(09-17-2017 08:31 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

C'mon, Kap.

This wasn't a guy with a machete. Clearly a troubled kid, with a swiss army knife or maybe a leatherman.

And no, they wouldn't announce it in advance, schit we did this stuff when I worked as a doorman/bouncer at some reasonably large bars/clubs.

One of us keeps the person distracted and watching, looking at us, another guy takes him out from the back or side. Quick full nelson and throw them out the door.

And these are trained Cops, not part-time help, dope smoking surfers trying to make some extra bucks and pick up on drunk chicks.

I'm as big a backer as near anyone, but lethal force in this instance... dunno.

How many knives did you face?

How many "mentally disturbed" people did you face who turned out to be actually surfing the illicit pharmaceutical wave?

How many innocent bystanders were you trying to protect?

Maybe what you should do since you are the expert in handling this kind of situation is this

http://police.gatech.edu/careers-gtpd

Quote:The Georgia Tech Police Department is looking for individuals committed to making this Department one of the best in the country. We seek honest, courteous, and compassionate individuals who are dedicated to leadership and excellence. We are seeking people who can work independently and as a member of a team, people who can lead and who can follow. If you possess these qualities, you could enjoy a rewarding and enriching career with the Georgia Tech Police Department.

Or you can realize that perhaps the reason that the methods employed by "part-time dope smoking surfers" aren't used by professional law enforcement agencies is that they were stupid as hell and only the good Lord looking out for drunks or fools did it not result in someone getting hurt or killed. I mean Charleston Fire Dept successfully fought structure fire for decades the way they fought the Sofa Super Store fire. Doesn't change the fact that the methods and tactics they used were dangerous as hell and resulted in nine firefighters dying that day.

(09-17-2017 08:50 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:24 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

Probably end up stabbed. Easy to say if you aren't the one getting stabbed.

I would say better equipment of the non-lethal variety might have helped here.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

that's my take....I'm also with paul's perspective....not sure why the shot was fired in the lethal zone....

however, I wasn't there and you never know what the perp could do in return....

also, this is from the article that wasn't quoted by the OP....

Quote:According to the GBI, Georgia Tech Police officers responded to a 911 call about a person with a knife and a gun on the downtown Atlanta campus at 11:17 p.m.

all I see is another twisted event gone wrong and engineered by a supposed intelligent person that couldn't survive the onslaught of the brainwashed 'cuckland' he prescribed to....

it will hardly be the last time we see stories like this....

the (law)d and everyone else knows the media will also hype it to ad nauseam....

some kids today are just simply ****** when they wander off the path of normalcy....from sexuality to work ethic to the family....

as a hypothetical exercise......simply imagine how the mental stability of today's kids would exist if 100 years ago.....that's the shite I think about.....that could happen if the USD crumbles....

the boomers were the first 'spoiled generation'.....the thumbtapping generation is hands down a joke w/o a fk'n clue....

Shouldn't shock anyone that the Millennials are spoiled indulged brats.
The Boomers are the parents of Millennials.
If the Boomer's parents are the "Greatest Generation," Boomers are the "Worst Generation" and Millennials appear to be "Worst 2.0."

Have to hope Gen X and the children of Gen X have their heads screwed on right or this country is doomed.

(09-17-2017 09:11 PM)mptnstr@44 Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:50 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:24 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

Probably end up stabbed. Easy to say if you aren't the one getting stabbed.

I would say better equipment of the non-lethal variety might have helped here.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

that's my take....I'm also with paul's perspective....not sure why the shot was fired in the lethal zone....

however, I wasn't there and you never know what the perp could do in return....

also, this is from the article that wasn't quoted by the OP....

Quote:According to the GBI, Georgia Tech Police officers responded to a 911 call about a person with a knife and a gun on the downtown Atlanta campus at 11:17 p.m.

all I see is another twisted event gone wrong and engineered by a supposed intelligent person that couldn't survive the onslaught of the brainwashed 'cuckland' he prescribed to....

it will hardly be the last time we see stories like this....

the (law)d and everyone else knows the media will also hype it to ad nauseam....

some kids today are just simply ****** when they wander off the path of normalcy....from sexuality to work ethic to the family....

as a hypothetical exercise......simply imagine how the mental stability of today's kids would exist if 100 years ago.....that's the shite I think about.....that could happen if the USD crumbles....

the boomers were the first 'spoiled generation'.....the thumbtapping generation is hands down a joke w/o a fk'n clue....

