I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

That makes the most sense. Add Murray and a MoSt travel partner next year.

Murray and one of Oral Roberts/UMKC/Little Rock - whichever they deem the best candidate.

If oral Roberts is deemed an appropriate travel partner they would help maintain the public/private balance

(05-09-2017 09:55 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  That makes the most sense. Add Murray and a MoSt travel partner next year.

Murray and one of Oral Roberts/UMKC/Little Rock - whichever they deem the best candidate.

SIU can work as our travel partner. What Smart was referring to is the odd number would put us without a travel partner and it would just make the travel and scheduling problems very difficult.

(05-09-2017 08:54 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 08:32 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  Valpo...meh, seems like an odd fit. They should have visited and added UIC to double up in Chicago. That'd bring more exposure and be better for recruiting.

UIC should've been picked before Loyola, but past is past. MVC would be stupid to double down (and bypass Valpo/Murray) as Loyola's done nothing for them in Chicago.

Valparaiso's 5-year KenPom is 2nd in MVC and 10-year KenPom is 3rd. That's the best fit the MVC could've gotten not named Murray St.

That conference lives and dies on hoops success. Not being a ghost in big cities.

Now the MVC would be writing its own death certificate if it stayed at 10 permanently and/or shunned Murray. But judging by Clif Smart's comments/interview, I'm assuming they're going to 12 with Murray and TBD next March.

Maybe doubling down in Chicago for #12 as their roll of the dice to pair with a reliable choice in Murray would be smart.

Another school adds exposure in the market. Suddenly, the league could carve a niche there instead of just having a toe in. I guarantee you that they would be the second most notable conference in Chicago along with the MAC by adding UIC.

Just because you have a school in there doesn't mean it makes an impact. Two doesn't do much but is way better than one, especially when that one hasn't done anything since the 80's and, really, since the 60's.

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

Makes you think they should add UMKC and they could be a good gamble/project. UMKC sounds like a MVC level school and in a big market.

(05-09-2017 09:55 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  That makes the most sense. Add Murray and a MoSt travel partner next year.

Murray and one of Oral Roberts/UMKC/Little Rock - whichever they deem the best candidate.

What makes you think UALR would leave the Belt? They're a long time member. And is Tulsa (ORU) really that close to Springfield?

Tulsa>>>Springfield 2hr45m
Wichita>>>Springfield 4hr

Would've never guessed if I wasn't screwing with google maps a few weeks back.

Oral Roberts historically is a better program than UALR/UMKC/UWM/UIC/UNO. Very good team in mid-2000's that actually knocked off a #1 Kansas team at Allen Fieldhouse. In 2012, they were an A10 title game upset away from being the last team in. Mabee Center draws very good crowds when that program is decent. Tulsa is a former Valley city.

They've just been a tirefire the last 5 years because of new nutjob President. But that won't last for long.

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

You have it backwards. Missouri State doesn't need a travel partner. In fact the term "travel partner" is a misnomer, it should be "destination partner." You never have a two game travel swing to your partner, rather to all the other partners. Say Murray State and just for (absurd) arguments sake Florida Gulf Coast as Missouri State's "travel partner."

When Missouri State travels to play Valpo, they bus to LUC, and so would FGCU. When they travel to SIU they would bus to Murray, just as FGCU would do. Same for going to Evansville and Indy State, and for Bradley and Illinois State, as well as Drake and UNI. They would get one flight to FGCU a year but so what.

They pain is felt by the others. When LUC and Valpo travel to Missouri State, they then have to fly to FGCU, same for every other pair. Missouri State simply stays in their own beds and waits for the next team to show up in a couple days.

This is why I think people have it all wrong. The odd pair never feel the pain, it's all the other schools. There would in fact be zero pressure on Missouri State about bad travel, but there would be from all the "good pairs" who have to go to the bad pair.

(05-09-2017 11:48 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

You have it backwards. Missouri State doesn't need a travel partner. In fact the term "travel partner" is a misnomer, it should be "destination partner." You never have a two game travel swing to your partner, rather to all the other partners. Say Murray State and just for (absurd) arguments sake Florida Gulf Coast as Missouri State's "travel partner."

When Missouri State travels to play Valpo, they bus to LUC, and so would FGCU. When they travel to SIU they would bus to Murray, just as FGCU would do. Same for going to Evansville and Indy State, and for Bradley and Illinois State, as well as Drake and UNI. They would get one flight to FGCU a year but so what.

They pain is felt by the others. When LUC and Valpo travel to Missouri State, they then have to fly to FGCU, same for every other pair. Missouri State simply stays in their own beds and waits for the next team to show up in a couple days.

This is why I think people have it all wrong. The odd pair never feel the pain, it's all the other schools. There would in fact be zero pressure on Missouri State about bad travel, but there would be from all the "good pairs" who have to go to the bad pair.

