(10-13-2017 07:36 AM)Greenroom Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 11:33 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said in August that about 1 million people would be uninsured in 2018 and insurance companies would raise premium prices by about 20 percent for ObamaCare plans if the payments were cut off.

The CBO also said halting the payments would increase the federal deficit by $194 billion through 2026.

In other words, people are losing their healthcare under Obamacare and the prices will skyrocket even higher.

This is the real Obamacare. Now, if we remove all of the grandfathered plans, as well as perks and subsidies for government employees, we can force everyone onto it. When that happens, support for Obamacare drops to 30%. The exact number of people who get this sh*t for free and get subsidies for sitting on their ass.

Welcome to Trumpcare.. This is all Trumps baby at this point. Will be interesting to see how this works out.

Guess President Trump is a fan of EO afterall.

I think this is RhinoCare.

https://hotair.com/archives/2017/10/13/t...stitution/

It's funny that dems had the chance to include these payments in the law but didn't to avoid a negative CBO review. They thought they would have a majority Congress for a long time. So many miscalculations contributed to making this the most divisive law in multiple generations

(10-12-2017 11:33 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said in August that about 1 million people would be uninsured in 2018 and insurance companies would raise premium prices by about 20 percent for ObamaCare plans if the payments were cut off.

The CBO also said halting the payments would increase the federal deficit by $194 billion through 2026.

In other words, people are losing their healthcare under Obamacare and the prices will skyrocket even higher.

This is the real Obamacare. Now, if we remove all of the grandfathered plans, as well as perks and subsidies for government employees, we can force everyone onto it. When that happens, support for Obamacare drops to 30%. The exact number of people who get this sh*t for free and get subsidies for sitting on their ass.

The DC crowd have single payer system and it is great for them. Bernie Sanders is the only one that said we should give the same health care plan that they get. Bernie Sanders is actually the real honest one up on the hill that sees the problems with the whole health care system. Everybody else have blinders on.

One more thought. Trump is forcing Dems to defend and advocate for billion dollar payout to evil and greedy insurance corporations

(10-12-2017 10:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:05 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

Quote:"The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful," she continued.

"The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system. Congress needs to repeal and replace the disastrous Obamacare law and provide real relief to the American people."

So the Trump admin is halting illegal actions put in place by the Obama administration?

So what's the problem?

Without these payments to the insurance companies? The companies could go bankrupt and go out of business. With that happening, than the whole health care industry will go in very chaotic mess were everybody have no health care at all. That is why Republicans let the payments go because they want to keep the insurance companies stabled. Cutting that off? It could be disastrous for everybody. Trump is not a good leader if he does not realized that what he is doing is actually harming the whole health care system without any replacement. The replacement he signed today was tried before and failed.

He has just lined up Congress against a firing squad. The WH needs to get this message out, go full brimstone and fire, insurance companies will go bankrupt, you will lose your coverage, etc. Force congress to either fund the subsidies (which would all but guarantee anybody with an ® or (I) next to their names would be voted out, or to pass a repeal of Obamacare that was promised multiple times under the previous administration. Trump is playing hardball and I like it. He has the advantage, he has the higher approval, he has the moral high ground on this one. R's promised a repeal, he's making them follow up or show their true colors.

(10-13-2017 08:55 AM)solohawks Wrote:  One more thought. Trump is forcing Dems to defend and advocate for billion dollar payout to evil and greedy insurance corporations

Interesting take... I like it!

(10-13-2017 08:59 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:05 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

Quote:"The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful," she continued.

"The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system. Congress needs to repeal and replace the disastrous Obamacare law and provide real relief to the American people."

So the Trump admin is halting illegal actions put in place by the Obama administration?

So what's the problem?

Without these payments to the insurance companies? The companies could go bankrupt and go out of business. With that happening, than the whole health care industry will go in very chaotic mess were everybody have no health care at all. That is why Republicans let the payments go because they want to keep the insurance companies stabled. Cutting that off? It could be disastrous for everybody. Trump is not a good leader if he does not realized that what he is doing is actually harming the whole health care system without any replacement. The replacement he signed today was tried before and failed.