Shouldn't shock anyone that the Millennials are spoiled indulged brats.
The Boomers are the parents of Millennials.
If the Boomer's parents are the "Greatest Generation," Boomers are the "Worst Generation" and Millennials appear to be "Worst 2.0."

Have to hope Gen X and the children of Gen X have their heads screwed on right or this country is doomed.

I'm an X'er and the proud parent of an 18.4 yr old that has worked at the earliest age possible....there's no spoiled in my child....she's the only one I could influence....

my boomer generation parents had me mowing yards when I was 9.....

worth ethic.....it's a lost art with too many thanks to decades of failed pussification policy....

I've said this many times before......I'll carry the guilt of bringing a child into this cluster**** to my grave.....I knew better...

(09-17-2017 09:40 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  I've said this many times before......I'll carry the guilt of bringing a child into this cluster**** to my grave.....I knew better...

Don't sweat it Stink. From the way you've talked your daughter will be with the group my sons will be in when this house of cards collapses. They'll use the skulls of the weak as the foundation upon which they rebuild this once great nation.

(09-17-2017 09:48 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 09:40 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  I've said this many times before......I'll carry the guilt of bringing a child into this cluster**** to my grave.....I knew better...

Don't sweat it Stink. From the way you've talked your daughter will be with the group my sons will be in when this house of cards collapses. They'll use the skulls of the weak as the foundation upon which they rebuild this once great nation.

that's what I keep telling myself.....

as the dad of a daughter, I can't help but worry about her future.....

kudos and for that!

CNN. I wait for the real story. I don't trust anything from them

I tell my 21 year old daughter that she was born at the perfect time for success. Never has the level of competition been this weak.

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

It takes roughly 1.5 seconds for a man to cover 21 feet. They should have let him get close enough to stab them.

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

stop making sense.

(09-17-2017 08:28 PM)banker Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

Yeah, people who say "they should just disarm him" obviously don't have any fear (when it's not them that has to rush a guy with a knife). People watch too many movies.

With that said, if he's not rushing you full speed and just walking toward you, a non-lethal shot isn't that difficult for someone properly trained. If he keeps coming after one in the thigh, then shoot him in the chest.

Seriously? The cop misses and hits a bystander instead, what then? Center mass is a much easier target than a thigh, especially on a moving target.

These days campus cops likely have to go through pretty much the same training as real cops, real cops know the dangers associated with not aiming at center mass.

(09-17-2017 08:52 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:28 PM)banker Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

Yeah, people who say "they should just disarm him" obviously don't have any fear (when it's not them that has to rush a guy with a knife). People watch too many movies.

With that said, if he's not rushing you full speed and just walking toward you, a non-lethal shot isn't that difficult for someone properly trained. If he keeps coming after one in the thigh, then shoot him in the chest.

The 21 foot "rule" is there for a reason when dealing with subjects armed with edged weapons.

Research has shown that an average person with good footing going from a dead stop will close the 21 foot distance in between 1.5 and 1.7 seconds.

As for "shooting to wound" there's several reasons why center mass is the aim point in situations like this.

One, an inch this way or an inch that way while shooting at a limb and you not only do not incapacitate the subject you probably just pissed them off that much more. We ran a medical call with the FD for a GSW. Two dudes were at an illegal club and got into a fight. When they were thrown out the resumed throwing hands in the parking lot. The dude getting his ass kicked pulled a .38 and shot his opponent in a leg and an arm, but missed bone and major arteries. When the PD arrived the man shot was on top of the gunman beating the ever-living **** out of him. The gunshot victim was released fromt he hospital several days before the shooter.

Two, you ever tried hitting a moving limb with a handgun?

Three, when you fire your weapon it is consider a use of lethal force even if you do not kill the suspect. You can put yourself in serious legal jeopardy if you state that you shot to wound because if the threat isn't serious enough to kill then lethal force wasn't the correct choice.

thank you for referencing what's known as the Tueller drill.

"Thinking" with your emotions is never a good plan.

(09-17-2017 09:00 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:31 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

C'mon, Kap.

