WMUlaxer97
1st String
Posts: 1,697
Joined: Nov 2016
Reputation: 10
I Root For: WMU & UofM
Location: Macomb, MI
|
our wk2 opponent 9/9
Timeline of Michigan State football's ongoing legal, off-field issues
http://www.freep.com/story/sports/colleg...354935001/
I'm very surprised that Dantonio's program has gone into this spiral. The events that have happened since October are numerous. 3 of their players have been charged and will be arraigned soon after a 4 month investigation into sexual assault. Dantonio has the public backing of the AD and school prez. But a loss at home in week 2 vs our Boncos would definitely turn up the burners under the hot seat. Especially if the Vegas line holds up and we enter EL following a nearly 3 TD loss at USC. Sparty faithful may look at this game as a gimme. Needing a 2-0 start, a loss could put a lot of pressure on MSU with a game against ND to follow.
(This post was last modified: 08-13-2017 07:18 AM by WMUlaxer97.)
|
|
06-06-2017 12:41 AM |
|
ColinApocalypse
Moderator
Posts: 9,968
Joined: Jul 2012
Reputation: 111
I Root For: WMU
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
Sexual assault cases, tons of underclassmen leaving the team, 3-9 season last year, no big name playmakers, no QB....things look dire for MSU.
|
|
06-06-2017 08:49 AM |
|
GullLake
Support Hong Kong protesters!
Posts: 2,518
Joined: Jul 2015
Reputation: 46
I Root For: Joe Manchin
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 08:49 AM)ColinApocalypse Wrote: Sexual assault cases, tons of underclassmen leaving the team, 3-9 season last year, no big name playmakers, no QB....things look dire for MSU.
Dire or not, it is still MSU at MSU and it is an early season game for a WMU team in significant transition.
I expect the Broncos to be competitive, but don't expect a victory...as much as I would love to see one.
That said, there are several MAC teams that will likely be stronger than MSU this year. This game, unlike USC where it will be a struggle to be remotely competitive, will be a nice asset to help the Broncos tune-up for conference play.
|
|
06-06-2017 09:44 AM |
|
tayle's mullet
1st String
Posts: 1,432
Joined: Aug 2011
Reputation: 18
I Root For: WMU
Location: West Coast
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
I totally expect a victory, and a decisive one. We are the better team and may even be favored depending on our results in Week 1.
|
|
06-06-2017 12:33 PM |
|
Hoekjeness
Heisman
Posts: 6,383
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 48
I Root For: WMU
Location: Kalamazoo
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 12:33 PM)tayles mullet Wrote: I totally expect a victory, and a decisive one. We are the better team and may even be favored depending on our results in Week 1.
Woah there.
A "decisive victory"? Unlikely.
|
|
06-06-2017 01:07 PM |
|
Hiller4Hyz09
Bronco Addict
Posts: 13,360
Joined: May 2008
Reputation: 174
I Root For: WMU
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
Decisive. 3:30 kickoff.
|
|
06-06-2017 01:41 PM |
|
schwebbs84
1st String
Posts: 1,703
Joined: Aug 2015
Reputation: 9
I Root For: WMU
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
Outside of Corley, who does MSU realistically have at WR? Two upperclassmen and only one of them is on scholarship, I'm guessing.
With so much coming back on defense for our Broncos, the expectations have been set for this team to leave East Lansing victorious.
This program no longer settles for being competitive against larger programs, period.
|
|
06-06-2017 02:14 PM |
|
Hoekjeness
Heisman
Posts: 6,383
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 48
I Root For: WMU
Location: Kalamazoo
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
I expect us to win... but "decisively"? That's pretty optimistic. This year's MSU team is going to have a major chip on their shoulders.
|
|
06-06-2017 02:22 PM |
|
GullLake
Support Hong Kong protesters!
