(02-11-2024 10:46 AM)DICK Wrote:  I don’t think this was mentioned anywhere, but the featured women’s game of the Challenge is James Madison at Ball State today at 2:00 on CBSSN.

Ball State beat James Madison 72-57. The Cards played perhaps ttheir best quarter of the season when they won the first quarter 27-11. They hit 10 of their 14 shots including 5 of 7 3s. They never looked back.

(02-11-2024 07:56 PM)LongtimeFan Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 10:46 AM)DICK Wrote:  I don’t think this was mentioned anywhere, but the featured women’s game of the Challenge is James Madison at Ball State today at 2:00 on CBSSN.

Ball State beat James Madison 72-57. The Cards played perhaps ttheir best quarter of the season when they won the first quarter 27-11. They hit 10 of their 14 shots including 5 of 7 3s. They never looked back.

BallsTate came out with a great gameplan, seemed well coached, got everyone involved, found and hit the open shots, and their defensive pressure led to quite a bit of steals and turnovers. JMU not so much, they never did get going, their best player never was a factor, and their 3s just weren’t falling.

BSU women's game matched the men's in opposite reactive style for Akron and JMU.

UB won a basketball game! This is not a drill! Remain calm. We expect the situation to return to normal shortly.

NIU won half their games in this challenge-both home games. One women's game and one men's game. Considering both our programs are below average they did alright.

These results shut up Astro

We suck lol.

(02-12-2024 12:40 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  These results shut up Astro

We suck lol.

You'd think so, but I doubt it. To them from the beginning it was a bad deal to lock into games with a bad conference like the SBC, they didn't deserve to be on the floor with MAC schools. The excuses were abundant after the first round, even with the football bowl games it was as well including weather-conditions that somehow only hindered one team out there, then round 2 brought excuses again about locations and what days they're scheduled wasn't fair and everything in between.

Oh well, for Mid-majors that struggle to get quality opponents to schedule, especially home games, it worked to provide comparable opponents. Maybe some tweaks could be made to bump round 1 a few weeks later and get a better read on the rankings as things changed by the time round 2 came around.

(02-12-2024 01:44 PM)Polish Hammer Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 12:40 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  These results shut up Astro

We suck lol.

You'd think so, but I doubt it. From the beginning it was a bad deal to lock into games with a bad conference like the SBC, they didn't deserve to be on the floor with MAC schools. The excuses were abundant after the first round, even with the football bowl games it was as well including weather-conditions that somehow only hindered one team out there, then round 2 brought excuses again about locations and what days they're scheduled wasn't fair and everything in between. Oh well, for Mid-majors that struggle to get quality opponents to schedule, especially home games, it worked to provide comparable opponents. Maybe some tweaks could be made to bump round 1 a few weeks later and get a better read on the rankings as things changed by the time round 2 came around.

It probably worked out well that the 2nd round SBC hosted this year. Even if Akron beat JMU it wouldn't help them much with seeding. Perhaps next year the MAC will have more teams better at the top of the conference and getting to host the 2nd leg will be more beneficial.

(02-12-2024 01:44 PM)Polish Hammer Wrote:  ... From the beginning it was a bad deal to lock into games with a bad conference like the SBC, they didn't deserve to be on the floor with MAC schools.

If the Troy Trojans (NET 133) didn't deserve to be on the floor with Kent State (NET 179), it seems like nobody told the Trojans.

The Sunbelt has 4 teams above 150 NET at this point in time, the MAC has 2.

App lost to NIU in round 1, and Kent who isnt great should have beaten JMU. Id say with Toledo beating ULL, and taking App to 2OT in their building during alum weekend proves the tops are similar in the SBC and MAC, even in a down year for the MAC. But the SBC is getting better steadily every season while the MAC is declining. The middle of their league from 3 to 11 is better than the MAC as well. CMU won largely because they're out performing their NET in the past month and a half. I'd say CMU is a top 175 team, not the 250 or whatever when creating the matchups. Southern enrollment to a now football league is increasing while the MAC in large is losing students. That helps home courts as the students care about Athletics plus there's just more of em. I envy the Sunbelt in 2024... I'm nostalgic at what the MAC once was. FB leagues should not fall behind the 14th best league. A10 and Big East are the only ones who should be investing at our level. Sad stuff. Horizon and OVC and Missouri Valley firmly ahead of the MAC now... wtf.

