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Post: #41
RE: Missouri State
Despite the mythology put forward by some lazy columnists, the changes that seem to be on the horizon aren't going to have a mega impact on the G5 schools and I think quite a few G5 will end up better off.

First of all the CFP will provide money to help keep pace. There are 350+ Division I schools, of them 129 are getting a new revenue stream this year in the CFP (not sure just how much BYU, Army, and UMass receive but my understanding is it is substantially less than the G5 conference members).

So 220+ Division I schools have the right to follow the P5 lead but no new revenue source to fund it.

Second the CFP selection committee, if they behave in the manner they state they will, should create an incentive for schools to avoid playing FCS opponents. It is thought that the tools they will have access to (rating systems) are weighted to not only reward playing all FBS to reward playing games out of your regular stadium (note men's basketball had this formalized for a time in RPI and removed it though the committee still gets a breakdown when considering schools).

More G5 programs are taking steps to increase home revenue and have less need for road money games. This will change the scheduling dynamic as well.

I think this points to FCS needing to re-evaluate their model. If game guarantees plateau or become harder to get they are looking at little growth in revenue and possibly a decline. Fewer players will be willing to transfer away from a full ride and cash for a full ride. The other sports will have to increase budget to remain competitive.
08-19-2014 04:51 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 11:22 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  The Valley has lots of pluses for it headquarters in St. Louis, tournament in St. Louis, like minded schools, good geography for Missouri State. But how college athletics is being set up FBS football is the way to go. P5 schools think of the G5 in a better light than the FCS and I-AAA leagues sans the Big East. You better hop on that bus to protect all sports instead of just one IMO.

I am really interested to see what the Valley does with Cost of Attendance. Wichita State is going to for sure want them, but will the other MVC teams be willing to pay that to keep up? Especially without a major revenue stream.

If WSU was to bolt from the Valley, Missouri State would be out the door soon after.
08-19-2014 05:01 PM
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GoApps70 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Missouri State
Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.
08-19-2014 05:09 PM
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Steve1981 Online
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Post: #44
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 04:51 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  First of all the CFP will provide money to help keep pace. There are 350+ Division I schools, of them 129 are getting a new revenue stream this year in the CFP (not sure just how much BYU, Army, and UMass receive but my understanding is it is substantially less than the G5 conference members).

Think Missouri State would be a good add for the Sun Belt. We'll be with the MAC for 2014 and 2015 and take our full share unless the Sun Belt sees a benefit in adding us.

Regarding arkstfan comment on us would flip it a bit. An extra buy game would mostly makeup for the CFP money and the lower CFP money would mostly makeup for the MAC ESPN money. It's not a big draw back for you guys, but we would miss working towards a conference championship being Independent.

Just want to start playing football now and prove all those so called media experts wrong.

Good luck to the Bears and they have hedge things pretty well having affiliate sports in both the SunBelt and MAC.
08-19-2014 08:56 PM
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MissouriStateBears Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 05:01 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 11:22 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  The Valley has lots of pluses for it headquarters in St. Louis, tournament in St. Louis, like minded schools, good geography for Missouri State. But how college athletics is being set up FBS football is the way to go. P5 schools think of the G5 in a better light than the FCS and I-AAA leagues sans the Big East. You better hop on that bus to protect all sports instead of just one IMO.

I am really interested to see what the Valley does with Cost of Attendance. Wichita State is going to for sure want them, but will the other MVC teams be willing to pay that to keep up? Especially without a major revenue stream.

If WSU was to bolt from the Valley, Missouri State would be out the door soon after.

Don't think the Valley will be for it.
08-19-2014 10:16 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 10:16 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:01 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 11:22 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  The Valley has lots of pluses for it headquarters in St. Louis, tournament in St. Louis, like minded schools, good geography for Missouri State. But how college athletics is being set up FBS football is the way to go. P5 schools think of the G5 in a better light than the FCS and I-AAA leagues sans the Big East. You better hop on that bus to protect all sports instead of just one IMO.

I am really interested to see what the Valley does with Cost of Attendance. Wichita State is going to for sure want them, but will the other MVC teams be willing to pay that to keep up? Especially without a major revenue stream.

If WSU was to bolt from the Valley, Missouri State would be out the door soon after.

Don't think the Valley will be for it.

