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This is interesting....and a bit depressing
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bronco89 Offline
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Post: #1
This is interesting....and a bit depressing
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/...0002&abg=1

A "heat map" on fan support by state. You can zoom into a particular city and it will give you the % break-down. If you are a numbers geek this is very cool.

Now for the depressing part......

Only 10% of people living in K-Zoo say that they root for the Broncs. Given the tailgating thread we need to become very fan friendly.
10-08-2014 09:05 AM
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flushtheherd Offline
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Post: #2
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
I challenge the accuracy of these kind of reports. The kalamazoo area is probably riddled with people that BOTH follow MSU/UofM and the Broncos... however when approached for response they likely are led to pick either MSU/UofM or ND... The NY Times likely cares more about how the landscape is displayed regarding the power conference schools vs teams from lower MAC schools... Do you really think that the greater Grand Rapids area is devoid of any GVSU football fans?
10-08-2014 09:15 AM
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bronco89 Offline
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RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 09:15 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I challenge the accuracy of these kind of reports. The kalamazoo area is probably riddled with people that BOTH follow MSU/UofM and the Broncos... however when approached for response they likely are led to pick either MSU/UofM or ND... The NY Times likely cares more about how the landscape is displayed regarding the power conference schools vs teams from lower MAC schools... Do you really think that the greater Grand Rapids area is devoid of any GVSU football fans?

Agreed...it would be interesting to see the actual questions. My favorite marketing prof at Western....Dr. Jay Luinquist would have a field day with this survey.

I believe this was limited to D-1 so GVSU would not be a choice on the survey
10-08-2014 09:36 AM
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Wheres_Waldo? Offline
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RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
IMO, this shines a light on a major problem with WMU Athletics that has existed for years...lack of brand identity. Outside of what appears to be a small group of loyal supporters, WMU has not been able to build a following of new fans. The problem with students not showing up or leaving at half time has existed for years, and it's not going to change itself.

What does WMU stand for? What is their market positioning? What is their competitive point of difference?

WMU is a great school, with a beautiful campus, in a very good location. Lots of tools to work with, just needs a clear direction and a plan they stick to for an extended (2+ years) period of time.
10-08-2014 10:02 AM
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SilentStryk09 Online
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Post: #5
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
Honestly, I'm not sure there is a way to "fix" that problem. It's not exclusive to WMU. It's a problem for nearly every G5 team there is.
10-08-2014 10:58 AM
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flushtheherd Offline
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Post: #6
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...
10-08-2014 11:08 AM
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Chipdip2 Offline
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Post: #7
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
Does it show a correlation between males with Mullets and UM football fans?

Is there any data on people on the Walmart layaway program, and UM fans?

Is there any sales info on enormously fat women purchasing XXXL piss yellow tent t-shirts?
10-08-2014 11:32 AM
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Wheres_Waldo? Offline
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RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 11:08 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...

I think Hockey is a great point. WMU has set a clear course for the program, beginning with the commitment to bring in a higher caliber of coaches and then the ability to get in to the NCHC, the hockey world has seen to taken notice and elevated the perception of the program. Maybe I am too Bronco biased, but there is no legitimate reason WMU cant elevate it's overall position in athletics. The people at the top just need to see the world differently and dare to dream.
10-08-2014 11:48 AM
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wmutkelaw Offline
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Post: #9
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
I don't buy this. My parents are snow birds who live in a senior village in Florida. 3/4 of their neighbors are from the New York/Boston metropolitan area. A lot of them are extreme UConn fans. Syracuse/B.C./Rutgers are actually very well represented.
10-08-2014 11:53 AM
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goldsworth Offline
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Post: #10
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 11:08 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...

There is a part of me that likes the fact that we are a well kept secret.Game day at Waldo when the weather is nice is a great experience....very comfortable and a real value for the money....tailgating on East campus was always the best location especially in early October when the colors are peaking. Traffic is never a hassel and its easy to get around, and you can get a seat at a local resturant or bar after the game! There are a lot of positives for us small but loyal group of fans!
10-08-2014 12:08 PM
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WesternSkillet Offline
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Post: #11
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 11:48 AM)Wheres_Waldo? Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 11:08 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...