(02-10-2024 06:15 PM)SMTTT2020 Wrote:  Southern Miss beats Western Michigan 86-54

USM led 54-48 with 12:33 when the takeover began:
- WMU didn't make a FG over the final 12:33 of the game
- final 12:33 saw WMU's only points come on 6 FTs
- USM had a 21-0 run which was part of a 28-2 run
- USM outscored WMU 32-6 to close out the game

Well, in our defense, nobody claimed our team was any good. Or plays defense.

(02-11-2024 09:05 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:02 PM)axeme Wrote:  It’s been apparent all season that there isn’t relative quality top to bottom. I have been trying to think when the last time this year’s teams would be better than a previous MAC season if matched up like this Sun Belt Challenge. 1 vs. 1, 2 vs. 2 etc. Certainly not in this century and 90’s MAC basketball was pretty strong as well. I think from 1 to 12 this is a historically bad season. Let’s just hope it’s an anomaly, although I have a sneaky feeling that it’s more likely a trend, given the portal, NIL, etc.

All mid-majors struggle with the portal and NIL. I feel the issue is more and more MAC schools are underfunding their basketball teams in order to spend money on football or hockey. In college sports a coach isn't just the X and O's guy, he's also the GM. Quality coaches lead to quality programs. I just don't see MAC programs going out and spending to get high caliber coaches.

First, a high caliber coach (unless he's under the radar) isn't going to come to a MAC school. If they do and are successful, they are immediately poached by a P4 program and you are back to another coaching search.

Spend away! Good luck keeping them.

(02-12-2024 02:46 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 01:44 PM)Polish Hammer Wrote:  ... From the beginning it was a bad deal to lock into games with a bad conference like the SBC, they didn't deserve to be on the floor with MAC schools.

If the Troy Trojans (NET 133) didn't deserve to be on the floor with Kent State (NET 179), it seems like nobody told the Trojans.

The Sunbelt has 4 teams above 150 NET at this point in time, the MAC has 2.

Thanks, but you’re quoting me paraphrasing somebody else’s complaints and nonstop rants about the SBC.

(02-12-2024 04:55 PM)MileHighBronco Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 09:05 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:02 PM)axeme Wrote:  It’s been apparent all season that there isn’t relative quality top to bottom. I have been trying to think when the last time this year’s teams would be better than a previous MAC season if matched up like this Sun Belt Challenge. 1 vs. 1, 2 vs. 2 etc. Certainly not in this century and 90’s MAC basketball was pretty strong as well. I think from 1 to 12 this is a historically bad season. Let’s just hope it’s an anomaly, although I have a sneaky feeling that it’s more likely a trend, given the portal, NIL, etc.

All mid-majors struggle with the portal and NIL. I feel the issue is more and more MAC schools are underfunding their basketball teams in order to spend money on football or hockey. In college sports a coach isn't just the X and O's guy, he's also the GM. Quality coaches lead to quality programs. I just don't see MAC programs going out and spending to get high caliber coaches.

First, a high caliber coach (unless he's under the radar) isn't going to come to a MAC school. If they do and are successful, they are immediately poached by a P4 program and you are back to another coaching search.

Spend away! Good luck keeping them.

I'm not saying go out and get Calipari. I'm more talking about how Toledo poached Kowalczyk from Green Bay where he was having success. Akron got Groce, a guy who struck out at a P6, but had previous success at the mid-major level. Ohio attempted to do something similar to Toledo by poaching Boals, but it hasn't worked out. It seems most MAC programs are going after first time head coaches instead of going after guys who have had proven success.

You act like losing your coach because you've had a successful program is a bad thing. It certainly beats your coach being so bad that you have to fire them and pay them a large buy out. Akron lost Dambrot then got Groce. Buffalo lost Hurley then got Oats. You act as though MAC football doesn't face the same challenges. Would you have preferred Fleck to perpetually win 5-7 games per year that way your program could keep him? I'd guess not.

(02-12-2024 03:48 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Southern enrollment to a now football league is increasing while the MAC in large is losing students. That helps home courts as the students care about Athletics plus there's just more of em. I envy the Sunbelt in 2024... I'm nostalgic at what the MAC once was. FB leagues should not fall behind the 14th best league. A10 and Big East are the only ones who should be investing at our level. Sad stuff. Horizon and OVC and Missouri Valley firmly ahead of the MAC now... wtf.