This wasn't a guy with a machete. Clearly a troubled kid, with a swiss army knife or maybe a leatherman.

And no, they wouldn't announce it in advance, schit we did this stuff when I worked as a doorman/bouncer at some reasonably large bars/clubs.

One of us keeps the person distracted and watching, looking at us, another guy takes him out from the back or side. Quick full nelson and throw them out the door.

And these are trained Cops, not part-time help, dope smoking surfers trying to make some extra bucks and pick up on drunk chicks.

I'm as big a backer as near anyone, but lethal force in this instance... dunno.

How many knives did you face?

How many "mentally disturbed" people did you face who turned out to be actually surfing the illicit pharmaceutical wave?

How many innocent bystanders were you trying to protect?

Maybe what you should do since you are the expert in handling this kind of situation is this

http://police.gatech.edu/careers-gtpd

Quote:The Georgia Tech Police Department is looking for individuals committed to making this Department one of the best in the country. We seek honest, courteous, and compassionate individuals who are dedicated to leadership and excellence. We are seeking people who can work independently and as a member of a team, people who can lead and who can follow. If you possess these qualities, you could enjoy a rewarding and enriching career with the Georgia Tech Police Department.

Or you can realize that perhaps the reason that the methods employed by "part-time dope smoking surfers" aren't used by professional law enforcement agencies is that they were stupid as hell and only the good Lord looking out for drunks or fools did it not result in someone getting hurt or killed. I mean Charleston Fire Dept successfully fought structure fire for decades the way they fought the Sofa Super Store fire. Doesn't change the fact that the methods and tactics they used were dangerous as hell and resulted in nine firefighters dying that day.

Who, anywhere, claimed expertise?

Certainly not me. Readily admitted exactly who we were and what we were doing/getting paid for. Relax.

Just saying there is/was pretty clearly a wide asss middle ground here, we gonna start mowing down every drunk kid with a kitchen knife? Running around drunk, or even jacked up on PCP/Meth/acid, whatever?

To answer your specific questions:

How many knives? No idea. Saw one once, number of broken beer bottles (pretty much same thing) had a gun taken off another guy, bad hombre it appears.

Mentally ill? How does one diagnose that in the parking lot of the Electric Circus?!?

Innocent bystanders? Hundreds each night. Perhaps a thousand or two during the better bands nights.

Smithereens used to pack them in pretty good, same as George Thorogood and the Delaware Destroyers...

Finally, when I said part-time dope smoking surfers... I include myself in that group of employ, but will say I was past the dope smoking part by then. Doesn't mean we/they all were.

To the topic at hand-

In your opinion, and I honestly trust your background and expertise (no joke/sarcasm) was there no other avenue here?

I could honestly see a thousand of these "confrontations" every weekend on college campi. Some hammerhead yelling "Come at me Bro!" to the local cops, and they end up dead?

This is where we want to be? That ain' right.

(09-17-2017 08:24 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

Probably end up stabbed. Easy to say if you aren't the one getting stabbed.

I would say better equipment of the non-lethal variety might have helped here.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Was basically agreeing with this.

Pretty clear cry for help from this XE., troubled kid. Needed help, not a bullet.

(09-17-2017 11:22 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:32 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Sounds justified but having said that I don't understand why people that can be brought down non-lethally aren't.

Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

stop making sense.

So, you missed the "course I wasn't there, who knows" part?!?

Don't most, if not all, of the Cops show up in vests? So now we've got a knife at a gunfight I guess. This guy was more a threat to himself than anyone else there, guess he got his desired outcome.

(09-17-2017 08:52 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:28 PM)banker Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:12 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:49 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 07:43 PM)Chappy Wrote:  Yeah, the article mentioned the GT police don't have stun guns. Would have come in handy here and saved a life.

You'd think if it's more than 1 cop, they could simply bum-rush this person and take them down. course I wasn't there, who knows.

Mental illness is something else, tough stuff. Hard to "diagnose" from a computer and 1 news story.

"OK guys...we are going to bum rush this dude. At least one, probably more of us is going to get cut up so bad we are going to look like a road map but we're going. On three. One....two.....THREE!"

Yeah, people who say "they should just disarm him" obviously don't have any fear (when it's not them that has to rush a guy with a knife). People watch too many movies.

