http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2016/04/20/t...two-years/

"HBO dropped a bomb on the school Tuesday night during a Real Sports program that said the athletic department lost $52 million the last two years and ranks last in Division I football attendance."


http://thebiglead.com/2016/04/20/eastern...-football/

"That’s despite a pilot program to sell beer. The professor estimates the program is costing $1,000 per student. The Eagles have won more than two games once in the past seven years."

(04-22-2016 03:00 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2016/04/20/t...two-years/

"HBO dropped a bomb on the school Tuesday night during a Real Sports program that said the athletic department lost $52 million the last two years and ranks last in Division I football attendance."


http://thebiglead.com/2016/04/20/eastern...-football/

"That’s despite a pilot program to sell beer. The professor estimates the program is costing $1,000 per student. The Eagles have won more than two games once in the past seven years."

Just reading that sentence gave me shivers. Sounds like a struggle for them though. I wish them the best especially if they're in danger of being UAB'd.

(04-22-2016 03:23 PM)TrueBlueDrew Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 03:00 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2016/04/20/t...two-years/

"HBO dropped a bomb on the school Tuesday night during a Real Sports program that said the athletic department lost $52 million the last two years and ranks last in Division I football attendance."


http://thebiglead.com/2016/04/20/eastern...-football/

"That’s despite a pilot program to sell beer. The professor estimates the program is costing $1,000 per student. The Eagles have won more than two games once in the past seven years."

Just reading that sentence gave me shivers. Sounds like a struggle for them though. I wish them the best especially if they're in danger of being UAB'd.

As bad as I hate to say it schools that have shown over a period time that no one comes to the games should drop down. If not the G5 will start to look like FCS with schools that really should not be playing at that level.

Call me a fair weather fan or whatever but to me it makes it hard to want to follow the team when it seems like you're the only fan. I mean I will always love TXST but the Southern Miss game was just awesome besides the loss. Had 27,500 in attendance, I had to miss the Tech game(32,000) and Navy(30,000) for various reasons, so this was the most I had seen in person at Bobcat Stadium. The game was exciting and the atmosphere was amazing. Then we start to suck and the next game I get to make is the NMST game where we have like 14,000 and it just seemed dead. Then the ULM game where we had like 4,000 in attendance was just weird to be a part of, probably how EMU feels every game

At least we're capable of drawing close to 30k with a G5 opponent, I can't imagine being in EMU's shoes.

EMU is a special case. They draw flies. EMU has not had a winning season in 20 years. EMU has had one tying season in 20 years (although they beat 2 FCS teams that year).

And they admit that they can't draw anyone, which is why they have that 'Pepsi deal'.

EMU isn't a start up program
EMU doesn't have anyone trying to torpedo their program either

Their 'butts in seats' attendance is in the below 3k range. Its never a good thing to lose a FBS member, but I simply can't make a case for them to stay.

Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

(04-22-2016 11:18 PM)bluephi1914 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

Yeah, I work with an NLU grad who has totally severed his ties to ULM over the name change issue. I figured he'd get over it in a year or two but he has yet to soften his position on the matter. Of course, he's taken this opportunity to throw 100% of his support to LSU, which is probably what he wanted to do all along. I think that he just used the name issue as an excuse to abandon his alma mater and jump on the LSU bandwagon. ULM doesn't have the market cornered on those guys though. We've got plenty of turncoat alums at LA Tech even without a name change.

How similar to UTA's situation. The name change from Rebels to Mavericks were kinda forced on the student body. There were demonstrations and votes and backroom deals and made many involved feel like it was a done deal without input. UTA then moved their games off campus to a minor league baseball stadium, promptly went 0-10 on their way to ten straight losing seasons (four were at least 5-6). On attendance average hovered in the 5,000's that year too.

Sad to see so many parallels.

So I guess AState is the odd ball in the group? When we changed from Indians to Red Wolves, our merchandise sales, attendance, and donations all went up. There are a few Razorback fans who claim to have degrees from here who still argue that it was stupid to change the name, but those same people still think we're stupid for trying to play FBS football.