Maybe the MAC should reconsider being a football league. Perhaps some schools should drop football a level or so and redirect that money into the basketball programs. What is football doing for them that a few cool extra million into a sport with only 5 players wouldn't benefit from?

(02-12-2024 05:43 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 04:55 PM)MileHighBronco Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 09:05 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:02 PM)axeme Wrote:  It’s been apparent all season that there isn’t relative quality top to bottom. I have been trying to think when the last time this year’s teams would be better than a previous MAC season if matched up like this Sun Belt Challenge. 1 vs. 1, 2 vs. 2 etc. Certainly not in this century and 90’s MAC basketball was pretty strong as well. I think from 1 to 12 this is a historically bad season. Let’s just hope it’s an anomaly, although I have a sneaky feeling that it’s more likely a trend, given the portal, NIL, etc.

All mid-majors struggle with the portal and NIL. I feel the issue is more and more MAC schools are underfunding their basketball teams in order to spend money on football or hockey. In college sports a coach isn't just the X and O's guy, he's also the GM. Quality coaches lead to quality programs. I just don't see MAC programs going out and spending to get high caliber coaches.

First, a high caliber coach (unless he's under the radar) isn't going to come to a MAC school. If they do and are successful, they are immediately poached by a P4 program and you are back to another coaching search.

Spend away! Good luck keeping them.

I'm not saying go out and get Calipari. I'm more talking about how Toledo poached Kowalczyk from Green Bay where he was having success. Akron got Groce, a guy who struck out at a P6, but had previous success at the mid-major level. Ohio attempted to do something similar to Toledo by poaching Boals, but it hasn't worked out. It seems most MAC programs are going after first time head coaches instead of going after guys who have had proven success.

You act like losing your coach because you've had a successful program is a bad thing. It certainly beats your coach being so bad that you have to fire them and pay them a large buy out. Akron lost Dambrot then got Groce. Buffalo lost Hurley then got Oats. You act as though MAC football doesn't face the same challenges. Would you have preferred Fleck to perpetually win 5-7 games per year that way your program could keep him? I'd guess not.

hasn't worked out according to whom?

(02-13-2024 12:10 AM)inductchuck16 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 03:48 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Southern enrollment to a now football league is increasing while the MAC in large is losing students. That helps home courts as the students care about Athletics plus there's just more of em. I envy the Sunbelt in 2024... I'm nostalgic at what the MAC once was. FB leagues should not fall behind the 14th best league. A10 and Big East are the only ones who should be investing at our level. Sad stuff. Horizon and OVC and Missouri Valley firmly ahead of the MAC now... wtf.

Maybe the MAC should reconsider being a football league. Perhaps some schools should drop football a level or so and redirect that money into the basketball programs. What is football doing for them that a few cool extra million into a sport with only 5 players wouldn't benefit from?

Hard to redirect football money elsewhere when football is the money maker in the first place.

https://knightnewhousedata.org/fbs/mac#!...he_money-1

Take away the money from media, CFP, guarantee games, etc and it would be hard to fund anything.

(02-13-2024 10:05 AM)freshtop Wrote:  

(02-13-2024 12:10 AM)inductchuck16 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 03:48 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Southern enrollment to a now football league is increasing while the MAC in large is losing students. That helps home courts as the students care about Athletics plus there's just more of em. I envy the Sunbelt in 2024... I'm nostalgic at what the MAC once was. FB leagues should not fall behind the 14th best league. A10 and Big East are the only ones who should be investing at our level. Sad stuff. Horizon and OVC and Missouri Valley firmly ahead of the MAC now... wtf.

Maybe the MAC should reconsider being a football league. Perhaps some schools should drop football a level or so and redirect that money into the basketball programs. What is football doing for them that a few cool extra million into a sport with only 5 players wouldn't benefit from?

Hard to redirect football money elsewhere when football is the money maker in the first place.

https://knightnewhousedata.org/fbs/mac#!...he_money-1

Take away the money from media, CFP, guarantee games, etc and it would be hard to fund anything.

Indeed, the MAC doesn't have a contract with ESPN because of basketball. MAC basketball wouldn't get the miniscule coverage it gets now if not for MAC football.

