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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - ARSTATEFAN1986 - 03-26-2014 09:42 AM
(03-26-2014 09:36 AM)SHWISH Wrote:(03-26-2014 09:17 AM)AlwaysSunny Wrote: It's pretty obvious JMU isn't really interested in the "join just to get in" route. People keep saying it's more beneficial to them, but how? Do they generate more revenue or lose money? Do they have more travel expenses or less? I'm betting NDSU would probably feel the same way...some seem to think it's a benefit to them to join the league but that just might not be the case, FCS or not. Last few years NDSU has traveled to, and beaten a couple of different Big 10 teams, been on college gameday, sell out their stadium, etc etc etc. They have regional rivals, etc...so, they move to the Sunbelt and the benefit is....a shot at the New Orleans bowl? They really won't gain any more notoriety than they already have. Is that worth the move to them just to be able to say they're FBS? Just saying...Look if you can't pretend jmu is joining and will lead the sbc to greatness, than don't post at all. Without jmu we are nothing. Adding JMU neither makes us or breaks us.
Plus look at JMU's situation, they just watched their peer school (ODU) go directly from FCS to CUSA, of course they aren't going to be quick to want to join the Sunbelt.
When we added Appalachian State, Georgia State and Georgia Southern and NMSU as football only...though full member would have been best...I was glad. This year...I look forward to see NMSU as a full member, Missouri State being invited and I realize an eastern school is needed. however...JMU is last on my list. I would prefer EKU (who wants to be in the belt), Liberty or Jacksonville State over JMU.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - arkstfan - 03-26-2014 10:01 AM
What is the fascination with bringing in schools who would look around and say, "Yep. Good 'nuff. I'm content to be this and nothing more"?
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - SoCalBobcat78 - 03-26-2014 10:06 AM
(03-26-2014 09:17 AM)AlwaysSunny Wrote: It's pretty obvious JMU isn't really interested in the "join just to get in" route. People keep saying it's more beneficial to them, but how? Do they generate more revenue or lose money? Do they have more travel expenses or less? I'm betting NDSU would probably feel the same way...some seem to think it's a benefit to them to join the league but that just might not be the case, FCS or not. Last few years NDSU has traveled to, and beaten a couple of different Big 10 teams, been on college gameday, sell out their stadium, etc etc etc. They have regional rivals, etc...so, they move to the Sunbelt and the benefit is....a shot at the New Orleans bowl? They really won't gain any more notoriety than they already have. Is that worth the move to them just to be able to say they're FBS? Just saying...
Plus look at JMU's situation, they just watched their peer school (ODU) go directly from FCS to CUSA, of course they aren't going to be quick to want to join the Sunbelt.
There is no difference between CUSA and the SBC. They get the same college football playoff share that the SBC gets. CUSA will get $12 million and the SBC will get $12 million (once they have 12 schools).
The difference right now is ODU can schedule home games with schools like Virginia Tech and NC State. They have home games with these schools in the future. JMU in the CAA will never get any better than Elon, Maine and Rhode Island. That is why they can't stay.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - knucklehead - 03-26-2014 10:08 AM
But there is a fine line between hiring an employee who wants a foot in the door in order to jump to another job at the first offer and hiring the one who wants the foot in the door and knows they have a lot to learn and room to grow before even expecting another offer.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - SHWISH - 03-26-2014 10:09 AM
(03-26-2014 09:42 AM)ARSTATEFAN1986 Wrote:SBC said no to nmsu All sports, so why keep posting as if it will happen in the next few days.(03-26-2014 09:36 AM)SHWISH Wrote:(03-26-2014 09:17 AM)AlwaysSunny Wrote: It's pretty obvious JMU isn't really interested in the "join just to get in" route. People keep saying it's more beneficial to them, but how? Do they generate more revenue or lose money? Do they have more travel expenses or less? I'm betting NDSU would probably feel the same way...some seem to think it's a benefit to them to join the league but that just might not be the case, FCS or not. Last few years NDSU has traveled to, and beaten a couple of different Big 10 teams, been on college gameday, sell out their stadium, etc etc etc. They have regional rivals, etc...so, they move to the Sunbelt and the benefit is....a shot at the New Orleans bowl? They really won't gain any more notoriety than they already have. Is that worth the move to them just to be able to say they're FBS? Just saying...Look if you can't pretend jmu is joining and will lead the sbc to greatness, than don't post at all. Without jmu we are nothing. Adding JMU neither makes us or breaks us.