That all semantics as usual by you. Mo St needs a "travel partner" because it doesn't want to be the sole focus of an away pair, which would allow the away pair to designate an entire week to prepare for Mo St and never would get to face a tired away team. It's a matter of wins and losses for Mo St, as it would be at a major disadvantage during the conference round robin. Mo St simply opposes 11 teams as it will be the odd travel school.

You can go ahead claim how all this is fictional in my head, as you did before and was so wrong and never even apologized for your ignorance. Basic posting etiquette isn't given by you.

(05-09-2017 11:01 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 10:30 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 10:20 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  MAC, Sun Belt, and C-USA offices are getting some calls for the forseeable future.

I can believe the conference would do this. Sad this is the result. Completely validates Wichita. I wasn't a fan of them wanting to go to the AAC, felt selfish and wanted them to go to the A10, but, if this was the best the Valley could do, run. Just run.

What you're stating seems to be a popular opinion among MVC fans... but I don't really understand how the MVC could realistically "do better". SLU wasn't ever coming: they want actively want to get AWAY from the Midwest (which is what a lot of fans don't seem to understand and/or want to believe) and the *only* league that they want to move to is the Big East. Murray State is a decent basketball school, but was it really going to turn the MVC into a multi-bid conference (particularly when its location isn't very desirable)? Furthermore, if the MVC isn't going to be a multi-bid conference, then isn't adding any additional members beyond 10 going to provide diminishing returns? Finally, if the only other "realistic" conferences for other MVC schools to move to that are an increase in revenue/prestige would require forming an FBS football program from scratch and then hope that the MAC, Sun Belt, et. al provide them with an invite, are those really "realistic" choices at all? The MVC schools don't exactly have a plethora of better options - they're all pretty far from being viable Atlantic 10 candidates at this point (much less Big East candidates) and needing to add FBS football for other "move-up" options isn't exactly a simple or short process. The MVC is honestly the best option that anyone that is still in that league has at this point.

I think you could have applications from virtually everyone from the Big Sky to Southland, to Summit, to Horizon, and OVC. Valpo isn't the best from that entire crop. It's the best all in the Valley can presently agree on.

I don't dislike Valpo. I dislike this resonating vibe speculated to be true of the conference: bus-league politics from flailing private schools and their shrinking programs fighting for self-preservation than holistic improvement. Well, now they get to play more schools hugging the Great Lakes in Chicago and the 'burbs. Great for Evansville, Bradley, and Drake. For the others...well, at least Valpo has some decent hoops. Getting into a new state with even more passionate hoop fans or programs doesn't seem to interest the private schools, though.

I'm watching as a certain near-death conference keeps acquiring flagship programs. And could actually pick up more, then watching it line up against a conference that used to have a similar profile but traded it for small private colleges. What's going on between MVC, Summit, Horizon, and Big Sky...it's very interesting.

You realize the MVC had two teams in Indiana before Valpo, right?

NoDak,

You are being your typical rectum self here. The example I gave was for 12 schools not 11. This is a deliberate misconstruing by your part and constitutes trolling. You are upset at me because I have pointed out how insignificant North Dakota is as a market and how it is not part of the west. and it pisses you off to hear the truth.

So you pretend here not to understand I gave 12 schools in the example. And thus deliberately misconstrue my argument as being for 11 not 12, when it is not. (I make no argument for 11 here)

The entire point of the post was after reading all these posters talking about how Missouri State would "run away" (to the SLC I guess) if they got a bad travel partner as a 12th, made me realize that everyone had it backwards as to who feels the pain. The Big Sky has that exact problem right now. Northern Colorado's travel partner is over 600 miles away in North Dakota. While it's no issue for NoCO and their partner to travel to Weber and bus to Idaho State, or fly to Idaho and bus to EWU, and so on. But it is a huge problem for everyone else to fly to NoCo and then have to fly again to NoDak. The pain is not felt by NoDak and NoCo, but by everyone else. That is why I prefer the term "destination partners" since that is what the pairing really is.

(05-09-2017 11:02 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Tulsa>>>Springfield 2hr45m
Wichita>>>Springfield 4hr

Would've never guessed if I wasn't screwing with google maps a few weeks back.

Oral Roberts historically is a better program than UALR/UMKC/UWM/UIC/UNO. Very good team in mid-2000's that actually knocked off a #1 Kansas team at Allen Fieldhouse. In 2012, they were an A10 title game upset away from being the last team in. Mabee Center draws very good crowds when that program is decent. Tulsa is a former Valley city.

They've just been a tirefire the last 5 years because of new nutjob President. But that won't last for long.

Oral Roberts is okay for what they are. They don't cause any commotion in March and if so, it's been decades. I don't think they're a Valley level program. Horizon maybe but not Valley.