Besides, no one cares about FCS. The 2024 FCS NC game barely had over 1 million viewers despite being broadcast on ABC. Every MAC bowl game, except for one, had better TV ratings.

Also, multiple articles have shown how FCS football losses more money than G5 football because of the loss in game guarantees, media payouts, decrease in ticket sales, and loss of CFP money shares.

https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/sports/.../84332590/

(02-13-2024 11:15 AM)epasnoopy Wrote:  

(02-13-2024 10:05 AM)freshtop Wrote:  

(02-13-2024 12:10 AM)inductchuck16 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 03:48 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Southern enrollment to a now football league is increasing while the MAC in large is losing students. That helps home courts as the students care about Athletics plus there's just more of em. I envy the Sunbelt in 2024... I'm nostalgic at what the MAC once was. FB leagues should not fall behind the 14th best league. A10 and Big East are the only ones who should be investing at our level. Sad stuff. Horizon and OVC and Missouri Valley firmly ahead of the MAC now... wtf.

Maybe the MAC should reconsider being a football league. Perhaps some schools should drop football a level or so and redirect that money into the basketball programs. What is football doing for them that a few cool extra million into a sport with only 5 players wouldn't benefit from?

Hard to redirect football money elsewhere when football is the money maker in the first place.

https://knightnewhousedata.org/fbs/mac#!...he_money-1

Take away the money from media, CFP, guarantee games, etc and it would be hard to fund anything.

Indeed, the MAC doesn't have a contract with ESPN because of basketball. MAC basketball wouldn't get the miniscule coverage it gets now if not for MAC football.

Besides, no one cares about FCS. The 2024 FCS NC game barely had over 1 million viewers despite being broadcast on ABC. Every MAC bowl game, except for one, had better TV ratings.

Also, multiple articles have shown how FCS football losses more money than G5 football because of the loss in game guarantees, media payouts, decrease in ticket sales, and loss of CFP money shares.

https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/sports/.../84332590/

Apparently a million people cared. that's more than "nobody."

(02-13-2024 09:25 AM)bobcat_backer Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 05:43 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 04:55 PM)MileHighBronco Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 09:05 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:02 PM)axeme Wrote:  It’s been apparent all season that there isn’t relative quality top to bottom. I have been trying to think when the last time this year’s teams would be better than a previous MAC season if matched up like this Sun Belt Challenge. 1 vs. 1, 2 vs. 2 etc. Certainly not in this century and 90’s MAC basketball was pretty strong as well. I think from 1 to 12 this is a historically bad season. Let’s just hope it’s an anomaly, although I have a sneaky feeling that it’s more likely a trend, given the portal, NIL, etc.

All mid-majors struggle with the portal and NIL. I feel the issue is more and more MAC schools are underfunding their basketball teams in order to spend money on football or hockey. In college sports a coach isn't just the X and O's guy, he's also the GM. Quality coaches lead to quality programs. I just don't see MAC programs going out and spending to get high caliber coaches.

First, a high caliber coach (unless he's under the radar) isn't going to come to a MAC school. If they do and are successful, they are immediately poached by a P4 program and you are back to another coaching search.

Spend away! Good luck keeping them.

I'm not saying go out and get Calipari. I'm more talking about how Toledo poached Kowalczyk from Green Bay where he was having success. Akron got Groce, a guy who struck out at a P6, but had previous success at the mid-major level. Ohio attempted to do something similar to Toledo by poaching Boals, but it hasn't worked out. It seems most MAC programs are going after first time head coaches instead of going after guys who have had proven success.

You act like losing your coach because you've had a successful program is a bad thing. It certainly beats your coach being so bad that you have to fire them and pay them a large buy out. Akron lost Dambrot then got Groce. Buffalo lost Hurley then got Oats. You act as though MAC football doesn't face the same challenges. Would you have preferred Fleck to perpetually win 5-7 games per year that way your program could keep him? I'd guess not.

hasn't worked out according to whom?

He hasn't been bad. I guess I just expected Ohio would consistently be contending at the top of the MAC, especially after how his tenure started. Looking back saying it hasn't worked out was unfair. It also kind of furthers my point that the quickest way for the MAC to improve as a whole is for more teams to go out and get coaches who have shown the ability to win at the mid-major level.