I think Hockey is a great point. WMU has set a clear course for the program, beginning with the commitment to bring in a higher caliber of coaches and then the ability to get in to the NCHC, the hockey world has seen to taken notice and elevated the perception of the program. Maybe I am too Bronco biased, but there is no legitimate reason WMU cant elevate it's overall position in athletics. The people at the top just need to see the world differently and dare to dream.

Do you think going to the American Athletic Conference would be a good step to elevate the athletic program?
10-08-2014 01:05 PM
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wmutkelaw Offline
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Post: #12
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 01:05 PM)WesternSkillet Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 11:48 AM)Wheres_Waldo? Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 11:08 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...

I think Hockey is a great point. WMU has set a clear course for the program, beginning with the commitment to bring in a higher caliber of coaches and then the ability to get in to the NCHC, the hockey world has seen to taken notice and elevated the perception of the program. Maybe I am too Bronco biased, but there is no legitimate reason WMU cant elevate it's overall position in athletics. The people at the top just need to see the world differently and dare to dream.

Do you think going to the American Athletic Conference would be a good step to elevate the athletic program?

Yes, no offense to some of the other better MAC schools, but being thrown into the mix with some of the bottom feeder MAC schools (academically) hurts WMU. Do you think Cinci, Xavier, Dayton have a better reputation than the Ohio MAC schools?

I hate the "directional Michigan" crap, considering we have a lot more going on at WMU than other 2 schools lumped in that demeaning name. Does Cinci get lumped in with the other mid-majors? Not anymore, or ever? Cinci is likely not the best example anymore, since they have elevated their product and are not just mid-major. But, then again they were smart enough to look into the future and advance, instead of sitting back and being crapped on like WMU, b/c of some of the degree mills we are associated with, due to our conference identity.

I whole heartedly believe that the MAC is holding some schools back. And with the trend of college sports I think we are on dangerus ground by staying put and not trying to join a conference with a better national brand. I have been saying this for years. I used to want WMU to be in the CUSA, now I really like what the American is doing. Facility wise we are on par with the American.
10-08-2014 01:38 PM
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DesertBronco Offline
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Post: #13
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
Our hockey facilities are amongst the worst in the NCHC.
10-08-2014 02:09 PM
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The Colonel Offline
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Post: #14
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 01:05 PM)WesternSkillet Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 11:48 AM)Wheres_Waldo? Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 11:08 AM)flushtheherd Wrote:  I think you sadly can only "brand" your University with Athletics when you are fighting the battle WMU seems to fight every year. Nobody in the world cared about Boise State until they started crushing the big boys every year in football... Now they aren't doing as great, but you still get HUGE name recognition even after the fact... I am just saying, it does wonders for your schools recognition (as sad as it is) when you can field dangerous teams on the gridiron...

Joining the NCHC in hockey was a huge step. Bringing our brand of hockey to larger markets every year is going to do wonders. However, the college hockey fan base is a fraction of the college football fan base. Basketball is making strides, but getting a win or two in the big dance would go quite a bit further than just nailing down MAC West championships...

At some point I think we all need to just enjoy what we have... and stop caring about what EVERYBODY else thinks... and appreciate that being a Bronco is more than how many people show up to a football game... or how many people are wearing the brown and gold... The die hard bronco fans are probably the most loyal fans out there... period. We not only cheer for our teams on the field, court or ice rink.... but we root on our facilities, current student body, fellow alumni and the recognition of the programs at WMU. We may be a small bunch... but damnit... we are a solid one...

I think Hockey is a great point. WMU has set a clear course for the program, beginning with the commitment to bring in a higher caliber of coaches and then the ability to get in to the NCHC, the hockey world has seen to taken notice and elevated the perception of the program. Maybe I am too Bronco biased, but there is no legitimate reason WMU cant elevate it's overall position in athletics. The people at the top just need to see the world differently and dare to dream.

Do you think going to the American Athletic Conference would be a good step to elevate the athletic program?

Yes - but that's not going to happen. Consider the AAC's current members:

UCF (in Orlando)
Cincinnati
UConn (a couple hours from NYC)
East Carolina
Houston
Memphis
USF (in Tampa)
SMU (in Dallas)
Temple (in Philadelphia)
Tulane (in New Orleans)
Tulsa

With the exception of East Carolina, AAC schools are located in (or near) some fairly large media markets. I highly doubt we (or any other MAC school, for that matter) are on their radar.