Posts: 2,518
Joined: Jul 2015
Reputation: 46
I Root For: Joe Manchin
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 02:14 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote: Outside of Corley, who does MSU realistically have at WR? Two upperclassmen and only one of them is on scholarship, I'm guessing.
With so much coming back on defense for our Broncos, the expectations have been set for this team to leave East Lansing victorious.
This program no longer settles for being competitive against larger programs, period.
WMU is a team in transition.
A MAC Championship can still be won, but the first few games will be difficult, regardless of who they are against.
Even with the talent and coaches WMU had last year, it narrowly beat Northwestern, Ball State, Eastern Michigan and Ohio.
Don't sound like CMU fans in 2007 (after their 2006 MAC Championship gift from Bill Cubit) before their team lost to North Dakota.
There are gonna be some hiccups before this team hits its stride, but I am confident it WILL hit its stride.
|
|
06-06-2017 02:25 PM |
|
Hoekjeness
Heisman
Posts: 6,383
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 48
I Root For: WMU
Location: Kalamazoo
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 02:25 PM)GullLake Wrote: Even with the talent and coaches WMU had last year, it narrowly beat Northwestern, Ball State, Eastern Michigan and Ohio.
There are gonna be some hiccups before this team hits its stride, but I am confident it WILL hit its stride.
Agree with you on the second line...
But, um... Ball State? We won 52-20.
|
|
06-06-2017 02:48 PM |
|
tayle's mullet
1st String
Posts: 1,432
Joined: Aug 2011
Reputation: 18
I Root For: WMU
Location: West Coast
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
Sorry, but I'm not overly-concerned about a BIG team that squeaked out two FBS wins last year (2-10 Rutgers and 4-8 ND) and has been in dumpster fire mode all offseason. I expect them to put up about the same fight as last year's Illinois squad. Every college football program goes through varying degrees of transition from year to year, and I have faith in our coaching staff and the leadership qualities of these players to get the job done and keep it rolling. WMU will field the superior team on Sept. 9 and that will play itself out.
|
|
06-06-2017 03:19 PM |
|
GullLake
Support Hong Kong protesters!
Posts: 2,518
Joined: Jul 2015
Reputation: 46
I Root For: Joe Manchin
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 02:48 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote: (06-06-2017 02:25 PM)GullLake Wrote: Even with the talent and coaches WMU had last year, it narrowly beat Northwestern, Ball State, Eastern Michigan and Ohio.
There are gonna be some hiccups before this team hits its stride, but I am confident it WILL hit its stride.
Agree with you on the second line...
But, um... Ball State? We won 52-20.
Touche! You are right about Ball State. My bad.
However, I still have nightmares about how that BSU running back carved-us-up the first half. Fortunately, our D coordinator made the necessary adjustments. He's now gone.
|
|
06-06-2017 03:36 PM |
|
wmubroncopilot
Heisman
Posts: 8,027
Joined: Aug 2008
Reputation: 132
I Root For: WMU
Location: Anchorage, AK
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
The only games that were actually in any real doubt late were NW and Ohio.
|
|
06-06-2017 08:15 PM |
|
CincoDosAdios
2nd String
Posts: 289
Joined: Sep 2016
Reputation: 19
I Root For: Western Michiga
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-06-2017 03:36 PM)GullLake Wrote: (06-06-2017 02:48 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote: (06-06-2017 02:25 PM)GullLake Wrote: Even with the talent and coaches WMU had last year, it narrowly beat Northwestern, Ball State, Eastern Michigan and Ohio.
There are gonna be some hiccups before this team hits its stride, but I am confident it WILL hit its stride.
Agree with you on the second line...
But, um... Ball State? We won 52-20.
Touche! You are right about Ball State. My bad.
However, I still have nightmares about how that BSU running back carved-us-up the first half. Fortunately, our D coordinator made the necessary adjustments. He's now gone.
