(07-02-2013 08:43 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:18 PM)FreshPrinceOfDarkness Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 05:21 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:52 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  I have to admit, ULL was not the school I thought would be attached to this thread. Louisiana has a quantity problem. LSU, Tulane, La. Tech, La. Laf, La. Monroe... 5 teams in the FBS is a lot for a state the size of Louisiana. ULL has a long way to go in all areas. 1. Proven consistency in sports 2. Not even ranked academically (means they are outside the top 200 nationally. Texas Tech and WVU are tied for lowest in the Big 12 at 165) 3. They raked in $15 mil last year, which is $40 mil less than Iowa State (I don't think TV money is going to make up a $40 mil gap any time soon, especially when that just gets you even with the lowest earning school in the conference).

Conference USA needs to be the next goal for ULL, not the Big 12. As was stated earlier, I can think of a dozen schools off the top of my head that would be considered ahead of ULL.

UL has about twice the enrollment of all except LSU----Not many can say that they have achieved the overall success that the Cajuns have in aforementioned areas-----UL will be a tier one school in one year and is already ranked as a high research university-----Our Budget will be over $20 mill this year and maybe closer to $25 mill---If student athletic fees are achieved then that Budget money goes through the roof-----Also to factor in these kind of teams coming into Lafayette is a factor-----BTW our Endowment is in the $160 million range which surprises many!!!! I agree the name issue is tough but one that gets just the Louisiana by more and more each year---A conference without Monroe would change the Brand very quickly!!!

Your endowment is how much?

NACUBO Endowment Charts

$160 Million ----And this is I guess one of the few good things about our former president's reign---Like everybody's our total took a dip with the markets downfall in years back but wasn't as bad as others--then some great investments along with great increase of the oil field donations kicked it up big time----again there is a lot of oil field money in the Acadiana area but has now spread out much more than the past!!! Again our athletic facilities expansion will be a $175 million deal but will be a combination of individual donations, student accessed fees, and I am sure some bond money----the banks (about 30-50) have put together a great package for funding!!! I didn't post this initially without some really good info to back up the goals and happenings of the university and its fabulous potential!!!

This is cute.

Cajuns, there's not a nice way to put this. You're not a fit. I could come up with all kids of numbers to explain why, but it has everything to do with who these large flagship state schools want to be associated with. It's awkward to have to explain this to you, but... You're not cut out for P5 membership. The sad thing for you is that a school like Tulane with 20k attendance is a fit. That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

And the fact that you are touting your $160m endowment is all the evidence I need. Add a billion to that and come back and talk to me.

Cincinatti, BYU, Tulane, are the schools that will be most heavily looked at, these are the schools that had discussions last time. I could see a 4th school being added, but that will be a tough, tough vote. Memphis fits location wise, but damn they are not a fit institutionally. Institutional fit matters because fortunes ebb and flow on the field, but a solid institution is forever.

(07-03-2013 05:56 PM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 05:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 05:18 PM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 05:04 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 04:32 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  JR once again, with all due respect and no offense intended, your posts on the Big12 seem to be getting worse. The part about the GOR being a shackles to the Big12, but the ACC GOR is a show of strength is sheer hypocrisy.

Then you list three options, none of which considers the Big12 staying happily at 10 members.

You are corrrect about one thing though....... some folks may think you are crazy

1. I thought you weren't going to bother addressing me again.

2. What are you thoughts on the direction of that conference? This is a realignment board and it is full of speculation. (Especially in the absence of real news.) Put your thoughts on the line. Everyone is entitled to them.

I've heard speculation about Missouri, Arkansas, L.S.U. and even Auburn leaving the SEC for another conference and have not responded to any of it because if someone wants to think that (even if I 100% believe them to be in error) then that is their right. Contrary to what the thought police of any conference represented here may wish to suppress, they are not going to be able to change whatever it is that will happen.

3. Every time you say "with all due respect" since it is followed by some kind of backhanded insult that is "hypocrisy".

4. The distinctions about how the GOR's are perceived is a factor.

5. Whether or not I'm wrong will at least be born out by what does or doesn't transpire and I'll live with that because it is just sports and not geopolitical matters, health, a family crisis, or something else imminently more important and consequential.

6. A little bit of friendly debate and difference of opinion is what makes a talk board fun. It sure helps tally the number of posts when things are dry as a bone, like right now.

7. If a number of folks think I'm crazy for holding an opinion that usually makes me happy and a bit more certain of my position. In life the herd is usually traveling together for one reason, to go to the slaughter house. I am not a follower of the herd mentality. Travelling alone, even in opinion, is usually the safer and better option. It works in investing too.