(05-09-2017 04:47 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 03:42 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  More on the MVC expansion.
http://www.ozarkssportszone.com/2017/05/...-addition/

Definitely sounds like they want to push to 12. They picked Valpo because it was the safest choice at the moment.

Could St. Louis be reconsidering now that its clear the BE is keeping a light on for UConn and 11 for the 20 game schedule instead of 12?

Would a MAC school consider the MVC? Akron is in financial trouble and has never won more than 8 games in 25 years. They just cut baseball and could move down to save money. They are willing to spend on basketball coaches. Too far down the food chain in MAC football recruiting, always losing players to Toledo, BGSU and Ohio.

I think that if Akron left the MAC, it would go to the Horizon League. Some Horizon League schools get enough fans/donations for soccer to make it at least close to a revenue sport, and with typically great soccer programs Butler and Loyola having left, and no longer being able to get P5 teams to show up to their stadiums, the Horizon League would do everything they could to get Akron.

(05-09-2017 08:32 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  Valpo...meh, seems like an odd fit. They should have visited and added UIC to double up in Chicago. That'd bring more exposure and be better for recruiting.

Valpo is located in the Chicago area. It's on the edge of the area in Northwest Indiana, but it's still considered to be Chicagoland.

Now, the Chicago media's coverage of anyone outside of the Big Ten or Notre Dame is pretty low outside of the NCAA Tournament. For the MVC's purposes, the value of the Chicago area is more about recruiting both basketball players and "normal" college students.

(05-09-2017 11:59 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 11:48 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

You have it backwards. Missouri State doesn't need a travel partner. In fact the term "travel partner" is a misnomer, it should be "destination partner." You never have a two game travel swing to your partner, rather to all the other partners. Say Murray State and just for (absurd) arguments sake Florida Gulf Coast as Missouri State's "travel partner."

When Missouri State travels to play Valpo, they bus to LUC, and so would FGCU. When they travel to SIU they would bus to Murray, just as FGCU would do. Same for going to Evansville and Indy State, and for Bradley and Illinois State, as well as Drake and UNI. They would get one flight to FGCU a year but so what.

They pain is felt by the others. When LUC and Valpo travel to Missouri State, they then have to fly to FGCU, same for every other pair. Missouri State simply stays in their own beds and waits for the next team to show up in a couple days.

This is why I think people have it all wrong. The odd pair never feel the pain, it's all the other schools. There would in fact be zero pressure on Missouri State about bad travel, but there would be from all the "good pairs" who have to go to the bad pair.

That all semantics as usual by you. Mo St needs a "travel partner" because it doesn't want to be the sole focus of an away pair, which would allow the away pair to designate an entire week to prepare for Mo St and never would get to face a tired away team. It's a matter of wins and losses for Mo St, as it would be at a major disadvantage during the conference round robin. Mo St simply opposes 11 teams as it will be the odd travel school.

You can go ahead claim how all this is fictional in my head, as you did before and was so wrong and never even apologized for your ignorance. Basic posting etiquette isn't given by you.

The MVC doesn't use "travel partners" in Men's BB, the only sport that matters to the MVC. They do partner up for olympic sports and Women's BB, both mentioned by Smart as being an issue if you go to 11.

Doesn't matter. The MVC is not going to add two more schools. What it sounds like is two public schools were pushing for more adds, the rest of the conference agreed to continue "considering" expansion to pacify the two public's pushing for Murray State. "Considering" doesn't mean it will happen. Go back to the CBS Sports article which quotes sources in the room as saying no one really wanted 12 and that the AD's and coaches are happy with 10. The MVC are done expanding. The next add will only occur if another school leaves.

(05-10-2017 12:15 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  You realize the MVC had two teams in Indiana before Valpo, right?

Yes, and three in Illinois before Loyola. The closest any in the Valley were to the Lakes and Chicago are Bradley and Illinois State. Not exactly a metro league.

It is what it is, and Valpo isn't a bad choice. But, again, I don't fault Wichita for leaving, and don't think those who aren't happy with the conference are wrong, either. Private schools are making sure their cuts are first, and you got a bad trade for Creighton that Valpo reminds us could have been done first without needing to go to Loyola at all.

This is becoming a mini Big East or CAA thing.

(05-10-2017 10:24 AM)jacksfan29 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 11:59 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 11:48 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

You have it backwards. Missouri State doesn't need a travel partner. In fact the term "travel partner" is a misnomer, it should be "destination partner." You never have a two game travel swing to your partner, rather to all the other partners. Say Murray State and just for (absurd) arguments sake Florida Gulf Coast as Missouri State's "travel partner."

When Missouri State travels to play Valpo, they bus to LUC, and so would FGCU. When they travel to SIU they would bus to Murray, just as FGCU would do. Same for going to Evansville and Indy State, and for Bradley and Illinois State, as well as Drake and UNI. They would get one flight to FGCU a year but so what.