Perhaps our new DC will game plan appropriately to start, and halftime adjustments won't even be necessary
|
|
06-07-2017 05:02 AM |
|
brovol
Heisman
Posts: 5,947
Joined: Nov 2007
Reputation: 181
I Root For: WMU/ARMY
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
I am guessing Vegas will still have us as at least a two touchdown underdog against the Spartans. We will have a new QB, or will be unsettled at QB. New receivers, and we will have likely just taken a pounding at USC. We will be traveling back from California, which can take its toll. We have a new coaching staff, with new coordinators, so everyone on both sides of the ball will be learning new things. It would have been nice if we could have maintained as much continuity as possible during the off season, but it seems there was a choice to do otherwise.
I fear we may have a lot of growing pains this season; which would be very disappointing with as many high caliber athletes returning from one of the very best teams in the history of our conference. I have always liked Lester, and I am praying that he does great. He is an easy guy to root for, and will always be a WMU legend. But I felt the same way about Alan Trammel. Not saying I expect the same results as the Tigers got with Tram, but I really wish Lester embraced what we had the last few years, and decided not to reinvent the wheel. Should have done back-flips to keep our DC, and honestly, continued with the RTB, and everything else which conceptually got the players, coaches, administration, and fans moving together in the same direction to produce an overall broader team result.
We can win at MSU, but we need to be operating like a well oiled machine, with very few errors, turnovers, or breakdowns to do it. MSU still has tremendous talent, and has been a powerhouse school which earned its high rankings over the years. Last year was a down year for the program, and this recent loss of players will be huge, but it is still one of the best teams in the B10 over the past five or so years, and has quality depth. Moreover, they are far less likely to take us lightly, and will themselves have a chip on their shoulder. And dont forget the game is in East Lansing.
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2017 09:27 AM by brovol.)
|
|
06-07-2017 09:25 AM |
|
Rabid Squirrel
Heisman
Posts: 7,310
Joined: Feb 2014
Reputation: 40
I Root For: NIU Huskies
Location: St.charles, IL
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-07-2017 09:25 AM)brovol Wrote: I am guessing Vegas will still have us as at least a two touchdown underdog against the Spartans. We will have a new QB, or will be unsettled at QB. New receivers, and we will have likely just taken a pounding at USC. We will be traveling back from California, which can take its toll. We have a new coaching staff, with new coordinators, so everyone on both sides of the ball will be learning new things. It would have been nice if we could have maintained as much continuity as possible during the off season, but it seems there was a choice to do otherwise.
I fear we may have a lot of growing pains this season; which would be very disappointing with as many high caliber athletes returning from one of the very best teams in the history of our conference. I have always liked Lester, and I am praying that he does great. He is an easy guy to root for, and will always be a WMU legend. But I felt the same way about Alan Trammel. Not saying I expect the same results as the Tigers got with Tram, but I really wish Lester embraced what we had the last few years, and decided not to reinvent the wheel. Should have done back-flips to keep our DC, and honestly, continued with the RTB, and everything else which conceptually got the players, coaches, administration, and fans moving together in the same direction to produce an overall broader team result.
We can win at MSU, but we need to be operating like a well oiled machine, with very few errors, turnovers, or breakdowns to do it. MSU still has tremendous talent, and has been a powerhouse school which earned its high rankings over the years. Last year was a down year for the program, and this recent loss of players will be huge, but it is still one of the best teams in the B10 over the past five or so years, and has quality depth. Moreover, they are far less likely to take us lightly, and will themselves have a chip on their shoulder. And dont forget the game is in East Lansing.
This was the key to WMU's 2016 success. It's also the reason for concern in 2017. Talent wise WMU, Tol., NIU, and Mia are all pretty equal. While star ratings can be iffy for an individual player, for an entire roster it's fairly accurate. 2016 247 Roster talent had Tol. at 79th, WMU 85th,Mia 89th and NIU 95th. MSU was 22nd. Illini was 60th. WMU was running at peak efficiency under Fleck. Terrel was also brilliant with ball security. I think PJ's recruiting hype gave people the impression it was superior athletes that won games. It was superior coaching and QB play. Both now gone. Vs top foes Toledo and NIU, total yards were roughly even. Around 950 to WMUs 1000. But TO's were 5-0 in favor of the Broncos. WMU had an astounding TO ratio of around 23-5. +18. NIU was +1. Tol was -2 or 3.