I would like to see the MAC make some changes and do some things differently, but we are a good fit for the MAC.
10-08-2014 02:36 PM
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The Colonel Offline
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Post: #15
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
Do you think Cinci, Xavier, Dayton have a better reputation than the Ohio MAC schools? Does Cinci get lumped in with the other mid-majors? Not anymore, or ever? Cinci is likely not the best example anymore, since they have elevated their product and are not just mid-major. But, then again they were smart enough to look into the future and advance.
[/quote]

It probably depends on which Ohio MAC schools these schools are being compared with.

Xavier is in the "new" Big East now. Dayton is in the A-10. Hard to compare WMU to either since basketball is not the straw that stirs the drink, as it is for these two. (I think Xavier and Dayton are also both Jesuit schools, too, unlike us - or any Ohio MAC school.)

Cincinnati does deserve a lot of credit - they have definitely elevated themselves over the years. Basketball helped elevate their profile, and the Dantonio/BK/Butch football run helped to raise it even more. I think there's a good chance they will eventually become a G5 member somewhere.

In the meantime, the Bearcats are thumbing their noses at the MAC - they really want nothing to do with their longstanding football rivalry with Miami, which they have recently dominated...
10-08-2014 02:44 PM
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WheresWaldo42 Offline
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Post: #16
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
While I agree that there are obviously flaws in this and any survey. I also agree that this sheds a representative light on what I personally see and feel around town. I honestly don't think that most people give a rats @$$ about WMU or their athletic programs. Now I am a fan and I follow the teams (as to the rest of you on this board). But I would venture to guess that the average person either has no interest or idea. Or MOST consider themselves fans of UofM, MSU or ND. EVERYONE that I work with would fall into the category of a MSU or UofM fan. In the 15+ years that I have worked in this office, I do not recall anyone really discussing WMU, other to maybe ask me what I think about this team or that team. Most of the discussion revolves exclusively around the UofM/MSU rivalry.

I just think that is the reality of where WMU falls on the pecking order in its own home town. Very low. Unfortunately, I don't know exactly what they could do to change that. As I recall back in the hay day of the Gary Darnell area, there was a buzz like none I ever remember. But those days are long gone in terms of interest.
10-08-2014 03:04 PM
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The Colonel Offline
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Post: #17
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 03:04 PM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote:  I honestly don't think that most people give a rats @$$ about WMU or their athletic programs. Now I am a fan and I follow the teams (as to the rest of you on this board). But I would venture to guess that the average person either has no interest or idea. Or MOST consider themselves fans of UofM, MSU or ND.

I just think that is the reality of where WMU falls on the pecking order in its own home town. Very low. Unfortunately, I don't know exactly what they could do to change that. As I recall back in the hay day of the Gary Darnell area, there was a buzz like none I ever remember. But those days are long gone in terms of interest.

Great post. I agree this is very true.

What could change this? Winning, big and often - those Darnell teams had that buzz because they were entertaining offensively and playing in MAC championship games. If bowl berths were handed out back then the way they are today, those Darnell teams would have gone to four straight bowls.

I consider myself fortunate to have been a WMU student during Darnell's prime. I'd like to believe those days are not gone for good, but until I see evidence to the contrary...
10-08-2014 03:42 PM
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Post: #18
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 02:09 PM)DesertBronco Wrote:  Our hockey facilities are amongst the worst in the NCHC.

Fleck sucked up all the money for renovations 05-stirthepot
10-08-2014 03:45 PM
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wmutkelaw Offline
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Post: #19
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
(10-08-2014 03:45 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  
(10-08-2014 02:09 PM)DesertBronco Wrote:  Our hockey facilities are amongst the worst in the NCHC.

Fleck sucked up all the money for renovations 05-stirthepot

Oh please. 03-puke
10-08-2014 03:59 PM
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DesertBronco Offline
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Post: #20
RE: This is interesting....and a bit depressing
That's terrible!! 01-lauramac2
(This post was last modified: 10-08-2014 04:12 PM by DesertBronco.)
10-08-2014 04:11 PM
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