He has just lined up Congress against a firing squad. The WH needs to get this message out, go full brimstone and fire, insurance companies will go bankrupt, you will lose your coverage, etc. Force congress to either fund the subsidies (which would all but guarantee anybody with an ® or (I) next to their names would be voted out, or to pass a repeal of Obamacare that was promised multiple times under the previous administration. Trump is playing hardball and I like it. He has the advantage, he has the higher approval, he has the moral high ground on this one. R's promised a repeal, he's making them follow up or show their true colors.

Some of the Republicans are from very poor states with most of their citizens have benefited from ACA. They could be voted out if they vote for repeal. It is a double edge sword. Tom Cotton is in trouble in this state since many in his voting district including me have benefited from the ACA. He is being pressure from his voters to keep ACA and from Bannon who wants Republicans to kill everything..

(10-13-2017 08:59 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  He has just lined up Congress against a firing squad. The WH needs to get this message out, go full brimstone and fire, insurance companies will go bankrupt, you will lose your coverage, etc. Force congress to either fund the subsidies (which would all but guarantee anybody with an ® or (I) next to their names would be voted out, or to pass a repeal of Obamacare that was promised multiple times under the previous administration. Trump is playing hardball and I like it. He has the advantage, he has the higher approval, he has the moral high ground on this one. R's promised a repeal, he's making them follow up or show their true colors.

You are absolutely on the mark with this post.

(10-13-2017 09:04 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 08:59 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:05 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

Quote:"The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful," she continued.

"The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system. Congress needs to repeal and replace the disastrous Obamacare law and provide real relief to the American people."

So the Trump admin is halting illegal actions put in place by the Obama administration?

So what's the problem?

Without these payments to the insurance companies? The companies could go bankrupt and go out of business. With that happening, than the whole health care industry will go in very chaotic mess were everybody have no health care at all. That is why Republicans let the payments go because they want to keep the insurance companies stabled. Cutting that off? It could be disastrous for everybody. Trump is not a good leader if he does not realized that what he is doing is actually harming the whole health care system without any replacement. The replacement he signed today was tried before and failed.

He has just lined up Congress against a firing squad. The WH needs to get this message out, go full brimstone and fire, insurance companies will go bankrupt, you will lose your coverage, etc. Force congress to either fund the subsidies (which would all but guarantee anybody with an ® or (I) next to their names would be voted out, or to pass a repeal of Obamacare that was promised multiple times under the previous administration. Trump is playing hardball and I like it. He has the advantage, he has the higher approval, he has the moral high ground on this one. R's promised a repeal, he's making them follow up or show their true colors.

Some of the Republicans are from very poor states with most of their citizens have benefited from ACA. They could be voted out if they vote for repeal. It is a double edge sword. Tom Cotton is in trouble in this state since many in his voting district including me have benefited from the ACA. He is being pressure from his voters to keep ACA and from Bannon who wants Republicans to kill everything..

I'm sure some will be in a tight spot. If Tom Cotton was elected soley to keep Obamacare in place and it gets repealed, I have no doubt he will be voted out. Fortunately for him, I would wager the majority of his base did not vote him in for that reason.

Bottom line is a repeal was promised multiple times. Now that the opportunity is here, a select few are balking. Time to get off the road to guaranteed failure and a single payer system and back to what made sense for the vast majority of Americans.

Obama wasnt the king he thought he was. Lol.

(10-13-2017 09:37 AM)shere khan Wrote:  Obama wasn't the king he thought he was. Lol.

And Trump isn't the dummy as portrayed......

The three holding up repeal in the Senate aren't up for reelection

(10-12-2017 10:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:05 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

Quote:"The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful," she continued.

"The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system. Congress needs to repeal and replace the disastrous Obamacare law and provide real relief to the American people."

So the Trump admin is halting illegal actions put in place by the Obama administration?