Plus look at JMU's situation, they just watched their peer school (ODU) go directly from FCS to CUSA, of course they aren't going to be quick to want to join the Sunbelt.
When we added Appalachian State, Georgia State and Georgia Southern and NMSU as football only...though full member would have been best...I was glad. This year...I look forward to see NMSU as a full member, Missouri State being invited and I realize an eastern school is needed. however...JMU is last on my list. I would prefer EKU (who wants to be in the belt), Liberty or Jacksonville State over JMU.
Another key word by Benson, the 12th team will shorten travel trips for sbc schools. hmmm, shorten.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - JMU2004 - 03-26-2014 10:09 AM
(03-26-2014 10:01 AM)arkstfan Wrote: What is the fascination with bringing in schools who would look around and say, "Yep. Good 'nuff. I'm content to be this and nothing more"?
simple. It's insecurity.
Every Single Member of the SBC would listen if another FBS conference came calling. JMU gets crucified because we are looking out for our own interests? huh?
It's like we're supposed to bow and beg for inclusion.
If JMU joins the SBC, it's because both sides see it as beneficial.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - JMU2004 - 03-26-2014 10:11 AM
(03-26-2014 10:08 AM)knucklehead Wrote: But there is a fine line between hiring an employee who wants a foot in the door in order to jump to another job at the first offer and hiring the one who wants the foot in the door and knows they have a lot to learn and room to grow before even expecting another offer.
lol...you do realize that Liberty first contacted CUSA/MAC before the SBC, right?
Don't act as if Liberty has openly courted the SBC since day 1, because that isn't the case.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - ODUalum78 - 03-26-2014 10:18 AM
(03-26-2014 10:01 AM)arkstfan Wrote: What is the fascination with bringing in schools who would look around and say, "Yep. Good 'nuff. I'm content to be this and nothing more"?
The handful of JMU forum fans aside, It is difficult to assess an administration's attitude or predict what it's long term vision might be.
All three mentioned conferences, SBC, CUSA, and the MAC, are very similar academically so that is not a concern.
However, the out-of-state student demographic and geographic location of JMU is not entirely compatible with the SBC; nor is it really compatible with CUSA, or even the MAC.
Madison is ultimately more compatible with the AAC. (and two or three FCS conferences including the CAA)
One has to wonder if there is any weighted consideration given to an add that would be satisfied and therefore in it for the long term; as Liberty, EKU, or Jax St would likely be.
Since JMU might be using the SBC as only a stepping stone, would this be an important issue for the SBC and affect the final outcome?
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - knucklehead - 03-26-2014 10:21 AM
(03-26-2014 10:11 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:(03-26-2014 10:08 AM)knucklehead Wrote: But there is a fine line between hiring an employee who wants a foot in the door in order to jump to another job at the first offer and hiring the one who wants the foot in the door and knows they have a lot to learn and room to grow before even expecting another offer.
lol...you do realize that Liberty first contacted CUSA/MAC before the SBC, right?
Don't act as if Liberty has openly courted the SBC since day 1, because that isn't the case.
How did you get any of that from my post? I know LU would take MAC or CUSA just like JMU or EKU or whomever. DUH. And how do you know whom they contacted first. I'm sure they contacted most leagues, even bigger ones. What I said was in reference to the fact that once selected, Liberty wouldn't be likely to try and move out in short order.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - Saint3333 - 03-26-2014 10:22 AM
Every school in the Sun Belt and CUSA thinks they should be at a higher ranked conference or that is the goal. App would prefer to be in a conference with more bus trips at the FBS level, this isn't a secret to anyone.
You bring in the best program you can that makes sense for the current schools.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - JMU2004 - 03-26-2014 10:24 AM
(03-26-2014 10:21 AM)knucklehead Wrote:(03-26-2014 10:11 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:(03-26-2014 10:08 AM)knucklehead Wrote: But there is a fine line between hiring an employee who wants a foot in the door in order to jump to another job at the first offer and hiring the one who wants the foot in the door and knows they have a lot to learn and room to grow before even expecting another offer.
lol...you do realize that Liberty first contacted CUSA/MAC before the SBC, right?