With that said, if he's not rushing you full speed and just walking toward you, a non-lethal shot isn't that difficult for someone properly trained. If he keeps coming after one in the thigh, then shoot him in the chest.

The 21 foot "rule" is there for a reason when dealing with subjects armed with edged weapons.

Research has shown that an average person with good footing going from a dead stop will close the 21 foot distance in between 1.5 and 1.7 seconds.

As for "shooting to wound" there's several reasons why center mass is the aim point in situations like this.

One, an inch this way or an inch that way while shooting at a limb and you not only do not incapacitate the subject you probably just pissed them off that much more. We ran a medical call with the FD for a GSW. Two dudes were at an illegal club and got into a fight. When they were thrown out the resumed throwing hands in the parking lot. The dude getting his ass kicked pulled a .38 and shot his opponent in a leg and an arm, but missed bone and major arteries. When the PD arrived the man shot was on top of the gunman beating the ever-living **** out of him. The gunshot victim was released fromt he hospital several days before the shooter.

Two, you ever tried hitting a moving limb with a handgun?

Three, when you fire your weapon it is consider a use of lethal force even if you do not kill the suspect. You can put yourself in serious legal jeopardy if you state that you shot to wound because if the threat isn't serious enough to kill then lethal force wasn't the correct choice.

And if you just happen to miss which is more than likely to happen there is no telling where that bullet ends up. Could easily go down the street hitting someone and killing them.

These people might take training to shoot and hit a target but that's not the same as shooting a person. One moving even slowly makes it that much harder.

Now I do think the cop could have keep backing off like the other one did. But the video is not real clear on whats behind the officer that shot this person. But it looks like just the sidewalk. But even in that case you don't take your eyes off the person threatening you. Walking backwards while holding a gun might not be safe either.

That's why this is a judgement call and not one of us can get in the mind of that person making the choice to fire their gun (who was a female) . I can say I would just keep backing up but I honestly wouldn't know that till I was there. At that point they might see a knife but the call said gun or/and knife.

No matter what we all want to think...99% of cops never want to have to shoot a person. There's always going to be that one. But from the video I saw this wasn't the case. I saw someone say it was a small knife but in the video it looks to have a 3 inch or loner blade. The shot came from what looks like 15ft (5 yards) or less.

(09-17-2017 06:05 PM)bullet Wrote:  He was white. It will probably be quickly forgotten.

He declared himself "non-binary" and went by "they". This will not be so quickly forgotten.

That being said, this is a tragedy.

Anyone wondering why this guy was so screwed up he would walk toward a police officer with a gun pointed at him and a knife in his hand. His mother and those other grownups around him should have got him help instead of calling him "they"

Quote:“They seemed fine. Friends said they seemed fine,” Lynne Schultz told the New York Daily News, using the pronoun “they” for her child, as the student asked people to do.

Speaking from the family’s home town in Lilburn, Ga., she called Schultz a “nonconformist and very, very bright.”

In a statement, Pride Alliance called its late president the “driving force” behind the group for the past two years.

“They pushed us to do more events and a larger variety events, and we would not be the organization we are known as without their constant hard work and dedication,” the statement reads.

(09-17-2017 08:19 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:01 PM)Crackerjackprize Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 06:44 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  Shot by campus police - according to media. Key fact, if true.

I was under the impression that campus cops are generally not armed. Some I've seen are a bit higher quality than mall guards.

Most campus police in this state are real cops with real guns.

I'm surprised.

So I did a quick Google and found quite a few stories about student protesting that the militaristic police who were threats to their safety.

(09-18-2017 06:53 AM)Crackerjackprize Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:19 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 08:01 PM)Crackerjackprize Wrote:  

(09-17-2017 06:44 PM)Cardiff Wrote:  Shot by campus police - according to media. Key fact, if true.

I was under the impression that campus cops are generally not armed. Some I've seen are a bit higher quality than mall guards.

Most campus police in this state are real cops with real guns.

I'm surprised.

So I did a quick Google and found quite a few stories about student protesting that the militaristic police who were threats to their safety.

thank goodness for the internutz and their ability to think their protests mean dick....

one day, they'll grow up and adapt, or continue to be the little pussified shites they currently are....