8. I always find those who get angry at the opinions of others to be those who are really just displacing their anger because they can't address the things in life that truly bother them. So, they pick a target and vent. And folks are angry about a lot of different things these days that they can't do anything about. So the level of personal discourse and hostility is up.

9. I have nothing against you or your posts, or ideas, when you bother to express them.

10. Other than my ideas what is it that makes you seek me out to post your criticisms instead of engaging in constructive conversation?

Hey, I want my $5 footlong toasted, chop chop!

With or without spit in it? Of course I can't vouch for what you'll get if you opt for no spit.

LOL. You've got moxie, and a sense of humor. Well played. Oh and definitely no spit, or anything else.

Right back at you. I laughed when I read your post and thought that perhaps you could handle and enjoy a retort like that.

(07-03-2013 06:10 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 05:04 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 04:32 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 03:05 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 02:01 PM)ecu92 Wrote:  The Big XII won't be making any moves unless another conference swipes one of the current members, or a "name brand" school comes on the market.

It appears the ACC is now "locked down" with their new additions, particularly ND, and a huge exit fee.

Texas and Oklahoma could potentially bolt together for the PAC-12 (or whatever they're calling it). But again, it's doubtful anyone's going to pay Texas what they think they're worth.

They missed their chance to grab Louisville...that was their "best of the rest" option.

This in my opinion is right and you have been kind in your remarks.

In the beginning after Missouri and A&M left Texas was not sure what it needed to do. Do we go to the PAC, do we entertain the ACC or Big 10, or do we salvage the Big 12?

I believe they had thoughts of hoping to lure Notre Dame into some kind of arrangement with them so they waited to see who they needed to pursue as future members that might be acceptable to the Irish. Notre Dame wasn't interested. The Big 10 snatches Maryland and the ACC responds decisively by taking Louisville and coming to terms with Notre Dame.

Now the tardiness of response by Texas and Oklahoma have allowed one of their best options profitably and geographically in connection with West Virginia to be taken off the market.

Kudos to John Swofford for breaking the ACC's academic norms and hamstringing his competition. The move meant that now the most profitable team out there for the Big 12 to expand with would be Westward and not to the Northeast.

If there had been any quality (in terms of adding cash value) teams out there interested in the Big 12 they would already have them.

B.Y.U. has potential but by themselves can't provide enough umpf to make it worth Texas and Oklahoma passing on better options.

The highly touted GOR now becomes a shackles for the top 4 to 6 programs of the Big 12. While the ACC's GOR yields the perception of strength they had hoped it would be.

So either 8 teams find new homes, or everyone in the Big 12 sweats out the next ever how many years of their bondage. The Big 12 has 2 top 10 teams in earning potential and then a fairly wide gulf until it gets to Kansas and West Virginia. It's that economic gap that exists between the top, the middle, and the bottom that along with their market footprint limits the upside of the conference.

I doubt that B.Y.U. and either Cincinnati, or one of the 4th or 5th Florida schools will add enough to solidify that conference.

That's why we will have 1 of 3 potential outcomes here:
1. 8 or more teams will be brokered to new homes with compromise by all conferences participating in the move.

2. We wait 8 to 10 years and see a bolting of the top 6 schools to other conferences.

3. They add B.Y.U. and Cincinnati, or one of the Florida Schools and just decide to make less.

Which of those three solutions do you think will be the most palatable?

They won't opt for less money while their competition is earning more.

They will have many hard feelings and some political entanglements by waiting and leaving potentially 4 schools in the lurch.

They could free themselves and broker an amicable solution for the majority.

Folks may think I'm crazy but I think it will be the latter. Less pain, more gain!

JR once again, with all due respect and no offense intended, your posts on the Big12 seem to be getting worse. The part about the GOR being a shackles to the Big12, but the ACC GOR is a show of strength is sheer hypocrisy.

Then you list three options, none of which considers the Big12 staying happily at 10 members.

You are corrrect about one thing though....... some folks may think you are crazy

1. I thought you weren't going to bother addressing me again.

2. What are you thoughts on the direction of that conference? This is a realignment board and it is full of speculation. (Especially in the absence of real news.) Put your thoughts on the line. Everyone is entitled to them.

I've heard speculation about Missouri, Arkansas, L.S.U. and even Auburn leaving the SEC for another conference and have not responded to any of it because if someone wants to think that (even if I 100% believe them to be in error) then that is their right. Contrary to what the thought police of any conference represented here may wish to suppress, they are not going to be able to change whatever it is that will happen.

