At the same time UB had zero appearances and he got them to the tourney. I don't think past success matters as much to recruits today as it did previously. Give them exposure and the lure of going pro and you can recruit to any power conference school.

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 01:17 AM)Policiious Wrote:  

(04-09-2015 08:16 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  This was a terrible decision by Hurley clouded by his utter contempt for the Mid American Conference. ASU only has 14 tournament appearances all time and just 3 in the past 20 years. He's got no connections on the west coast and his salary will be $400K-$600K more than at Buffalo, tops. Nothing to sneeze at, sure, but in the coaching world its hardly a game changer.

I thought Hurley was a bratty, arrogant SOB but as long as he was helping to improve the MAC I was happy to have him. Now that he's gone I'll root for him to fail and cheer with glee if he does because I'm petty like that. Hopefully UB can keep their squad intact and hire a solid replacement.

That salary bump is double what he would have made if he stayed at Buffalo. He goes to a Power Conference that is really not that good. It will be easier for him to get ASU to the NCAA than if he took a Big 10, ACC or Big East job. Arizona & Utah are quality programs and Oregon can win a tourney game. UCLA should not have made the tourney this year, they got a big break from the Committee. If he gets ASU into the tourney 2 times he will be in line for another move up

3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Please tell us more about ASU, since you clearly know so much more than the rest of us.

(04-10-2015 06:25 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 01:17 AM)Policiious Wrote:  

(04-09-2015 08:16 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  This was a terrible decision by Hurley clouded by his utter contempt for the Mid American Conference. ASU only has 14 tournament appearances all time and just 3 in the past 20 years. He's got no connections on the west coast and his salary will be $400K-$600K more than at Buffalo, tops. Nothing to sneeze at, sure, but in the coaching world its hardly a game changer.

I thought Hurley was a bratty, arrogant SOB but as long as he was helping to improve the MAC I was happy to have him. Now that he's gone I'll root for him to fail and cheer with glee if he does because I'm petty like that. Hopefully UB can keep their squad intact and hire a solid replacement.

That salary bump is double what he would have made if he stayed at Buffalo. He goes to a Power Conference that is really not that good. It will be easier for him to get ASU to the NCAA than if he took a Big 10, ACC or Big East job. Arizona & Utah are quality programs and Oregon can win a tourney game. UCLA should not have made the tourney this year, they got a big break from the Committee. If he gets ASU into the tourney 2 times he will be in line for another move up

3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Please tell us more about ASU, since you clearly know so much more than the rest of us.

Between the two of them they only said two things about ASU. Anybody on here could tell you more. Just Google ASU.

I don't fault coaches for moving up to better jobs. Most people don't want to be in a job where they can't be promoted if they can perform better than the standard. Even if Hurley or any of the MAC coaches that left ended up being stellar at a MAC school, a MAC school couldn't promote them to something like 'Senior Head Coach'. The only promotion available to a MAC coach is a job in a higher conference

I would never begrudge a coach for taking what he or she perceives to be a better job. I just don't want to hear how they never want to leave, this is their dream job, blah blah.....

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Buffalo had never been. Why not?

(04-10-2015 12:11 PM)OUVan Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Buffalo had never been. Why not?

Because there's not enough data to draw that conclusion. In the 5 seasons prior to Hurley taking over at UB the Bulls averaged 18.6 wins/yr, (and that includes a 14 win season in 'Spoon's final year). In year 1 Hurley won 19 regular season games and went 0-1 in the MAC Tournament. Par for the course. In year two he won 21 regular season games and went 2-0 in the MAC Tournament. He had one good year that was slightly above average in total but was exceptional because he won 8 straight to end the season.

This is not to take away from UB's accomplishments last season but to simply point out that he had 1 above average season which is not a large enough sample size to say confidently that he can go into ASU and get them into the tournament MULTIPLE times.

He has the potential but there are reasonable doubts.

There is something which is incorrect in terms of the terminology. Everyone does it.

Please pardon me for going geek in this post.

There is a tendency to use the term 'sample size' when it really means 'number of observations'.

E.g., The Detroit Tigers have played 3 games this season so the number of observations = 3.

Sample size would be take all 162 games and draw 3 games at random to 'represent' those 162 games.

If these first 3 games 'represent the 162 games' then one is saying that the Tigers will win 162 games and not give up an earned run.

These (first) 3 games don't represent a 'sample' of the season but the first 3 games of the start of the season.

Or a Tiger batter might have had 15 of say 500 at bats.

Typically sample refers to a defined population, e.g. all freshmen, enrolled on a given date, at College X, and a sample is some 'subset' of that population. The rest everyone knows: "random" for which statisticians have many different methods to draw a sample.

The reason for a sample, obviously, is that it is much easier to draw a small sample randomly (e.g., 1,000 registered voters in Ohio) then to interview all registered Ohio voters.

Sorry for getting off topic.

(04-10-2015 12:11 PM)OUVan Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Buffalo had never been. Why not?

school has only been D1 for a bit over 20 years. (or about 40 years less than the span between this football season and Ohio's last MAC football Championship)

Now this is an interesting read, if true. It comes off as one-sided in favor of Hurley, so take it with a big grain of salt. The big revelation to me is that UB's athletic director apparently refuses to deal with coachs' agents. That's a small-time attitude.

http://buckyandsully.buffalonews.com/201...situation/

(04-10-2015 02:48 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 12:11 PM)OUVan Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 02:43 AM)perimeterpost Wrote:  3 tournament appearances in 20 years but Bobby Hurley, a coach with 2 years experience, is going to come in and get them in multiple times?