(04-22-2016 11:18 PM)bluephi1914 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

There is nothing wrong with change when it is for the better. A lot of alumni of NLU were against the change because of the way it was handled and the deal that Lawson Swearigen made. Also, ULM has not reaped any discernible benefit from the name change as they have allowed the deal to benefit others while netting zero. It was a bad deal for NLU to begin with. Many people realized that.

(04-22-2016 08:59 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  EMU is a special case. They draw flies. EMU has not had a winning season in 20 years. EMU has had one tying season in 20 years (although they beat 2 FCS teams that year).

And they admit that they can't draw anyone, which is why they have that 'Pepsi deal'.

EMU isn't a start up program
EMU doesn't have anyone trying to torpedo their program either

Their 'butts in seats' attendance is in the below 3k range. Its never a good thing to lose a FBS member, but I simply can't make a case for them to stay.

Losing makes you lose in all phases of the program. You have to wonder how committed the admins traitor is though. Do they have the right AD? Are they willing to bring in the right HC and staff and pay them top dollar? If you're going to lose $52M at least let it be an investment in the future.

As an Idaho fan, this story is uplifting. We haven't lost $52 million and we've won more than 2 games THREE times in the past 7 years. We RULE!!!!!

Vandals out.

(04-23-2016 01:17 PM)panama Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 08:59 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  EMU is a special case. They draw flies. EMU has not had a winning season in 20 years. EMU has had one tying season in 20 years (although they beat 2 FCS teams that year).

And they admit that they can't draw anyone, which is why they have that 'Pepsi deal'.

EMU isn't a start up program
EMU doesn't have anyone trying to torpedo their program either

Their 'butts in seats' attendance is in the below 3k range. Its never a good thing to lose a FBS member, but I simply can't make a case for them to stay.

Losing makes you lose in all phases of the program. You have to wonder how committed the admins traitor is though. Do they have the right AD? Are they willing to bring in the right HC and staff and pay them top dollar? If you're going to lose $52M at least let it be an investment in the future.

It's true that winning can fix a lot of problems, but it just gets to the point where enough is enough.

I'm a big believer in what a football team can do to help a school, and I can make an argument for just about every FBS school to stay the course.

Eastern Michigan has no business playing FBS football. They have been terrible for decades, they are playing in front of 1000 people, they are within walking distance of Ann Arbor. Their problems go beyond hiring the right coaching staff.

Time to move on. I don't even know if FCS is the answer; maybe just ditch the football program all together. Take all that money they are flushing down the toilet and maybe put it toward building a top mid major basketball program. Might hurt the die hards in the short terms, but a few NCAA tournament trips would make them feel better.

New Mexico State (not to pile on) is another example. They have been historically terrible for 5 decades and literally can't find a conference to take them. Enough is enough just rip the bandaid off and move. They just are not an FBS program.

(04-23-2016 12:44 PM)stodgdog Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 11:18 PM)bluephi1914 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

There is nothing wrong with change when it is for the better. A lot of alumni of NLU were against the change because of the way it was handled and the deal that Lawson Swearigen made. Also, ULM has not reaped any discernible benefit from the name change as they have allowed the deal to benefit others while netting zero. It was a bad deal for NLU to begin with. Many people realized that.

Why was the name change so unpopular with ULM fans? To me, getting rid of a directional title would seen like a slight advantage.

(04-23-2016 01:51 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  As an Idaho fan, this story is uplifting. We haven't lost $52 million and we've won more than 2 games THREE times in the past 7 years. We RULE!!!!!

Vandals out.

Are you just preparing Doug Fullerton's statement on this issue when the inevitable happens in a couple months?

(04-23-2016 03:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(04-23-2016 01:51 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  As an Idaho fan, this story is uplifting. We haven't lost $52 million and we've won more than 2 games THREE times in the past 7 years. We RULE!!!!!

Vandals out.

Are you just preparing Doug Fullerton's statement on this issue when the inevitable happens in a couple months?