3. Every time you say "with all due respect" since it is followed by some kind of backhanded insult that is "hypocrisy".

4. The distinctions about how the GOR's are perceived is a factor.

5. Whether or not I'm wrong will at least be born out by what does or doesn't transpire and I'll live with that because it is just sports and not geopolitical matters, health, a family crisis, or something else imminently more important and consequential.

6. A little bit of friendly debate and difference of opinion is what makes a talk board fun. It sure helps tally the number of posts when things are dry as a bone, like right now.

7. If a number of folks think I'm crazy for holding an opinion that usually makes me happy and a bit more certain of my position. In life the herd is usually traveling together for one reason, to go to the slaughter house. I am not a follower of the herd mentality. Travelling alone, even in opinion, is usually the safer and better option. It works in investing too.

8. I always find those who get angry at the opinions of others to be those who are really just displacing their anger because they can't address the things in life that truly bother them. So, they pick a target and vent. And folks are angry about a lot of different things these days that they can't do anything about. So the level of personal discourse and hostility is up.

9. I have nothing against you or your posts, or ideas, when you bother to express them.

10. Other than my ideas what is it that makes you seek me out to post your criticisms instead of engaging in constructive conversation?

I meant I was not going to reply to any more of your posts on that particular thread.

AS I have repeatedly said, my thoughts on the direction of the Big12, is it will stay at 10.

When I say with all due respect,I am truly trying not to be rude or disrespectful or indicate any anger or hostility, but keep a civil conversation.. I do not know how else to say it. I am certainly not angry at you are anything you post. Most of this stuff is meaningless anyway.

I do not seek out your posts, in fact I ignore a lot of them because frankly, they so are too long and wordy for me. However, you do have a lot of interesting thoughts.

One reason I respond to some of your posts, is it seems to me instead of stating.... this is my opinion are what I believe, you are tellling us "this is how it is" as though it was facts not opinions. Anyway that is how I read it. . So when I feel they are incorrect I try to help clear the air with information that I am aware of. Where I live, I am saturated with Big12 information and I simply try to pass it along. You seem to very knowledgeable about sports on this board and I do not have enough information to respond on many of your thoughts, but like I say, I am flooded with Big12 info.

I am sorry if I have offended you in any way and I wish you would not take any of it personal.

Remember in the Department Store of Life.......Sports is the toy department.

Thanks, feel free to disagree anytime. I have a better sense I think of where you are coming from in all of this. I have no ill will toward the Big 12. I do think the networks will push us into a more balanced structure to facilitate their advertising packages so that all regions stand a better chance of maxing out the target price range. I do see the halt in realignment more as a network issue right now between ESPN and FOX than I do as the abatement of activity by the conferences. When the networks offer more money for more expansion that is what we will have. If they don't, we won't.

It only seems like I'm picking on the Big 12 because they have returned to the more vulnerable position. Last Fall it was the ACC that seemed to be most vulnerable. Two years ago it was the Big East. I do know that we have gradually been moving toward 4 major conferences. Whether or not they will have 16 members each is another matter and whether we get there sooner or later is another matter.

And you are correct in that staying at 10 should have been a 4th option. But, how GOR's are perceived is going to play a part in all of this before it is over. Right now the perception is that they may be stronger than they really are. But neither do I believe that you can just walk over them. If there is future realignment it will require cooperation between conferences and accommodation to most if not all of the teams of the Big 12. Anyway that is my opinion and how I see it right now. Have a good 4th. JR

(07-03-2013 07:09 PM)OUGwave Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:43 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:18 PM)FreshPrinceOfDarkness Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 05:21 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:52 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  I have to admit, ULL was not the school I thought would be attached to this thread. Louisiana has a quantity problem. LSU, Tulane, La. Tech, La. Laf, La. Monroe... 5 teams in the FBS is a lot for a state the size of Louisiana. ULL has a long way to go in all areas. 1. Proven consistency in sports 2. Not even ranked academically (means they are outside the top 200 nationally. Texas Tech and WVU are tied for lowest in the Big 12 at 165) 3. They raked in $15 mil last year, which is $40 mil less than Iowa State (I don't think TV money is going to make up a $40 mil gap any time soon, especially when that just gets you even with the lowest earning school in the conference).

Conference USA needs to be the next goal for ULL, not the Big 12. As was stated earlier, I can think of a dozen schools off the top of my head that would be considered ahead of ULL.

