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(10-13-2017 11:23 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:57 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:43 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:31 PM)WMUGRAD2013 Wrote:  This is a dumb thread, I think Lester is a great coach...but does anyone think Lester is too nice? or that his staff is full of Division II coaches given their experience and previous stops? I don't think it matters but was curious what everyone thinks?

Too nice? What evidence do you have of this? Is it because he always credits the players in a win rather than himself? Should he throw players under the bus when he loses? Should he say, "We've got to get better players," like the last coach did?

Lester- Cuse, WMU, Purdue
John- IU, NW
Kenny- PSU
Daust- Cuse WMU BSU
Moreland- WMU AFA

Nearly every coach on this staff had D1 experience. Remember when Fleck's ST coach quit mid season and was replaced by a GA. Lester needs to hire more like Peej did

As long as Lester gets the results "Peej did," he may hire whoever he wants.

Lester and his staff are doing a fine job. 2-0 in the MAC.

Well, let's see, Lester first 6 games, 4-2, Peej his first 6 games 0-6 with our worst loss in program history.

I know I know, Peej didn't have any players to work with........Terrell, Moten, Braverman, Beavers, Henry, Celescar, Currie, Zamora, Ishmael, all All MAC...........yep nothing to work with

Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

(10-13-2017 11:23 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:57 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:43 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:31 PM)WMUGRAD2013 Wrote:  This is a dumb thread, I think Lester is a great coach...but does anyone think Lester is too nice? or that his staff is full of Division II coaches given their experience and previous stops? I don't think it matters but was curious what everyone thinks?

Too nice? What evidence do you have of this? Is it because he always credits the players in a win rather than himself? Should he throw players under the bus when he loses? Should he say, "We've got to get better players," like the last coach did?

Lester- Cuse, WMU, Purdue
John- IU, NW
Kenny- PSU
Daust- Cuse WMU BSU
Moreland- WMU AFA

Nearly every coach on this staff had D1 experience. Remember when Fleck's ST coach quit mid season and was replaced by a GA. Lester needs to hire more like Peej did

As long as Lester gets the results "Peej did," he may hire whoever he wants.

Lester and his staff are doing a fine job. 2-0 in the MAC.

Well, let's see, Lester first 6 games, 4-2, Peej his first 6 games 0-6 with our worst loss in program history.

I know I know, Peej didn't have any players to work with........Terrell, Moten, Braverman, Beavers, Henry, Celescar, Currie, Zamora, Ishmael, all All MAC...........yep nothing to work with

WMU is the defending MAC Champion for the first time in 30 years. It has not lost a MAC game since November 2015, and has neither a douche-bag, or practitioner of nepotism (http://www.thesportsbank.net/illinois-il...llini-way/) as its head coach. WMU fans have not been able to say all that since Al Molde was coach!

Regardless of our opinions of previous head coaches, we can proud of Lester and where the program is today.

(10-13-2017 11:37 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:23 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:57 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 10:43 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-12-2017 10:31 PM)WMUGRAD2013 Wrote:  This is a dumb thread, I think Lester is a great coach...but does anyone think Lester is too nice? or that his staff is full of Division II coaches given their experience and previous stops? I don't think it matters but was curious what everyone thinks?

Too nice? What evidence do you have of this? Is it because he always credits the players in a win rather than himself? Should he throw players under the bus when he loses? Should he say, "We've got to get better players," like the last coach did?

Lester- Cuse, WMU, Purdue
John- IU, NW
Kenny- PSU
Daust- Cuse WMU BSU
Moreland- WMU AFA

Nearly every coach on this staff had D1 experience. Remember when Fleck's ST coach quit mid season and was replaced by a GA. Lester needs to hire more like Peej did

As long as Lester gets the results "Peej did," he may hire whoever he wants.

Lester and his staff are doing a fine job. 2-0 in the MAC.

Well, let's see, Lester first 6 games, 4-2, Peej his first 6 games 0-6 with our worst loss in program history.

I know I know, Peej didn't have any players to work with........Terrell, Moten, Braverman, Beavers, Henry, Celescar, Currie, Zamora, Ishmael, all All MAC...........yep nothing to work with

Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!! #flecktard #mancrush

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:37 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

(10-13-2017 11:53 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:37 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

(10-13-2017 11:59 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

I don’t dispute that if you want to look solely at what our record might or might not be today.

(10-13-2017 11:59 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:53 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:37 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

Wrong.

WMU would have beaten MSU in 2016. The Broncos had a better Big Ten record (2-1) than MSU, playing better against all three common opponents. WMU would have been a match-up nightmare for MSU.

WMU coulda/shoulda beaten MSU in 2017, but too much transition and exhaustion from the USC game the previous week.

Quote:WMU would have beaten MSU in 2016. The Broncos had a better Big Ten record (2-1) than MSU, playing better against all three common opponents.

True, but I think Dip's point wasn't the on-paper schedule, but the actual teams This Year (including us), last year. I think Dip should have said "If PJ was coaching This Year, he'd be 4-2 too." But if he meant Last year's WMU team with This year's teams we face -- we could be 5-1. Our O would have definitely scored against MSU, and not have been shut out like ours was with this year's team.

Quote:WMU coulda/shoulda beaten MSU in 2017, but too much transition and exhaustion from the USC game the previous week.