If the Valley says no, you guys wont have much choice but to move. If SBC schools with lower ratings can offer Cost of attendance, and a Higher rated Missouri State cant, where are those kids going to sign?
08-19-2014 10:26 PM
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Post: #47
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.
08-20-2014 12:53 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 12:53 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lets say in theory the MVC doesn't offer Cost of attendance. I think you would see Missouri State ramp up their efforts pretty quickly. Basketball may be their baby, but if they cant grow it without an FBS Football program, they'll start an FBS football program.

Hell, I'd take them just for Olympic Sports for a couple years if they really felt like they needed time to get football ready, but wanted to be able to offer what the Big schools can otherwise.
08-20-2014 01:56 AM
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MJG Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 12:53 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.

There seems to be a lot of uncertainty about the P5 initiatives.
Negative stories coming out from Navy and Hawaii.
No one really knows the true cost of trying to keep pace.
Add to that the normal costs of moving up and money recently spent.

Most likely they will have a wait and see approach.
08-20-2014 03:25 AM
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Post: #50
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 04:51 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Despite the mythology put forward by some lazy columnists, the changes that seem to be on the horizon aren't going to have a mega impact on the G5 schools and I think quite a few G5 will end up better off.

First of all the CFP will provide money to help keep pace. There are 350+ Division I schools, of them 129 are getting a new revenue stream this year in the CFP (not sure just how much BYU, Army, and UMass receive but my understanding is it is substantially less than the G5 conference members).

So 220+ Division I schools have the right to follow the P5 lead but no new revenue source to fund it.

Second the CFP selection committee, if they behave in the manner they state they will, should create an incentive for schools to avoid playing FCS opponents. It is thought that the tools they will have access to (rating systems) are weighted to not only reward playing all FBS to reward playing games out of your regular stadium (note men's basketball had this formalized for a time in RPI and removed it though the committee still gets a breakdown when considering schools).

More G5 programs are taking steps to increase home revenue and have less need for road money games. This will change the scheduling dynamic as well.

I think this points to FCS needing to re-evaluate their model. If game guarantees plateau or become harder to get they are looking at little growth in revenue and possibly a decline. Fewer players will be willing to transfer away from a full ride and cash for a full ride. The other sports will have to increase budget to remain competitive.
Good summary and this is what I have been saying for a long time. Few in the media seem to have picked up on these issues which leads me to believe that most of them are no better informed than the average sports fan or worse, they are pandering to the average sports fan.

If you are a basketball school in an FCS conference and you don't get to or decline to offer cost of attendance your basketball program is doomed. Do you think a single recruit would turn down UALR for Missouri State if UALR came with $5K a year, more meals and more medical coverage after graduation while MSU provided none of those benefits? Schools like MSU, Wichita, Gonzaga, Butler, etc. make their living getting the kids that are just off the radar of the big boys and keeping them around for four years. They will go from fron of the line to the middle of the line.
08-20-2014 08:31 AM
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Post: #51
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 01:56 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(08-20-2014 12:53 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lets say in theory the MVC doesn't offer Cost of attendance. I think you would see Missouri State ramp up their efforts pretty quickly. Basketball may be their baby, but if they cant grow it without an FBS Football program, they'll start an FBS football program.

Hell, I'd take them just for Olympic Sports for a couple years if they really felt like they needed time to get football ready, but wanted to be able to offer what the Big schools can otherwise.
Yeah, I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea to add a few olympic only programs to boost the basketball strength.
08-20-2014 08:33 AM
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SoCalBobcat78 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 01:56 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(08-20-2014 12:53 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lets say in theory the MVC doesn't offer Cost of attendance. I think you would see Missouri State ramp up their efforts pretty quickly. Basketball may be their baby, but if they cant grow it without an FBS Football program, they'll start an FBS football program.

Hell, I'd take them just for Olympic Sports for a couple years if they really felt like they needed time to get football ready, but wanted to be able to offer what the Big schools can otherwise.

At the FCS level, I would not offer cost of attendance to football players. Now if I could offer cost of attendance to 13 male basketball players and 13 female basketball players, then that would work. I think I would be covered under Title IX. But at Missouri State, if I had to offer cost of attendance to every scholarship athlete, I would decide to not offer cost of attendance.
08-20-2014 09:13 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 09:13 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-20-2014 01:56 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(08-20-2014 12:53 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(08-19-2014 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Hate to say it because would like to have Missouri State in the SBC
but they sound more like a basketball first school instead of a
football first school. Many fans seem to reason going G5 would help
their basketball team.