UL has about twice the enrollment of all except LSU----Not many can say that they have achieved the overall success that the Cajuns have in aforementioned areas-----UL will be a tier one school in one year and is already ranked as a high research university-----Our Budget will be over $20 mill this year and maybe closer to $25 mill---If student athletic fees are achieved then that Budget money goes through the roof-----Also to factor in these kind of teams coming into Lafayette is a factor-----BTW our Endowment is in the $160 million range which surprises many!!!! I agree the name issue is tough but one that gets just the Louisiana by more and more each year---A conference without Monroe would change the Brand very quickly!!!

Your endowment is how much?

NACUBO Endowment Charts

$160 Million ----And this is I guess one of the few good things about our former president's reign---Like everybody's our total took a dip with the markets downfall in years back but wasn't as bad as others--then some great investments along with great increase of the oil field donations kicked it up big time----again there is a lot of oil field money in the Acadiana area but has now spread out much more than the past!!! Again our athletic facilities expansion will be a $175 million deal but will be a combination of individual donations, student accessed fees, and I am sure some bond money----the banks (about 30-50) have put together a great package for funding!!! I didn't post this initially without some really good info to back up the goals and happenings of the university and its fabulous potential!!!

This is cute.

Cajuns, there's not a nice way to put this. You're not a fit. I could come up with all kids of numbers to explain why, but it has everything to do with who these large flagship state schools want to be associated with. It's awkward to have to explain this to you, but... You're not cut out for P5 membership. The sad thing for you is that a school like Tulane with 20k attendance is a fit. That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

And the fact that you are touting your $160m endowment is all the evidence I need. Add a billion to that and come back and talk to me.

Cincinatti, BYU, Tulane, are the schools that will be most heavily looked at, these are the schools that had discussions last time. I could see a 4th school being added, but that will be a tough, tough vote. Memphis fits location wise, but damn they are not a fit institutionally. Institutional fit matters because fortunes ebb and flow on the field, but a solid institution is forever.

Ok so Kansas has 2, Mississippi has 2, Iowa, Okla,oregon, Wash, Calif, ariz---etc etc etc-----Tulanes enrollment is 13K ---Ul has the enrollment the size of Ole Miss, Miss St and other SEC schools (not all)---So it is all endowment---Well when our 65K stadium is filled and the Greenies 25K tinker Toy has about 5K and the HS gym for basketball has 500 and the Cajun Dome has 10K we will see how it plays out---As our budget grows so will enrollment etc!!!

(07-03-2013 04:13 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 12:43 PM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  Tulane has it issues but if it came down to the P5 "having" to take another Louisiana school (makes no sense but I digress) there is one argument that needs to be made and one only.

ULL Endowment: 69,626,515
Tulane Endowment: 1,004,738,000

And the mic drops.....

They have the financial means to make what needs to be made happen if they gets their ducks in a row.

Actually not $1 of an edowment can be spent on any sports program.
So in some ways it is not that big of a deal. Not that I am taking sides in this debate.

I realize that just an indicator of the strong financial support they have

Are there really USL fans taking this seriously? Even on a message board?

(07-03-2013 10:36 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 07:09 PM)OUGwave Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:43 PM)exflash Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 08:18 PM)FreshPrinceOfDarkness Wrote:  

(07-02-2013 05:21 PM)exflash Wrote:  UL has about twice the enrollment of all except LSU----Not many can say that they have achieved the overall success that the Cajuns have in aforementioned areas-----UL will be a tier one school in one year and is already ranked as a high research university-----Our Budget will be over $20 mill this year and maybe closer to $25 mill---If student athletic fees are achieved then that Budget money goes through the roof-----Also to factor in these kind of teams coming into Lafayette is a factor-----BTW our Endowment is in the $160 million range which surprises many!!!! I agree the name issue is tough but one that gets just the Louisiana by more and more each year---A conference without Monroe would change the Brand very quickly!!!

Your endowment is how much?

NACUBO Endowment Charts

$160 Million ----And this is I guess one of the few good things about our former president's reign---Like everybody's our total took a dip with the markets downfall in years back but wasn't as bad as others--then some great investments along with great increase of the oil field donations kicked it up big time----again there is a lot of oil field money in the Acadiana area but has now spread out much more than the past!!! Again our athletic facilities expansion will be a $175 million deal but will be a combination of individual donations, student accessed fees, and I am sure some bond money----the banks (about 30-50) have put together a great package for funding!!! I didn't post this initially without some really good info to back up the goals and happenings of the university and its fabulous potential!!!

