., couldn't fund it's stadium renovation entirely with private support. WKU received a $5M naming gift and some other gifts but mostly was funded by a student fee.
Also, $30M is not a lot of stadium. WKU's renovation of East Grandstand and construction of West Grandstand was nearly $50M.
Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - galojah - 04-09-2014 07:20 PM
(04-09-2014 04:02 PM)WKUYG Wrote:(04-09-2014 03:24 PM)Colonels12 Wrote:(04-09-2014 03:20 PM)WKUYG Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:38 AM)arkstfan Wrote:(04-08-2014 10:10 AM)WKUApollo Wrote: Two things.....
1. Ouch.....funny how facts change assumptions. Good data bud.
2. I hadn't realized how bad EKU's attendance had become in the last 10 years. Since Roy Kidd retired, their prestige and national prominence took a nose dive...that and the decline of the OVC as well. EKU continues to have winning seasons though. They've only had one losing season in the last 40 years so it's not because of losing. I really think their attendance decline is because of the changing OVC. It used to be a powerful IAA/FCS conference.
There seems to be a really thin line with EKU fans. Merely winning seems to be insufficient. Winning AND being relevant appears to be the key. Just being above average doesn't seem to inspire their fan base.
I also find it interesting that in the 1960's they seemed to have a pretty significant vision. They built a 6,500 seat arena and 22,000 seat football stadium. Those aren't the actions of a school that had a vision of playing small-time, but they seem to have at some point put their hands on their hips surveyed the scene and declared they were satisfied as numerous schools rushed past.
The football stadium and basketball arena had nothing to do with being small-time or big-time. Both building had to be budgeted as educational buildings. If it was only about sports neither would have been built. As a matter of fact the stadium was referred to as classrooms with a stadium on top. The same thing at Western with one difference...
Western basketball was a national name at that time especially in the northeast so in a sense the classrooms were build around our basketball arena. That's why the state gave Western a educational building that would seat 14,000 basketball fans and EKU only 6500.
Actually that's one reason I think EKU will have a harder time making this move than Western. In the state of KY politics plays a huge role in funding and just as Western found out when we tried to get state help in funding the upgrade....
EKU will find out it's almost impossible to get any help from the state and will need private funding. As others pointed out it took Western many years to do this. I don't know if EKU can get it done at least not in enough time to make a move or to sell the school to a conference to take a chance on them. Western started a building fund with a goal of 100 million and I think that campaign reached the 300 million mark....
that a long with working with the city of Bowling Green to get creative with some bond funding to go ahead with the upgrade on Diddle.
As 518 pointed out it was a lot easier getting people to part with their money for donations in the early parts of the 2000s than it is today.
Benson and the regents spent a full weekend in Frankfort getting politics on our side. They are a step ahead of where you think they are.
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S4 Active using Tapatalk
Maybe EKU can get it done but till it actually get to a finial budget and passes..don't count on it. At one point Western had state funding for the Diddle project then it didn't. If you can sell it as a educational expense maybe but if this is only about sports I will believe it when I see it passed in the finial budget.
Even Kentucky's Rupp Arena didn't get the money they wanted for renovations. The WKUs and EKUs of Kentucky stand no chance.
RE: Meanwhile EKU continues with what they need to do - LexColonel - 04-09-2014 07:29 PM
I don't know about all that Apollo. Alumni Coliseum has a wall on one side that is designed so it can be opened up. I am not sure the legislators had much to do with the design of Alumni. Why? Because of the wooden beamed ceiling that had to cost a LOT of money, even back then. Was it worth if, probably not, but my guess was that a big chunk of change was used there. It is very unusual and looks great. As far as classrooms, you are right about the football stadium. However, originally there were no more than 7-8 classrooms in the coliseum. There are none now. Alumni only needs updating, which will start early June. I would think that after some cosmetic enhancements, perhaps ( I hope) some or most of the bleachers will be replaced with more chair backs. RK Stadium on the other hand needs much more, everyone knows that. You can bet President Benson knows it, and is moving forward on that.
It does remain to be seen how all this plays out. But, Benson is serious about it, that you can bet on. I know that many WKU fans doubt that EKU can will make it happen. But, think back about how others said Western would never move, you all had you share of naysayers and negativity from outsiders as well as those close to western, including as I remember, professors who didn't like it at all (but seems that's always the case, protecting their turf).