Missouri State pays their head basketball coach $450,000 per year and their head football coach $108,000. Sounds like a basketball school.

I will believe their interested in moving up when I hear it from someone at the school. I am sure the Sun Belt has talked to them at some point. Is there anyone Benson has not talked to about moving up?

Missouri State is in a good basketball conference and for travel the MVC is not bad. A move to the SBC is going to require millions of dollars. They needed a student athletic fee to get the recent upgrade of the athletic facilities, but will the sudents pay again? Will some wealthy donors come through? Will the state of Missouri help out? I think their President has figured out that they are better off at this time in the MVC. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lets say in theory the MVC doesn't offer Cost of attendance. I think you would see Missouri State ramp up their efforts pretty quickly. Basketball may be their baby, but if they cant grow it without an FBS Football program, they'll start an FBS football program.

Hell, I'd take them just for Olympic Sports for a couple years if they really felt like they needed time to get football ready, but wanted to be able to offer what the Big schools can otherwise.

At the FCS level, I would not offer cost of attendance to football players. Now if I could offer cost of attendance to 13 male basketball players and 13 female basketball players, then that would work. I think I would be covered under Title IX. But at Missouri State, if I had to offer cost of attendance to every scholarship athlete, I would decide to not offer cost of attendance.

We're pretty confident right now it will have to be offered to everyone. Or at least the head count sports.

And trust me...Missouri State fans would riot if their school voluntarily chose not to offer that stuff.
08-20-2014 10:57 AM
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GoApps70 Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Missouri State
Isn't it up to the conference to decide that and not the individual school though.
08-20-2014 11:34 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Missouri State
(08-20-2014 11:34 AM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Isn't it up to the conference to decide that and not the individual school though.

Correct. Though a school could voluntarily choose not to offer them if they want. They just cant offer it unless the conference agrees.
(This post was last modified: 08-20-2014 11:43 AM by chiefsfan.)
08-20-2014 11:43 AM
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GaSoEagle Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Missouri State
The Sun Belt is already on record as saying we will offer the cost of attendance thing just like the P5. When the conference says that it would hurt bigtime any school in this conference who said they would not do it. It would hurt their recruting alot, especially is every other team in the conference offers it.
08-20-2014 01:09 PM
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Post: #57
RE: Missouri State
(08-19-2014 04:51 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Second the CFP selection committee, if they behave in the manner they state they will, should create an incentive for schools to avoid playing FCS opponents. It is thought that the tools they will have access to (rating systems) are weighted to not only reward playing all FBS to reward playing games out of your regular stadium (note men's basketball had this formalized for a time in RPI and removed it though the committee still gets a breakdown when considering schools).

The B1G, PAC and B12 are all planning to play 9 game schedules. The SEC and ACC have decided to stay with 8 conference games but they are making sure at least 1 non-conference game is against a P5 opponent.

It definitely sounds like FCS games at P5 stadiums are going the way of the dinosaur. G5 however is still needed to ensure 7-8 lucrative home games for P5 schools. Some P5's don't make the home revenue to buy G5 games so they'll sign 1 for 1's with G5's instead.
08-22-2014 08:24 PM
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MSUBear42 Offline
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Post: #58
Re: Missouri State
So, for what we lack in football, our "Sugar Bears" are consistently one of the best...

http://twitter.com/MSU_SugarBears/status...80/photo/1

[IMG] http://twitter.com/MSU_SugarBears/status...80/photo/1 [/IMG]

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App
(This post was last modified: 08-23-2014 12:25 PM by MSUBear42.)
08-23-2014 12:24 PM
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Steve1981 Online
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Post: #59
RE: Missouri State
[Image: BvsWnJ_CAAENGQh.jpg]
08-23-2014 12:28 PM
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MSUBear42 Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Missouri State
[Image: BvufcXDCQAAIvMo.jpg:large]

[Image: 10556933_10101320153059824_4194116214462790499_o.jpg]

[Image: Bvw8aiACUAANiKo.png]

[Image: Bt5u0fBCUAAc9xi.jpg:large]
08-23-2014 08:13 PM
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