This is cute.

Cajuns, there's not a nice way to put this. You're not a fit. I could come up with all kids of numbers to explain why, but it has everything to do with who these large flagship state schools want to be associated with. It's awkward to have to explain this to you, but... You're not cut out for P5 membership. The sad thing for you is that a school like Tulane with 20k attendance is a fit. That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

And the fact that you are touting your $160m endowment is all the evidence I need. Add a billion to that and come back and talk to me.

Cincinatti, BYU, Tulane, are the schools that will be most heavily looked at, these are the schools that had discussions last time. I could see a 4th school being added, but that will be a tough, tough vote. Memphis fits location wise, but damn they are not a fit institutionally. Institutional fit matters because fortunes ebb and flow on the field, but a solid institution is forever.

Ok so Kansas has 2, Mississippi has 2, Iowa, Okla,oregon, Wash, Calif, ariz---etc etc etc-----Tulanes enrollment is 13K ---Ul has the enrollment the size of Ole Miss, Miss St and other SEC schools (not all)---So it is all endowment---Well when our 65K stadium is filled and the Greenies 25K tinker Toy has about 5K and the HS gym for basketball has 500 and the Cajun Dome has 10K we will see how it plays out---As our budget grows so will enrollment etc!!!

You could have an enrollment of 100,000. University of Phoenix has like 300,000. You're still UL-Lafayette! Enrollment doesn't matter a damn. It's about prestige.

Maybe I wasn't blunt enough when I said that you're not a fit. You're not eligible. I don't know a nicer way of putting it that won't make me sound like an elitist. It just is the way it is. Tulane, even with how bad we are on the field and in the stands right now, got an AAC invite. There's a reason for that. ULa-La is stuck in the Sun Belt. There's a reason for that too.

And Maybe the last push by your liberal alumni base and administrators wasn't quite strong enough to end athletics at Weeping Willow Sports U----YOu are the LOWEST ranked team in Louisiana---lost this year by a 104-23 score to the 2 UL system schools---Your inflated budget figures based upon overpriced tuition charges will get eaten away again by travel, no attendance, no contributions, and no want---As the truth comes out finally and is acted upon, the Lafayette area will blow by the NO crumbled ghetto---BTW how is that inflated MBA degree bunch of lies working out---could be the same guys lying about the budget!!!! lol

I don't think UL is going to be stuck in the Sun Belt. CUSA is seriously in need of some football programs and not just programs that play some football. UL is a football program and it is on the rise. If UL isn't very high up on the list for any future CUSA additions then that would be a surprise to me.

I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

4. Let everyone on the outside slug it out for the next 8 or so years and then re-evaluate at that time.

I think the Big 12 made a mistake too by adding WVU. THey have left them out to dry or on an island. The problem for WVU is that the ACC or SEC would not take them at the time. So WVU went west. The Big 12 would have been much better off accepting a Louisville/Cincinnati group together and also included WVU and maybe Memphis or USF or UCF for a total of 4 added. I don't think the league is waiting or hoarding the profits, I don't think they know what to do at this point. The ACC would have been better off accepting UConn.

(07-04-2013 08:23 AM)Groo Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

4. Let everyone on the outside slug it out for the next 8 or so years and then re-evaluate at that time.

I tend to agree that the GOR will allow the Big12 to wait, unless outside forces try and force them to expand for the CFP (CCG to qualify etc). This time till the GOR expires might work out for a USF/UCF combo, as it will give time to develop a rivalry that has some juice, and improve their relevancy. But nothing happens anytime soon unless OU/UT want it, or outside forces twist their arms.

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

It seems to me that the Big 12 could stay at 10. It wouldn't surprise me if WVU were to exit and be replaced with BYU.
Realistically on a long term basis West Virginia needs to move east.

(07-04-2013 08:23 AM)Groo Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

4. Let everyone on the outside slug it out for the next 8 or so years and then re-evaluate at that time.

Not sure the Big and SEC will side line for that long. Had the ACC not set up GOR, I think Big likely would have moved within 2 years. It may be a bit longer now, with the reduced choices available.
If they don't move, I expect it will be stable for 4 to 6 years.

