(05-27-2015 02:08 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  I can't believe I'm actually going to defend GSU, but I am... lol GSU would have gone to a bowl if it had moved up when Marshall did, etc... When Marshall moved up, there was no waiting period, so I can certainly give them a pass on that...

GSU and Marshall are VERY similar. Relatively small college town dominated by larger in-state big brother...rabid, kooky and somewhat eccentric fanbases, and the whole town is behind the university...I mean really behind the school...

And then there is the commitment to success. Both schools went through a period of dominating FCS (1-AA) and then made the necessary changes to move up and with the same degree of success.

Bottom line is, IMHO, there has to be a marriage of resources, commitment, market, and a loyal fanbase. If any one of these is missing, then there is a real problem. And I think it has to be done over time and not too quickly. Look at UTSA for instance. They had a couple of what I call "adrenaline" seasons where EVERYONE was so amped up to be 1-A that they had a couple of good seasons, but now they are a dumpster fire.

Sort of OT --
Did you ever notice Marshall's rise sort of coincided with the Tim Stowers' era at Southern? Stowers is a nice guy, but last I heard he was coaching a high school program somewhere. Had Southern gone ahead and hired Paul Johnson THEN, then maybe Marshall wouldn't have those titles and if if's and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

Anyway, much as I don't like Marshall, gotta say your post is on target, except I don't think we've had near the success the Herd has had at this level.

(05-27-2015 02:31 PM)gsu95 Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 02:08 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  I can't believe I'm actually going to defend GSU, but I am... lol GSU would have gone to a bowl if it had moved up when Marshall did, etc... When Marshall moved up, there was no waiting period, so I can certainly give them a pass on that...

GSU and Marshall are VERY similar. Relatively small college town dominated by larger in-state big brother...rabid, kooky and somewhat eccentric fanbases, and the whole town is behind the university...I mean really behind the school...

And then there is the commitment to success. Both schools went through a period of dominating FCS (1-AA) and then made the necessary changes to move up and with the same degree of success.

Bottom line is, IMHO, there has to be a marriage of resources, commitment, market, and a loyal fanbase. If any one of these is missing, then there is a real problem. And I think it has to be done over time and not too quickly. Look at UTSA for instance. They had a couple of what I call "adrenaline" seasons where EVERYONE was so amped up to be 1-A that they had a couple of good seasons, but now they are a dumpster fire.

Sort of OT --
Did you ever notice Marshall's rise sort of coincided with the Tim Stowers' era at Southern? Stowers is a nice guy, but last I heard he was coaching a high school program somewhere. Had Southern gone ahead and hired Paul Johnson THEN, then maybe Marshall wouldn't have those titles and if if's and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

Anyway, much as I don't like Marshall, gotta say your post is on target, except I don't think we've had near the success the Herd has had at this level.

1. That is an interesting observation
2. Perhaps, but we were awfully damned good in '92 and '96. Who knows though?
3. Yet. You're definitely on the right track.

(05-27-2015 02:26 PM)gsu95 Wrote:  The thing about markets is this: If Georgia State ever starts winning big, then they'll be the toast of Georgia and college football. It's a great worst-to-first story and on top of that they're smack dab in the middle of the biggest market in the South, or what passes for the South after decades of mass migration southward.

To me, that's why Georgia State and other similar programs are attractive. If you can put the other pieces of the puzzle together, you got a potentially huge fanbase to tap.

lol. no they won't. and I assume by "winning big" you mean them being a top 25 team. Neither would we. UGA and GT own the state of Georgia. Us or State could fill a nice niche, and make a great name for ourselves, but to think we will knock off GT or UGA as the number 1 or 2 team in the state is insane. It would be one thing if we were idaho and only had Boise State to compete against, or Connecticut, but not Georgia.

(05-27-2015 02:49 PM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 02:26 PM)gsu95 Wrote:  The thing about markets is this: If Georgia State ever starts winning big, then they'll be the toast of Georgia and college football. It's a great worst-to-first story and on top of that they're smack dab in the middle of the biggest market in the South, or what passes for the South after decades of mass migration southward.