So what's the problem?

Without these payments to the insurance companies? The companies could go bankrupt and go out of business. With that happening, than the whole health care industry will go in very chaotic mess were everybody have no health care at all. That is why Republicans let the payments go because they want to keep the insurance companies stabled. Cutting that off? It could be disastrous for everybody. Trump is not a good leader if he does not realized that what he is doing is actually harming the whole health care system without any replacement. The replacement he signed today was tried before and failed.

So you advocate continuing criminal activity in order to prop us big corporations at the expense of the tax payer?

(10-13-2017 02:58 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 11:41 PM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  The insurance companies already adjusted in anticipation for the subsidies to be cut off.

Nope. The subsidies never had anything to do with the rates. That's a red herring. The rates are based on the estimated cost of the payouts. The subsidies just helped some people pay thier insurance bill. What ran the rates up is more sick people and fewer healthy people buying insurance. That's what happens when you cover preexisting conditions with no mandate to buy insurance. Without the subsidy, you get to see Obamacare for the failed system it really is.

Government subsidy always equal higher prices which rise faster than the rate of inflation.

Cutting off subsidies makes the private business do what they would normally otherwise do, i.e. effectively compete in the marketplace for customers.

(10-13-2017 07:36 AM)Greenroom Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 11:33 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said in August that about 1 million people would be uninsured in 2018 and insurance companies would raise premium prices by about 20 percent for ObamaCare plans if the payments were cut off.

The CBO also said halting the payments would increase the federal deficit by $194 billion through 2026.

In other words, people are losing their healthcare under Obamacare and the prices will skyrocket even higher.

This is the real Obamacare. Now, if we remove all of the grandfathered plans, as well as perks and subsidies for government employees, we can force everyone onto it. When that happens, support for Obamacare drops to 30%. The exact number of people who get this sh*t for free and get subsidies for sitting on their ass.

Welcome to Trumpcare.. This is all Trumps baby at this point. Will be interesting to see how this works out.

Guess President Trump is a fan of EO afterall.

Frankly, I'm OK with it.

Under ObamaCare my cadillac plan (offered as a component of compensation) wnt into the crapper. My premiums rose, my copays rose and my dedeuctibles rose.

ObamaCare prices me and tens of millions of others out of effective healthcare in an effort to redistribute income.


This is a wonderful day.

(10-12-2017 11:06 PM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:58 PM)hburg Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:10 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:05 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

Quote:"The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful," she continued.

"The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system. Congress needs to repeal and replace the disastrous Obamacare law and provide real relief to the American people."

So the Trump admin is halting illegal actions put in place by the Obama administration?

So what's the problem?

Without these payments to the insurance companies? The companies could go bankrupt and go out of business. With that happening, than the whole health care industry will go in very chaotic mess were everybody have no health care at all. That is why Republicans let the payments go because they want to keep the insurance companies stabled. Cutting that off? It could be disastrous for everybody. Trump is not a good leader if he does not realized that what he is doing is actually harming the whole health care system without any replacement. The replacement he signed today was tried before and failed.

The problem with politics is that they often throw money at a broken system and then just delay the inevitable. Why is it so popular to bail out companies that are known to have bad business practices? The insurance industry is full of greedy money grabbers and Obama and others just propped them up. The whole system is flawed and needs to be completely overhauled. How? No idea.

Oh, I agree. I'm wondering how this effects people in the short term. Obamacare was a bridge to a single payer (a terrible one at that). Trump just accelerated the single payer but he may already know that because he wants his name on it.

I had a lot of trouble following the initial complaint because it was so full of hyperbole and talking points... Trump, Republicans and Insurers all bad, even when doing what Obamacare was designed to do in the first place.