How the Broncos perform in 2017 is the most interesting MAC story for the early season. Mostly, can Lester keep the Broncos playing great ball? Or will new schemes, new coordinators and just a new atmosphere be too much to overcome.
|
|
06-07-2017 11:19 AM |
|
WMUlaxer97
1st String
Posts: 1,697
Joined: Nov 2016
Reputation: 10
I Root For: WMU & UofM
Location: Macomb, MI
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
Remember that beyond the 3 + 1 MSU players recently dismissed due to sexual assaults they also had 2 players recently transfer to JUCO. Reschke was kicked off the team for dropping the N bomb on a teammate. And I'm missing a couple others. Beyond the seniors that graduated that's a lot of attrition from players expected to take on a large role. And their QB situation wasn't the best last year and still not settled this season.
You could expect the Spartans to either play like a wounded animal or that team could fold like a house of cards. Better believe their coaches will approach each week like their jobs depend on it, because they will. I don't think they will underestimate the Broncos.
Western has plenty of question marks coming in but I think we'll see it settle early in MAC play. It may take time for them to grasp the new systems and we'll need to be patient seeing some mistakes that weren't made last season.
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2017 12:38 PM by WMUlaxer97.)
|
|
06-07-2017 12:36 PM |
|
ejd_5277
Special Teams
Posts: 561
Joined: Aug 2016
Reputation: 11
I Root For: WMU
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-07-2017 09:25 AM)brovol Wrote: I am guessing Vegas will still have us as at least a two touchdown underdog against the Spartans. We will have a new QB, or will be unsettled at QB. New receivers, and we will have likely just taken a pounding at USC. We will be traveling back from California, which can take its toll. We have a new coaching staff, with new coordinators, so everyone on both sides of the ball will be learning new things. It would have been nice if we could have maintained as much continuity as possible during the off season, but it seems there was a choice to do otherwise.
I fear we may have a lot of growing pains this season; which would be very disappointing with as many high caliber athletes returning from one of the very best teams in the history of our conference. I have always liked Lester, and I am praying that he does great. He is an easy guy to root for, and will always be a WMU legend. But I felt the same way about Alan Trammel. Not saying I expect the same results as the Tigers got with Tram, but I really wish Lester embraced what we had the last few years, and decided not to reinvent the wheel. Should have done back-flips to keep our DC, and honestly, continued with the RTB, and everything else which conceptually got the players, coaches, administration, and fans moving together in the same direction to produce an overall broader team result.
We can win at MSU, but we need to be operating like a well oiled machine, with very few errors, turnovers, or breakdowns to do it. MSU still has tremendous talent, and has been a powerhouse school which earned its high rankings over the years. Last year was a down year for the program, and this recent loss of players will be huge, but it is still one of the best teams in the B10 over the past five or so years, and has quality depth. Moreover, they are far less likely to take us lightly, and will themselves have a chip on their shoulder. And dont forget the game is in East Lansing.
I strongly disagree with this. We're getting 20.5 at USC. No way in hell is USC only 5 points better than MSU.
As WMUlaxer97 pointed out, MSU's core (especially defensively) has been decimated by not only players getting kicked off the team, but also another half dozen who either left school or transferred for some other reason. With the exception of running back, this is NOT a deep team in East Lansing. Several walk-ons will probably see at least some playing time on the defensive side of the ball this year.
We won't know for sure until Labor Day, but if you put a gun to my head right now and made me post a number I would make it MSU -5.5 with a total of 54.
On a neutral field I would make it MSU -1.