To me, that's why Georgia State and other similar programs are attractive. If you can put the other pieces of the puzzle together, you got a potentially huge fanbase to tap.

lol. no they won't. and I assume by "winning big" you mean them being a top 25 team. Neither would we. UGA and GT own the state of Georgia. Us or State could fill a nice niche, and make a great name for ourselves, but to think we will knock off GT or UGA as the number 1 or 2 team in the state is insane. It would be one thing if we were idaho and only had Boise State to compete against, or Connecticut, but not Georgia.

Hm. Tell that to FSU back in the 70s early 80s. The landscape is much different today but going from independent to where they are today was no small feat.

Don't worry about Georgia State, somehow they keep getting bailed out. First, despite having an abysmal football program, they were gifted Turner Field by Kasim Reed. Then the State of Georgia in it's infinite wisdom, announces Georga State is consolidating with Georgia Perimeter College, a community college of 20,000 students. Don't get me started on the Hunter family love fest that the media had during the tournament. They'll turn it around eventually just out of sheer size. I'm curious to see what happens when they retrofit Turner Field. Maybe it goes back closer to its original Centennial Olympic Stadium dimensions with less seats.

Turner Field isn't a done deal yet, is it?

IF C-USA took USA would Jacksonville State have a good shot at the SBC??


Also,if GA ST was taken would it change the top candidate and who would that be?

I think these are possible if UAB drops football.

(05-27-2015 09:22 AM)panama Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 03:42 AM)MJG Wrote:  Texas St fans how much was invested in the move ?
I know the stadium doubled in size did a football operations building get built also. Total infrastructure investment is what I'm looking for not scholarship costs.

Same for Georgia Southern total for stadium and FOC .

Is this an audit?

No just trying to be specific enough to keep the thread from getting hijacked.

Trying to get a better idea of what it would take an EKU or CCU .

Missouri ST recently spent thirty million but did not expand the stadium.

EKU doesn't need as many added seats not sure about the rest.

CCU I know the most about they need to add seats but that is about it.
They built their FOC a couple years ago they have suites nice press box.
Basically every facility they have is new .
There are five or six new school affiliated apartment complexes walking distance to the school and TD sports complex.
They are also building new student housing on campus next to the TD sports complex.The campus will be closed to vehicle traffic soon .
I think parking and better competition will make it all come together.

(05-27-2015 10:30 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 03:18 AM)MJG Wrote:  We have a thousand threads on picking new members.

Facilities is always a big deal and a deal breaker for some.
Texas ST and Georgia Southern improved right before moving up .
I imagine any candidate would have to do the same so pointing out stadium problems is pointless.

Winning is important but how important winning at a lower level guarantees nothing.
Arkansas ST took fourteen years I believe before getting to a bowl game .
They are bowl regulars now and are doing great.

Market yeah that is great if your market cares about you.

Commitment is what really matters it is what has turned the corner for ULL and Ark ST. The reason Georgia Southern and App ST moved up and have been good commitment.

AState and UL were the first Sun Belt schools to immediately use success to start major capital programs. In fairness Troy had made a big outlay ahead of that, but UNT, MTSU, FIU, FAU never tried to capitalize while the iron was hot.

Troy failed in many ways to capitalize on the run of 5 straight football championships and that's one of the many reasons why we have struggled in recent years. The previous AD failed miserably as did several of the people on his staff. There has been a large amount of turn over in 75% of the athletic department since Hartwell was hired. I believe everyone of those hires have been an improvement.


I'm not a Troy fan because of wins and losses.

Our AD was brought kicking and screaming into FBS. An edict (and vote) by the students forced his hand.

That said, we got the new baseball/softball complex (2009) after a nice donation (and a lot of complaining). A donation built the west side complex and more donations got the NEZ built. All in time for our FBS transitional year. There have been upgrades to the soccer/Lacrosse fields and the new T&F stadium was built before they removed the track in BCS.

