The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

I'm vesting in his succeeding....and leaving. FTFY

(07-15-2014 12:58 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 12:44 PM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 08:13 AM)Cant make this sh t up Wrote:  I hope we are 7-5. WOW, that would really shut up some of the pessimism around here. Realistically, I'm still sticking with 3-4 wins. Mainly because of our young players...who will make mistakes regardless of coaching. BUT, the jury is still out on our coaching staff and that wont be determined until our 2014 and 2015 kids are in the system for couple of years...just sayn

Why would that shut up the pessimism? If anything a preview like this simply sets everyone up for a let down again. See, THESE are the kinds of things that drive me nuts about our program. Obviously, this one didn't come from the Athletic Dept the Football Program itself. But this is the kind of stuff we hear year after year after year.

As I believe maybe Major eluded to earlier that some of us hope this doesn't happen. For me that is not even close to the case. I hope with all my heart that this happens. I just think its foolhardy and silly to think that it will happen. Or to try and spin things as all unicorns and rainbows all the time.

Bleacher Report has their opinion. I'm sure they have a valid reason for it. Good for them and I thank them for their confidence in PJ turning our program around that quickly. Personally, I just don't see it happening, but as they mentioned, there are winnable games early in the schedule and the MAC is a pretty weak conference so maybe they will nail it and prove me wrong.

I'll stick with 4 wins and wish for better.

I don't see ANYONE spinning unicorns and rainbows. I do see a few who clearly are invested in his failure, to the point that they won't even recognize that he's added value to the program.

I'm actually thinking back over the last 10-15 years when I make that comment. Seems like year after year, we always heard that THIS was the year that Ryan Cubit or Tim Hiller or Alex Carder or (insert player here) leads us that elusive MAC Title. I'm just tired of hearing it. That is where my unicorns and rainbows comment comes from.

As for this season. I just don't see how you can make a leap from 1-11 and uncompetitive to 7-5 and bowl eligible with at least a dozen first year players being counted on to contribute heavy minutes and make huge impacts. That's a pretty big jump in my opinion. Like I said, I'm sticking with 3-4 wins and will be pleasantly surprised if the season ends up better than that.

(07-15-2014 01:15 PM)DesertBronco Wrote:  I'm vesting in his succeeding....and leaving. FTFY

So his method of operation in his first year is all it took for you to say, "I hope he succeeds and leaves."

He appears to be more low key, perhaps he has learned somethings along the way. If he has success, matures, and is a bit less egocentric would you at least like us to TRY and retain him? Not that any MAC school can retain a successful coach, but at least wouldnt you want to attempt to keep him here, or are you so jades by year one that nothing can happen that will change your mind?

Has a woman never given you a second chance? But I've changed, I really have!!!

Waldo
As for this season. I just don't see how you can make a leap from 1-11 and uncompetitive to 7-5 and bowl eligible with at least a dozen first year players being counted on to contribute heavy minutes and make huge impacts. That's a pretty big jump in my opinion. Like I said, I'm sticking with 3-4 wins and will be pleasantly surprised if the season ends up better than that.

The MAC isn't the NFL nor does it have a top tier BSC level program that simply attracts better talent and retains great coaches.

Programs graduate great players, lose great coaches, others have stellar recruiting classes, get a great player back from injury (think White), or lose a game changer to injury (think Tipton).

Would NIU have been the same with Lynch hurt? BG replace a senior QB who was good, with an underclassmen recruit who was better, and they won the league.

Things change at the drop of a hat in the league. Kent St. graduated a couple of bball players, got a new, less dynamic coach, and suddenly they go from a near dynasty to pedestrian.

The MAC media and the media in general are lazy when it comes to analyzing teams. They put too much stock in a the previous year, and too little stock in what player makers return and which ones are gone.

UT is the closest thing we have in this league to a consistent winner. Miami once fell into that category, but even they've become unpredictable.

Just when you think you have this league figured out an 0-10 Miami team wins the MAC East. That's why they play the games, and that's why I carry as much optimism as pessimism.

8 wins this year!

Did you all forget about the chocolate milk already?

(07-15-2014 01:34 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 01:15 PM)DesertBronco Wrote:  I'm vesting in his succeeding....and leaving. FTFY

So his method of operation in his first year is all it took for you to say, "I hope he succeeds and leaves."

He appears to be more low key, perhaps he has learned somethings along the way. If he has success, matures, and is a bit less egocentric would you at least like us to TRY and retain him? Not that any MAC school can retain a successful coach, but at least wouldnt you want to attempt to keep him here, or are you so jades by year one that nothing can happen that will change your mind?

Has a woman never given you a second chance? But I've changed, I really have!!!

He succeeds, he leaves. EOD. Anyone with half a brain would leave the MAC when they succeed, there is no longetivity and most either leave when they can, or they try to stay and get burned out, fail, then get axed.

Quote:Why would that shut up the pessimism? If anything a preview like this simply sets everyone up for a let down again.

Because *IF* we got to 7-5, it *WOULD* shut up the pessimism. Not the article itself -- that will (at least for time being) AMP UP the pessimism as you suggest... but *IF* we do get to 7-5, it will shut up the pessimism and break out the DJ for PJ! :)

^ all of that is true.

If we win 7 or 8 games this year, DB will get his wish.

(07-15-2014 06:10 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  If we win 7 or 8 games this year, DB will get his wish.

I have no doubt that there are several just above MAC level AD's out there watching PJ. If he wins 7 games or more next year, he will get a job offer that doubles his salary or more. There are schools that would jump at his energy and ability to recruit talent above the level of his situation.