Don't act as if Liberty has openly courted the SBC since day 1, because that isn't the case.
How did you get any of that from my post? I know LU would take MAC or CUSA just like JMU or EKU or whomever. DUH. And how do you know whom they contacted first. I'm sure they contacted most leagues, even bigger ones. What I said was in reference to the fact that once selected, Liberty wouldn't be likely to try and move out in short order.
Sorry if I came across in the wrong way.
I was just pointing out that LU would move if given the opportunity. I actually don't think it is good for a conference to base membership on what MIGHT happen down the road, and it certainly makes no sense to invite a school because no one else will take them.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - ARSTATEFAN1986 - 03-26-2014 10:31 AM
(03-26-2014 10:09 AM)SHWISH Wrote:(03-26-2014 09:42 AM)ARSTATEFAN1986 Wrote:SBC said no to nmsu All sports, so why keep posting as if it will happen in the next few days.(03-26-2014 09:36 AM)SHWISH Wrote:(03-26-2014 09:17 AM)AlwaysSunny Wrote: It's pretty obvious JMU isn't really interested in the "join just to get in" route. People keep saying it's more beneficial to them, but how? Do they generate more revenue or lose money? Do they have more travel expenses or less? I'm betting NDSU would probably feel the same way...some seem to think it's a benefit to them to join the league but that just might not be the case, FCS or not. Last few years NDSU has traveled to, and beaten a couple of different Big 10 teams, been on college gameday, sell out their stadium, etc etc etc. They have regional rivals, etc...so, they move to the Sunbelt and the benefit is....a shot at the New Orleans bowl? They really won't gain any more notoriety than they already have. Is that worth the move to them just to be able to say they're FBS? Just saying...Look if you can't pretend jmu is joining and will lead the sbc to greatness, than don't post at all. Without jmu we are nothing. Adding JMU neither makes us or breaks us.
Plus look at JMU's situation, they just watched their peer school (ODU) go directly from FCS to CUSA, of course they aren't going to be quick to want to join the Sunbelt.
When we added Appalachian State, Georgia State and Georgia Southern and NMSU as football only...though full member would have been best...I was glad. This year...I look forward to see NMSU as a full member, Missouri State being invited and I realize an eastern school is needed. however...JMU is last on my list. I would prefer EKU (who wants to be in the belt), Liberty or Jacksonville State over JMU.
Another key word by Benson, the 12th team will shorten travel trips for sbc schools. hmmm, shorten.
One of the eastern members who blocked NMSU is WKU who won't vote this time. The make up has changed and getting an eastern school to be a travel partner with Appalachian State is the context for shortening with reference to Liberty.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - CajunExpress - 03-26-2014 10:36 AM
Travel partners? Do we have sports other than basketball that involves Thursday/Saturday travel? Seems like way too much attention paid to it for men and women basketball teams. Best teams available seems to be far more important travel be damned.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - ARSTATEFAN1986 - 03-26-2014 10:37 AM
(03-26-2014 10:01 AM)arkstfan Wrote: What is the fascination with bringing in schools who would look around and say, "Yep. Good 'nuff. I'm content to be this and nothing more"?
It is to improve the product each of us have and to erase the image that the MAC or CUSA is better. Build on and improve...and that moving to either the MAC or CUSA would not be a consideration. The belt football is continuing to improve...baseball and softball are strong and basketball can get better.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - Crump1 - 03-26-2014 10:52 AM
Despite the arrogant posters in the JMU board I would welcome them with open arms. It just gets really old hearing ridiculous assertions about the prowess of CUSA with all of its former SBC, move ups and former WAC schools. There is no advantage academically (which is pointless anyhow) or athletically to being in one or the other. There is a temporary advantage in TV money and bowl tie-ins that is based on former membership and that is it. In a few years that won't be an issue either. Geography is the only real issue as far as choosing one over another in my opinion. Five years from now I want to play as many regional opponents as I can and I want those opponents to have fanbases that show up and create a college game atmosphere.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - chiefsfan - 03-26-2014 11:04 AM
(03-26-2014 10:36 AM)CajunExpress Wrote: Travel partners? Do we have sports other than basketball that involves Thursday/Saturday travel? Seems like way too much attention paid to it for men and women basketball teams. Best teams available seems to be far more important travel be damned.