There is always some construction going on at TXST.

I'd say we started to get ready before we got an invite. We also had to wait for the moratorium to be lifted; to get an invite.

Jim Wacker wanted to do this when he was AD (98-01) but it went nowhere. When the students voted for it (increase in their athletic fee on a 5 year increasing basis) the moratorium was in effect but "The Drive" went into full swing in 2007.

(05-27-2015 02:42 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 02:31 PM)gsu95 Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 02:08 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  I can't believe I'm actually going to defend GSU, but I am... lol GSU would have gone to a bowl if it had moved up when Marshall did, etc... When Marshall moved up, there was no waiting period, so I can certainly give them a pass on that...

GSU and Marshall are VERY similar. Relatively small college town dominated by larger in-state big brother...rabid, kooky and somewhat eccentric fanbases, and the whole town is behind the university...I mean really behind the school...

And then there is the commitment to success. Both schools went through a period of dominating FCS (1-AA) and then made the necessary changes to move up and with the same degree of success.

Bottom line is, IMHO, there has to be a marriage of resources, commitment, market, and a loyal fanbase. If any one of these is missing, then there is a real problem. And I think it has to be done over time and not too quickly. Look at UTSA for instance. They had a couple of what I call "adrenaline" seasons where EVERYONE was so amped up to be 1-A that they had a couple of good seasons, but now they are a dumpster fire.

Sort of OT --
Did you ever notice Marshall's rise sort of coincided with the Tim Stowers' era at Southern? Stowers is a nice guy, but last I heard he was coaching a high school program somewhere. Had Southern gone ahead and hired Paul Johnson THEN, then maybe Marshall wouldn't have those titles and if if's and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

Anyway, much as I don't like Marshall, gotta say your post is on target, except I don't think we've had near the success the Herd has had at this level.

1. That is an interesting observation
2. Perhaps, but we were awfully damned good in '92 and '96. Who knows though?
3. Yet. You're definitely on the right track.

One thing that hurt Marshal no BCS that Randy Moss team was good enough .
Boise was able to take advantage of the BCS era .
I don't know if the Access Bowl will have the same effect if someone makes a future similar run. The CFP might diminish that bowl so winning won't mean as much.

(05-27-2015 04:40 PM)Hemi Man Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 10:30 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(05-27-2015 03:18 AM)MJG Wrote:  We have a thousand threads on picking new members.

Facilities is always a big deal and a deal breaker for some.
Texas ST and Georgia Southern improved right before moving up .
I imagine any candidate would have to do the same so pointing out stadium problems is pointless.

Winning is important but how important winning at a lower level guarantees nothing.
Arkansas ST took fourteen years I believe before getting to a bowl game .
They are bowl regulars now and are doing great.

Market yeah that is great if your market cares about you.

Commitment is what really matters it is what has turned the corner for ULL and Ark ST. The reason Georgia Southern and App ST moved up and have been good commitment.

AState and UL were the first Sun Belt schools to immediately use success to start major capital programs. In fairness Troy had made a big outlay ahead of that, but UNT, MTSU, FIU, FAU never tried to capitalize while the iron was hot.

Troy failed in many ways to capitalize on the run of 5 straight football championships and that's one of the many reasons why we have struggled in recent years. The previous AD failed miserably as did several of the people on his staff. There has been a large amount of turn over in 75% of the athletic department since Hartwell was hired. I believe everyone of those hires have been an improvement.


I'm not a Troy fan because of wins and losses.

Idaho failed to capitalize on its first Bowl win in 1998 two years after moving up.

I think Idaho tried after the 2009 bowl win the plan was to remove the roof and expand. While studying options the dome was declared a fire hazard.Thirty million has been spent so far. eighteen million on safety improvements . New press box new luxury seating 30x50 video board . We already had the FOC and two lighted outdoor spinturf practice fields. Twenty seven million is planned for a seating expansion once our new arena is built. We think we have a athletic friendly president finally . He was an athlete in college and helped South Dakota build an arena and expand football seating.