If PJ moves on he needs to upgrade his staff imo. I was looking at our staff the other day and not much jumps off the page about them other than Oline coach. I still can't get over the fact we hired our GA as special teams coach. He needs a strong DC and OC to be successful imo.

Not trying argue with you here Kimbo, just want to state a few things:

J.B. Gibboney was one of Fleck's best hires coming in, IMO. Hard to predict he would leave so soon (6 months in). Feels like Fleck had little choice but to just hire the G.A. and move things along. That late in the season, it would be tough to find a good replacement. Looks like since then, they've assigned Wenger to special teams. Which brings me to my next point...

Rob Wenger is a very good assistant coach IMO. He is a great recruiter of Florida and has a lot of connections to some big-time talent rich schools down there. I think he's one of the more underrated coaches on our staff.

Vinson Reynolds is another very good assistant IMO, especially for his recruiting ties. Not only does he have great connections in the Detroit area, but we essentially stole him from a rival. He's knocked it out of the park on the recruiting front. Tough to judge his coaching ability based on last year's lack of D-linemen.

Brian Callahan also another very good recruiter in the Chicago area. Bill Kenney spent 20 years at Penn State. I think we are lucky to have him. Love Tim McGarigle, also a very good Chicago area recruiter.

For me, the two biggest question marks are our coordinators. Jury is still out on Ciarrocca and Pinkham. But even then, very hard to tell based on the lack of overall depth and talent from last year's squad. Like Fleck, the next 1-2 years will be telling I think.

Luke Getsy (Green Bay Packers), Charles Huff and Anthony Crespino (Penn St.) all made big jumps in their careers. That's got to say something.

Fleck clearly chose this coaching staff strategically for recruiting purposes, probably knowing that not all of them would last for very long getting compensated the typical MAC salary. I think we've actually had a pretty good staff.

Mike Hart seemed like a good hire last year, but I don't know much of anything about Matt Simon.

(07-15-2014 06:10 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  If we win 7 or 8 games this year, DB will get his wish.

Only if he takes you with him.

(07-15-2014 07:47 PM)DesertBronco Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 06:10 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  If we win 7 or 8 games this year, DB will get his wish.

Only if he takes you with him.

I'm flattered to know I affect you so much.

Oh yeah and your little dog too. Maybe he will make you his personal assistant.

I think you have me confused with someone else. I'm about as far from wanting a career in anything athletics-related... ever.

(07-15-2014 08:05 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  I think you have me confused with someone else. I'm about as far from wanting a career in anything athletics-related... ever.

Awww don't be coy!! Peej will notice and appreciate you soon HJ.

(07-15-2014 07:35 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Not trying argue with you here Kimbo, just want to state a few things:

J.B. Gibboney was one of Fleck's best hires coming in, IMO. Hard to predict he would leave so soon (6 months in). Feels like Fleck had little choice but to just hire the G.A. and move things along. That late in the season, it would be tough to find a good replacement. Looks like since then, they've assigned Wenger to special teams. Which brings me to my next point...

Rob Wenger is a very good assistant coach IMO. He is a great recruiter of Florida and has a lot of connections to some big-time talent rich schools down there. I think he's one of the more underrated coaches on our staff.

Vinson Reynolds is another very good assistant IMO, especially for his recruiting ties. Not only does he have great connections in the Detroit area, but we essentially stole him from a rival. He's knocked it out of the park on the recruiting front. Tough to judge his coaching ability based on last year's lack of D-linemen.

Brian Callahan also another very good recruiter in the Chicago area. Bill Kenney spent 20 years at Penn State. I think we are lucky to have him. Love Tim McGarigle, also a very good Chicago area recruiter.

For me, the two biggest question marks are our coordinators. Jury is still out on Ciarrocca and Pinkham. But even then, very hard to tell based on the lack of overall depth and talent from last year's squad. Like Fleck, the next 1-2 years will be telling I think.

Luke Getsy (Green Bay Packers), Charles Huff and Anthony Crespino (Penn St.) all made big jumps in their careers. That's got to say something.

Fleck clearly chose this coaching staff strategically for recruiting purposes, probably knowing that not all of them would last for very long getting compensated the typical MAC salary. I think we've actually had a pretty good staff.

Mike Hart seemed like a good hire last year, but I don't know much of anything about Matt Simon.

Everything you said here is about recruiting which they have done well. Coaching is also part of the job. I also said PJ's key is to have a strong OC and DC. You have also mentioned a bunch of people who are not currently on staff. My post is about the current staff. You don't always have to defend even in a post that I said pj would get hired and move on because he has something people want.

when I said Oline guy I meant Kenney who is Tackles and TE

I don't know why you insist on calling it "defending" -- it's just my opinion on the staff he's assembled (I did mention current staff). Hence, why I prefaced it with what I did. Also, this comment is key:

Quote:Fleck clearly chose this coaching staff strategically for recruiting purposes

I mean... doesn't it kind of go without saying that if Fleck moves on to a bigger school, he'll need a better staff?

(07-15-2014 08:59 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  I don't know why you insist on calling it "defending" -- it's just my opinion on the staff he's assembled (I did mention current staff). Hence, why I prefaced it with what I did. Also, this comment is key:

Quote:Fleck clearly chose this coaching staff strategically for recruiting purposes

Other than one small comment about not being impressed with the CURRENT staff, it was a positive post about PJ.

nevermind... carry on.