Let me try and make it simple
1) TrumpCare is not 'Republican'. He disagrees and is essentially a fan of single payer, but he isn't hammering it down anyone's throat so far. Equating the two is 'silly', but dems do it a lot because most (on both sides) don't know what they're talking about w/r/t healthcare and healthcare reform/finance. That is one part of the conversation

2) the other part of the conversation is that a President usurping Congressional budget authority as the courts ruled was done here should be a concern to everyone... especially opponents of Trump. The whole idea that 'its okay when my guy does it' is just short-sighted and/or ignorant of how things work. The power for 'your guy' to abuse the system is the power for 'the guy you despise' to do the same.

If you're a fan of single payer but NOT of Trump, you should like what is happening here.... even though it strikes down some of Obama's legacy.

Breaking: Trump stabs at the heart of Obamacare by ending subsidies
Oct 12, 2017 11:23 pm

Following is a factual quote.

Quote:“the Government cannot lawfully make the cost-sharing reduction payments. The United States House of Representatives sued the previous administration in Federal court for making these payments without such an appropriation, and the court agreed that the payments were not lawful.”

“The bailout of insurance companies through these unlawful payments is yet another example of how the previous administration abused taxpayer dollars and skirted the law to prop up a broken system,”

Some people may not be happy with the results, but Obama based his socialized healthcare debacle on illegal practices.

It raises the question, in my mind at least, as to whether he should be charged with a crime.

Quote:Insurers were to receive $10 billion in these subsidies in 2018.

Estimates had suggested those subsidy payments would've reached over $100B within the next decade.

in some way this may help drive premiums down. insurances know everyone will be paying full cost so they will have to price accordingly.

(10-13-2017 07:36 AM)Greenroom Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 11:33 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said in August that about 1 million people would be uninsured in 2018 and insurance companies would raise premium prices by about 20 percent for ObamaCare plans if the payments were cut off.

The CBO also said halting the payments would increase the federal deficit by $194 billion through 2026.

In other words, people are losing their healthcare under Obamacare and the prices will skyrocket even higher.

This is the real Obamacare. Now, if we remove all of the grandfathered plans, as well as perks and subsidies for government employees, we can force everyone onto it. When that happens, support for Obamacare drops to 30%. The exact number of people who get this sh*t for free and get subsidies for sitting on their ass.

Welcome to Trumpcare.. This is all Trumps baby at this point. Will be interesting to see how this works out.

Guess President Trump is a fan of EO afterall.

What comes next is Trump Care. But no, we are still under the great and wonderful Lord Saviors plan. See, this is what happens when you pass laws you haven't read. Turns out the Dems rushed through an incomplete bill. Lol....Nancy Pelosi--master legislator--passes an incomplete bill and the president---who didn't read it either---signed it. Now you want to blame Trump when a lawsuite pointing out the failure is forcing the payments to stop? Lol....classic.

(10-13-2017 09:50 AM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 07:36 AM)Greenroom Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 11:33 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said in August that about 1 million people would be uninsured in 2018 and insurance companies would raise premium prices by about 20 percent for ObamaCare plans if the payments were cut off.

The CBO also said halting the payments would increase the federal deficit by $194 billion through 2026.

In other words, people are losing their healthcare under Obamacare and the prices will skyrocket even higher.

This is the real Obamacare. Now, if we remove all of the grandfathered plans, as well as perks and subsidies for government employees, we can force everyone onto it. When that happens, support for Obamacare drops to 30%. The exact number of people who get this sh*t for free and get subsidies for sitting on their ass.

Welcome to Trumpcare.. This is all Trumps baby at this point. Will be interesting to see how this works out.

Guess President Trump is a fan of EO afterall.

Frankly, I'm OK with it.

Under ObamaCare my cadillac plan (offered as a component of compensation) wnt into the crapper. My premiums rose, my copays rose and my dedeuctibles rose.

ObamaCare prices me and tens of millions of others out of effective healthcare in an effort to redistribute income.


This is a wonderful day.

Exactly. I love that EVERYONE will see how much this boondoggle really costs the individual. The middle class has been humping this full load for three years while the Democrats crowed about how wonderful Obamacare was. Let's see how much they want to claim ownership when the everyone has to pay thier fair share.