Just the "Vandals out" part, since nobody will be coming to the games anymore and we might as well turn out the lights.

(04-23-2016 12:44 PM)stodgdog Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 11:18 PM)bluephi1914 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

There is nothing wrong with change when it is for the better. A lot of alumni of NLU were against the change because of the way it was handled and the deal that Lawson Swearigen made. Also, ULM has not reaped any discernible benefit from the name change as they have allowed the deal to benefit others while netting zero. It was a bad deal for NLU to begin with. Many people realized that.

What was the reasoning behind the name change?

(04-23-2016 03:58 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(04-23-2016 12:44 PM)stodgdog Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 11:18 PM)bluephi1914 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:04 PM)RamblinRedWolf44 Wrote:  Reading up on them a little bit, they actually had a very loyal fan base once upon a time, but once they decided to retire their old nickname (the "Hurons") it really split the fan base apparently. If memory serves me correctly, their's actually a separate EMU alumni association dedicated solely to the "Hurons".

ULM has a similar separation issue. When Northeast Louisiana changed its name to Louisiana Monore a lot of the alums who graduated from Northeast refused to join in the Louisiana Monroe name change. Now we have those who support ULM and those NLU fans who refuse to support ULM. They have a Facebook page and everything. It's pretty sad how some people just can't adapt to change.

There is nothing wrong with change when it is for the better. A lot of alumni of NLU were against the change because of the way it was handled and the deal that Lawson Swearigen made. Also, ULM has not reaped any discernible benefit from the name change as they have allowed the deal to benefit others while netting zero. It was a bad deal for NLU to begin with. Many people realized that.

Why was the name change so unpopular with ULM fans? To me, getting rid of a directional title would seen like a slight advantage.

Good question ChiefsFan.......not sure why he states it was such a terrible deal. Perhaps he'll enlighten us on that....and why he feels that ULM has 'netted zero' from it?

But I am most curious as to exactly who he is referring to by stating that 'others' have benefited by the deal......and what that benefit has been. Hopefully he will clarify all of this for us.

(04-23-2016 01:17 PM)panama Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 08:59 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  EMU is a special case. They draw flies. EMU has not had a winning season in 20 years. EMU has had one tying season in 20 years (although they beat 2 FCS teams that year).

And they admit that they can't draw anyone, which is why they have that 'Pepsi deal'.

EMU isn't a start up program
EMU doesn't have anyone trying to torpedo their program either

Their 'butts in seats' attendance is in the below 3k range. Its never a good thing to lose a FBS member, but I simply can't make a case for them to stay.

Losing makes you lose in all phases of the program. You have to wonder how committed the admins traitor is though. Do they have the right AD? Are they willing to bring in the right HC and staff and pay them top dollar? If you're going to lose $52M at least let it be an investment in the future.

While Georgia State (and FIU/FAU) also have some attendance issues, EMU really is a special case.

Can EMU point to any recent success in football? No. Their best season in 20 years was 4-6 (plus 2 FCS wins). Ga State can say, "we're getting better". EMU? Nope.

EMU isn't a new program either. They've been around forever. The students and alumni just don't care. At all. Unlike Ga State, EMU isn't selling something new.

And EMU's attendance is a real problem. Excluding the 'Pepsi Games' (where Pepsi bought a bunch of empty seats from EMU to get them to the minimum every other year - now gone.), and subtracting family members of the players, the bands, and the opposing fans, its probable that EMU's true attendance is probably around 1,000 per game. 1,000 per game. Over the last 5 years.

Unlike UAB, there's apparently no plan to do anything about it either at EMU. There's no "we're raising real money from real donors to build a new OCS' (they already have one of those). There's no 'UAT is preventing us from making decisions to be competitive'. There's no nothing. Just continuing to flush more money down the drain.

---

Its true that EMU dropping football might make Ga State's position a bit more uncomfortable. But that doesn't mean that EMU football makes sense at the FBS level. You guys can at least say...our attendance is improving (it is) and we're putting a credible product on the field (you are).