Buffalo had never been. Why not?

school has only been D1 for a bit over 20 years. (or about 40 years less than the span between this football season and Ohio's last MAC football Championship)

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE!

(04-09-2015 10:48 PM)dannyb73 Wrote:  A high majority of coaches are in it for the pay and when the next job comes calling with a clean slate or more money, they are on the first train out of town. Just the way it works.

The pay is always a factor but these guys are also competitors who like the lime light and they would much rather be in a power conference where there is good shot at an NCAA bid if you are in the top half of your conference rather than in a one-bid league like the MAC.

like Jim Christian the year before the issue with Hurley leaving isn't that he decided to leave, his reason for doing so, or his destination, for both it has to to with the timing. We all understand that there are destinations for a coach beyond the MAC but leaving after only 2 years, and seemingly on the first train out of Dodge, is unexpected. Kent State survived Stan Heath leaving after 1 season, I think Ohio will survive Christian leaving after two, hopefully Buffalo will rebound quickly as well.


p.s. now that both Buffalo and Bowling Green are searching for a new coach and UB signaling that they are willing to put out top dollar it will be interesting to see if BG tries to get competitive or chooses to play it safe and limit themselves to more economical options.

(04-10-2015 08:33 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  like Jim Christian the year before the issue with Hurley leaving isn't that he decided to leave, his reason for doing so, or his destination, for both it has to to with the timing. We all understand that there are destinations for a coach beyond the MAC but leaving after only 2 years, and seemingly on the first train out of Dodge, is unexpected. Kent State survived Gary Waters leaving after 1 season, I think Ohio will survive Christian leaving after two, hopefully Buffalo will rebound quickly as well.


p.s. now that both Buffalo and Bowling Green are searching for a new coach and UB signaling that they are willing to put out top dollar it will be interesting to see if BG tries to get competitive or chooses to play it safe and limit themselves to more economical options.

Waters was at KSU for 5 seasons, went to 2 NCAA tourneys, going 1-2.

(04-10-2015 08:49 PM)axeme Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 08:33 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  like Jim Christian the year before the issue with Hurley leaving isn't that he decided to leave, his reason for doing so, or his destination, for both it has to to with the timing. We all understand that there are destinations for a coach beyond the MAC but leaving after only 2 years, and seemingly on the first train out of Dodge, is unexpected. Kent State survived Gary Waters leaving after 1 season, I think Ohio will survive Christian leaving after two, hopefully Buffalo will rebound quickly as well.


p.s. now that both Buffalo and Bowling Green are searching for a new coach and UB signaling that they are willing to put out top dollar it will be interesting to see if BG tries to get competitive or chooses to play it safe and limit themselves to more economical options.

Waters was at KSU for 5 seasons, went to 2 NCAA tourneys, going 1-2.

I meant Kevin Waters, he coached intramural broom ball for a 1 season before moving on. And Stan Heath too.

(04-10-2015 08:33 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  like Jim Christian the year before the issue with Hurley leaving isn't that he decided to leave, his reason for doing so, or his destination, for both it has to to with the timing. We all understand that there are destinations for a coach beyond the MAC but leaving after only 2 years, and seemingly on the first train out of Dodge, is unexpected. Kent State survived Stan Heath leaving after 1 season, I think Ohio will survive Christian leaving after two, hopefully Buffalo will rebound quickly as well.


p.s. now that both Buffalo and Bowling Green are searching for a new coach and UB signaling that they are willing to put out top dollar it will be interesting to see if BG tries to get competitive or chooses to play it safe and limit themselves to more economical options.

All is quiet on the BG front? Haven't heard a good rumor?

What's Hurley's buyout?

if I'm reading this right the original contract says that Hurley's buyout is "one half of the base pay of the remainder of the contract." Last fall the contract was extended to 2019 so that would be 1/2 of $1M ($250K X 4) or $500K. He earned $500K in base salary for 2 years of service and has to pay back $500K for a buyout so UB got a head coach for 2 years for a net salary of $0.00. + incentives.


http://media.bizj.us/view/img/1914691/bo...ou2013.pdf
http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.c...extension/

(04-10-2015 04:48 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Now this is an interesting read, if true. It comes off as one-sided in favor of Hurley, so take it with a big grain of salt. The big revelation to me is that UB's athletic director apparently refuses to deal with coachs' agents. That's a small-time attitude.

http://buckyandsully.buffalonews.com/201...situation/

Bucky is an ass..

I have it on really good authority that everything in that piece is tripe.

http://www.ubbullrun.com/2015/4/10/83809...-few-shots

(04-11-2015 12:26 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-10-2015 04:48 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Now this is an interesting read, if true. It comes off as one-sided in favor of Hurley, so take it with a big grain of salt. The big revelation to me is that UB's athletic director apparently refuses to deal with coachs' agents. That's a small-time attitude.

http://buckyandsully.buffalonews.com/201...situation/

Bucky is an ass..

I have it on really good authority that everything in that piece is tripe.

http://www.ubbullrun.com/2015/4/10/83809...-few-shots

I was laughing out loud at that article and I know next to nothing about Buffalo hoops. The fact that the author believes statements like "I'm so happy in the MAC I would never leave" is patently absurd. Find a coach that didn't say that during contract negotiations.