A spread of 5.5 is equivalent to approximately +200 on the "money line," meaning MSU would have a 66.67% chance of winning the game straight up.
(This post was last modified: 06-08-2017 05:08 AM by ejd_5277.)
|
|
06-08-2017 04:59 AM |
|
brovol
Heisman
Posts: 5,947
Joined: Nov 2007
Reputation: 181
I Root For: WMU/ARMY
Location:
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
(06-08-2017 04:59 AM)ejd_5277 Wrote: (06-07-2017 09:25 AM)brovol Wrote: I am guessing Vegas will still have us as at least a two touchdown underdog against the Spartans. We will have a new QB, or will be unsettled at QB. New receivers, and we will have likely just taken a pounding at USC. We will be traveling back from California, which can take its toll. We have a new coaching staff, with new coordinators, so everyone on both sides of the ball will be learning new things. It would have been nice if we could have maintained as much continuity as possible during the off season, but it seems there was a choice to do otherwise.
I fear we may have a lot of growing pains this season; which would be very disappointing with as many high caliber athletes returning from one of the very best teams in the history of our conference. I have always liked Lester, and I am praying that he does great. He is an easy guy to root for, and will always be a WMU legend. But I felt the same way about Alan Trammel. Not saying I expect the same results as the Tigers got with Tram, but I really wish Lester embraced what we had the last few years, and decided not to reinvent the wheel. Should have done back-flips to keep our DC, and honestly, continued with the RTB, and everything else which conceptually got the players, coaches, administration, and fans moving together in the same direction to produce an overall broader team result.
We can win at MSU, but we need to be operating like a well oiled machine, with very few errors, turnovers, or breakdowns to do it. MSU still has tremendous talent, and has been a powerhouse school which earned its high rankings over the years. Last year was a down year for the program, and this recent loss of players will be huge, but it is still one of the best teams in the B10 over the past five or so years, and has quality depth. Moreover, they are far less likely to take us lightly, and will themselves have a chip on their shoulder. And dont forget the game is in East Lansing.
I strongly disagree with this. We're getting 20.5 at USC. No way in hell is USC only 5 points better than MSU.
As WMUlaxer97 pointed out, MSU's core (especially defensively) has been decimated by not only players getting kicked off the team, but also another half dozen who either left school or transferred for some other reason. With the exception of running back, this is NOT a deep team in East Lansing. Several walk-ons will probably see at least some playing time on the defensive side of the ball this year.
We won't know for sure until Labor Day, but if you put a gun to my head right now and made me post a number I would make it MSU -5.5 with a total of 54.
On a neutral field I would make it MSU -1.
A spread of 5.5 is equivalent to approximately +200 on the "money line," meaning MSU would have a 66.67% chance of winning the game straight up.
I won't bet against my Broncos, but if I could I would jump all over taking the Spartans -5.5. for sure MSU is dealing with a lot, but so are we; probably more with the changes is staff, systems, loss of some of the best players​ in our program's history. And playing on the road the week after a road trip which takes us accross the country. These are very tangible factors. Throw in the fact that we will have a brand new qb, with new recovers to boot? Come on brother, this is still a brand name P5 school we are playing in MSU. I'm not saying we will, but we could end up losing by 30. Could also win by 3. I bet my two touchdown spread is closer to what Vegas has it then your 5.5. Time will tell.
(This post was last modified: 06-08-2017 05:40 AM by brovol.)
|
|
06-08-2017 05:39 AM |
|
Hoekjeness
Heisman
Posts: 6,383
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 48
I Root For: WMU
Location: Kalamazoo
|
RE: A terrible timeline of events for our wk2 opponent and the significance of 9/9
-5.5
I think you're going to be pretty darn close. I had -4/-5 in my head. I'd probably take WMU at -5.5.
O/U 54
Also pretty close I think. I'd probably take the under on that. I think if we can pull it off, it'll be something along the lines of 27-21.
|
|
06-08-2017 07:01 AM |
|