Baseball, Soccer, and Volleyball all use similar a similar travel schedule.
The Travel Partner issue is overblown because its really more about finding a 2nd nearby school that one could fly in or out of after a two game road trip with App. Georgia State can fill that if need be.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - JTApps1 - 03-26-2014 11:14 AM
(03-25-2014 09:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote: there were quite a few App and GSU fans on their own board who were against the original move to the Sun Belt. I've noticed most of those have disappeared the last few months as conference schedules got released.
Several JMU fans upset about moving to the SBC doesn't really bother me.
That is for sure. Our boards went from maybe 20% supporting the idea of joining the SB 2 years ago to nearly everyone being excited about the move now. The change in tone from our people has been amazing the last few months. I have a feeling that JMU fans would react the same way.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - AllForDukes - 03-26-2014 11:30 AM
I have no issues with any move to FBS regardless of conference. Conference alignment and the size of conferences, whether there is a new FBS division in the NCAA, super conferences et. al. are a function of time and circumstance. Conferences, like any other organizations, will go through cycles of expansion and then consolidation. Super conferences are the talk of the moment and conference expansion is the current mantra. After a time, schools with like needs be it less travel, growth, whatever will band together and form new conferences due to the perception and needs at that future time. These things have a cyclical nature and the current trend will cycle out in favor of the next trend. Therefore, trying to forecast the longer range future is a fools errand as current decisions will be made based on current conditions and future decisions will be made based on future conditions.
JMU should move to FBS because it is a good decision. Whatever conference we call home will become, in short order, the preferred place to be until it is not. Just like every other conference member. Will CUSA/SBC eventually divide into divisions based on geography? I think so. Will those divisions have reason to break off and form new conferences ala Big East/AAC due to some future factors that are beneficial at that time? I think so. For every yen there is a yang. Ultimately I would like to see a very strong Mid/South Atlantic conference emerge that consists of like minded programs, playing high quality ball and providing a top fan experience while containing costs. Revenue will not increase forever in direct correlation to cost, nor should it.
There are many valid points being made on this thread and there are many emotional statements being made also. At the end of the day, JMU will be a good conference mate in its new conference as it will expect its other conference mates to be as well. I just hope for a decision soon so everyone can move onto the next step and develop some rivalries and new threads.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - chiefsfan - 03-26-2014 11:32 AM
(03-26-2014 11:14 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:(03-25-2014 09:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote: there were quite a few App and GSU fans on their own board who were against the original move to the Sun Belt. I've noticed most of those have disappeared the last few months as conference schedules got released.
Several JMU fans upset about moving to the SBC doesn't really bother me.
That is for sure. Our boards went from maybe 20% supporting the idea of joining the SB 2 years ago to nearly everyone being excited about the move now. The change in tone from our people has been amazing the last few months. I have a feeling that JMU fans would react the same way.
The thing I see is it becomes pretty common for fans to be originally against the SBC because of what they hear about us, only to change their tune when they get into the league and started actually studying what the league has done.
It really takes a bit of research to overcome the stigma we still have from the old days. Takes someone looking and seeing ASU and ULL's bowl results, some of ULM's major upsets, and the OOC Record of a league as a whole the last few years to understand we're not the league we were in 2006.
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand - TrueBlueAlum - 03-26-2014 11:35 AM
(03-26-2014 11:14 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:(03-25-2014 09:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote: there were quite a few App and GSU fans on their own board who were against the original move to the Sun Belt. I've noticed most of those have disappeared the last few months as conference schedules got released.
Several JMU fans upset about moving to the SBC doesn't really bother me.
That is for sure. Our boards went from maybe 20% supporting the idea of joining the SB 2 years ago to nearly everyone being excited about the move now. The change in tone from our people has been amazing the last few months. I have a feeling that JMU fans would react the same way.
It would be hard to go back to being in the small picture once you know what the bigger picture looks like. I think that is something the move-ups all experience.