They pain is felt by the others. When LUC and Valpo travel to Missouri State, they then have to fly to FGCU, same for every other pair. Missouri State simply stays in their own beds and waits for the next team to show up in a couple days.

This is why I think people have it all wrong. The odd pair never feel the pain, it's all the other schools. There would in fact be zero pressure on Missouri State about bad travel, but there would be from all the "good pairs" who have to go to the bad pair.

That all semantics as usual by you. Mo St needs a "travel partner" because it doesn't want to be the sole focus of an away pair, which would allow the away pair to designate an entire week to prepare for Mo St and never would get to face a tired away team. It's a matter of wins and losses for Mo St, as it would be at a major disadvantage during the conference round robin. Mo St simply opposes 11 teams as it will be the odd travel school.

You can go ahead claim how all this is fictional in my head, as you did before and was so wrong and never even apologized for your ignorance. Basic posting etiquette isn't given by you.

The MVC doesn't use "travel partners" in Men's BB, the only sport that matters to the MVC. They do partner up for olympic sports and Women's BB, both mentioned by Smart as being an issue if you go to 11.

Doesn't matter. The MVC is not going to add two more schools. What it sounds like is two public schools were pushing for more adds, the rest of the conference agreed to continue "considering" expansion to pacify the two public's pushing for Murray State. "Considering" doesn't mean it will happen. Go back to the CBS Sports article which quotes sources in the room as saying no one really wanted 12 and that the AD's and coaches are happy with 10. The MVC are done expanding. The next add will only occur if another school leaves.

Missouri State president and Evansville AD both went on record saying 12 is very possible.

(05-10-2017 10:49 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(05-10-2017 10:24 AM)jacksfan29 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 11:59 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 11:48 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  

(05-09-2017 09:43 PM)goofus Wrote:  I don't know. It sounds like Missouri State needs a travel partner. If the MVC does not pick a school close to them, Missouri state might be the next team to leave.

You have it backwards. Missouri State doesn't need a travel partner. In fact the term "travel partner" is a misnomer, it should be "destination partner." You never have a two game travel swing to your partner, rather to all the other partners. Say Murray State and just for (absurd) arguments sake Florida Gulf Coast as Missouri State's "travel partner."

When Missouri State travels to play Valpo, they bus to LUC, and so would FGCU. When they travel to SIU they would bus to Murray, just as FGCU would do. Same for going to Evansville and Indy State, and for Bradley and Illinois State, as well as Drake and UNI. They would get one flight to FGCU a year but so what.

They pain is felt by the others. When LUC and Valpo travel to Missouri State, they then have to fly to FGCU, same for every other pair. Missouri State simply stays in their own beds and waits for the next team to show up in a couple days.

This is why I think people have it all wrong. The odd pair never feel the pain, it's all the other schools. There would in fact be zero pressure on Missouri State about bad travel, but there would be from all the "good pairs" who have to go to the bad pair.

That all semantics as usual by you. Mo St needs a "travel partner" because it doesn't want to be the sole focus of an away pair, which would allow the away pair to designate an entire week to prepare for Mo St and never would get to face a tired away team. It's a matter of wins and losses for Mo St, as it would be at a major disadvantage during the conference round robin. Mo St simply opposes 11 teams as it will be the odd travel school.

You can go ahead claim how all this is fictional in my head, as you did before and was so wrong and never even apologized for your ignorance. Basic posting etiquette isn't given by you.

The MVC doesn't use "travel partners" in Men's BB, the only sport that matters to the MVC. They do partner up for olympic sports and Women's BB, both mentioned by Smart as being an issue if you go to 11.

Doesn't matter. The MVC is not going to add two more schools. What it sounds like is two public schools were pushing for more adds, the rest of the conference agreed to continue "considering" expansion to pacify the two public's pushing for Murray State. "Considering" doesn't mean it will happen. Go back to the CBS Sports article which quotes sources in the room as saying no one really wanted 12 and that the AD's and coaches are happy with 10. The MVC are done expanding. The next add will only occur if another school leaves.

Missouri State president and Evansville AD both went on record saying 12 is very possible.

Very possible... sorry, believe what you want but I don't believe it will happen. Murray? to the President's worried about academics is not a good fit for the prouder, academically inclined MVC schools. A school in MSU's territory? Who can the MVC target? SLU, Little Rock, ORU, UMKC, Omaha. SLU is not moving to the MVC. Little Rock (see SLU). UMKC, UNO or Omaha are your choices. We shall sit back and see. Choosing between those three schools? Moving to 12 could make the MVC worse then they have ever been.

Well, could it be possible this is where/how UTC fits? If they're willing, are you listening?