It was some injuries, still a little worn out from the previous week to not be 100% endurance/quick mode, but to be fair -- I think most of it was the transition of our new QB & WRs. And the reason we Could have won that game going in is because MSU too has been in transition with new young players. But you're right, it wasn't the WMU team that whipped BSU. :)

Quote:Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

Like what? Be specific or don't drop teasers.

Quote:Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

Like what? Be specific or don't drop teasers.

(10-13-2017 01:08 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  

Quote:Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

Like what? Be specific or don't drop teasers.

You're right.

Not comfortable dropping specifics at this time, so I retract the teasers.

(10-13-2017 12:17 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:59 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:53 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:37 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Which straw man argument do I start with?

Fleck took over a 4-win team trending down, Lester took over a 13-win team trending up.

Half of the players you just mentioned weren’t even starters. Terrell? Lol seriously? It’s not like he inherited the 4-year starter version of Terrell. Henry, All-MAC? Great, so you named like 5 good players. We have about nearly a dozen currently, plus significantly better depth.

Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

Wrong.

WMU would have beaten MSU in 2016. The Broncos had a better Big Ten record (2-1) than MSU, playing better against all three common opponents. WMU would have been a match-up nightmare for MSU.

WMU coulda/shoulda beaten MSU in 2017, but too much transition and exhaustion from the USC game the previous week.

If Peej has this years schedule with this years USC and MSU, he's 4-2. If this team had last year's OOC they might be 6-0 too.

(10-13-2017 11:42 AM)broncofan1 Wrote:  Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

Screenshot, forward to.............

(10-13-2017 01:33 PM)broncofan1 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 01:08 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  

Quote:Don't entertain ChipDip any more. There are very specific reasons for him to hate PJ, and they don't all revolve around the lawsuit. His hatred of Fleck started well before that.

Like what? Be specific or don't drop teasers.

You're right.

Not comfortable dropping specifics at this time, so I retract the teasers.

There's a ton of reasons to be repulsed by Peej. Just watch "Being PJ Fleck," but instead of a perpetual boner why you watch it use some critical thinking.

(10-13-2017 01:51 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 12:17 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:59 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:53 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

Wrong.

WMU would have beaten MSU in 2016. The Broncos had a better Big Ten record (2-1) than MSU, playing better against all three common opponents. WMU would have been a match-up nightmare for MSU.

WMU coulda/shoulda beaten MSU in 2017, but too much transition and exhaustion from the USC game the previous week.

If Peej has this years schedule with this years USC and MSU, he's 4-2. If this team had last year's OOC they might be 6-0 too.

Thanks for clarifying. I do not disagree about this year's schedule. Do about last years, however.

WMU has had just as weak schedules (2008 when the MAC was horrid) and not done as well...particularly against CMU. It is extremely tough to win them all, regardless of who they are (Ball State 2008) and WMU looked strong in its only loss.

At some point, you gotta give the Devil (or Douche-Bag) his due, and move-on. He's gone and ain't coming back to "...taunt you for a 2nd time."

Today WMU is defending MAC Champ for the 1st time in 30 years, has a 3 game win streak against CMU, has not lost a MAC game since 2015, and...FINALLY...has a coach Bronco fans may be proud of on and off the field.

Quote:He's gone and ain't coming back to "...taunt you for a 2nd time."

But what if he gets fired from Minnesota in 3-4 years and Lester gets fired or gets hired somewhere else? Would KB bring back Our Dear Leader? We can only consistently hypothesize!

(10-13-2017 02:15 PM)GullLake Wrote:  WMU has had just as weak schedules (2008 when the MAC was horrid) and not done as well...particularly against CMU. It is extremely tough to win them all, regardless of who they are (Ball State 2008) and WMU looked strong in its only loss.

WMU lost in '08 at CMU - Tim Hiller set the stadium passing yardage record, but we couldn't get off the field on third down against their backup QB. Truly, an aggravating loss.

(10-13-2017 01:51 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 12:17 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:59 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:53 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  

(10-13-2017 11:44 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  Right, you lose a 3 year starter at QB, three NFL picks, previous coach leaves in the dead of night, while stealing players as he exits..........Yep, "trending up."
Doh!!!

Yup, inheriting 13-win team is on an equal plane as inheriting a 4-win team.

And you thought PJ was full of excuses.

Oh please, nothing to make excuses for. If Peej had this schedule last year, he'd be 4-2 six games in.

Wrong.

WMU would have beaten MSU in 2016. The Broncos had a better Big Ten record (2-1) than MSU, playing better against all three common opponents. WMU would have been a match-up nightmare for MSU.

WMU coulda/shoulda beaten MSU in 2017, but too much transition and exhaustion from the USC game the previous week.

If Peej has this years schedule with this years USC and MSU, he's 4-2. If this team had last year's OOC they might be 6-0 too.

If last years OOC had done a complete job our Broncos would have some experience at WR & QB.

(10-13-2017 05:00 PM)okgc Wrote:  If last years OOC had done a complete job our Broncos would have some experience at WR & QB.

I don’t agree.

If it’s a matter of wanting the backup QB to get more rep’s in garbage time, that would’ve gone to Flacco.

Watson and Eskridge did both see a decent amount of snaps last year (although Eskridge was battling injuries). We had 3 starting senior WR’s that were of course going to see the bulk of the snaps. And Ernsberger obviously got plenty of time.

Personally, I think we are making way too much of this whole notion that somehow we’d be in better position today had we played our backups more at the end of blowouts last year. It made little to no difference.