(07-02-2013 07:48 AM)exflash Wrote:  Well we all know that it is coming soon. The Big 12 needs more teams and don't be surprised if a new school (state) is added. That would be the University of Louisiana (Lafayette). Things have turned drastically at the school with 2 straight Bowl wins with last years home crowd of 45K to the NO Bowl. A stadium expansion to 65K and a huge athletic department building program. Future enrollment of 20K projected and this very wealthy area seems to have gotten behind its RAGIN' CAJUNS. In the not too distant past the Cajuns have sent an at large WBB to the regionals, softball team to the WCWS, Baseball team to Super regionals and a CWS appearance, 2 basketball regionals, and the afore mentioned football successes. Getting their foot into Louisiana recruiting area and a perfect geographical fit also bide well for the Cajuns. The future looks bright regardless for UL!!!

(07-04-2013 08:36 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

It seems to me that the Big 12 could stay at 10. It wouldn't surprise me if WVU were to exit and be replaced with BYU.
Realistically on a long term basis West Virginia needs to move east.

and where would WVU go? the ACC doesn't want us; the SEC isn't expanding

we can't go independent and people would lynch Luck from the highest tree if we went to the AAC

(07-04-2013 01:18 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 08:36 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

It seems to me that the Big 12 could stay at 10. It wouldn't surprise me if WVU were to exit and be replaced with BYU.
Realistically on a long term basis West Virginia needs to move east.

and where would WVU go? the ACC doesn't want us; the SEC isn't expanding

we can't go independent and people would lynch Luck from the highest tree if we went to the AAC

Given what has transpired in the ACC I wouldn't rule out SEC interest. The question would become who is #16?

(07-03-2013 10:11 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 06:10 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 05:04 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 04:32 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(07-03-2013 03:05 PM)JRsec Wrote:  This in my opinion is right and you have been kind in your remarks.

In the beginning after Missouri and A&M left Texas was not sure what it needed to do. Do we go to the PAC, do we entertain the ACC or Big 10, or do we salvage the Big 12?

I believe they had thoughts of hoping to lure Notre Dame into some kind of arrangement with them so they waited to see who they needed to pursue as future members that might be acceptable to the Irish. Notre Dame wasn't interested. The Big 10 snatches Maryland and the ACC responds decisively by taking Louisville and coming to terms with Notre Dame.

Now the tardiness of response by Texas and Oklahoma have allowed one of their best options profitably and geographically in connection with West Virginia to be taken off the market.

Kudos to John Swofford for breaking the ACC's academic norms and hamstringing his competition. The move meant that now the most profitable team out there for the Big 12 to expand with would be Westward and not to the Northeast.

If there had been any quality (in terms of adding cash value) teams out there interested in the Big 12 they would already have them.

B.Y.U. has potential but by themselves can't provide enough umpf to make it worth Texas and Oklahoma passing on better options.

The highly touted GOR now becomes a shackles for the top 4 to 6 programs of the Big 12. While the ACC's GOR yields the perception of strength they had hoped it would be.

So either 8 teams find new homes, or everyone in the Big 12 sweats out the next ever how many years of their bondage. The Big 12 has 2 top 10 teams in earning potential and then a fairly wide gulf until it gets to Kansas and West Virginia. It's that economic gap that exists between the top, the middle, and the bottom that along with their market footprint limits the upside of the conference.

I doubt that B.Y.U. and either Cincinnati, or one of the 4th or 5th Florida schools will add enough to solidify that conference.

That's why we will have 1 of 3 potential outcomes here:
1. 8 or more teams will be brokered to new homes with compromise by all conferences participating in the move.

2. We wait 8 to 10 years and see a bolting of the top 6 schools to other conferences.

3. They add B.Y.U. and Cincinnati, or one of the Florida Schools and just decide to make less.

Which of those three solutions do you think will be the most palatable?

They won't opt for less money while their competition is earning more.

They will have many hard feelings and some political entanglements by waiting and leaving potentially 4 schools in the lurch.

They could free themselves and broker an amicable solution for the majority.

Folks may think I'm crazy but I think it will be the latter. Less pain, more gain!

JR once again, with all due respect and no offense intended, your posts on the Big12 seem to be getting worse. The part about the GOR being a shackles to the Big12, but the ACC GOR is a show of strength is sheer hypocrisy.

Then you list three options, none of which considers the Big12 staying happily at 10 members.

You are corrrect about one thing though....... some folks may think you are crazy

1. I thought you weren't going to bother addressing me again.

2. What are you thoughts on the direction of that conference? This is a realignment board and it is full of speculation. (Especially in the absence of real news.) Put your thoughts on the line. Everyone is entitled to them.

I've heard speculation about Missouri, Arkansas, L.S.U. and even Auburn leaving the SEC for another conference and have not responded to any of it because if someone wants to think that (even if I 100% believe them to be in error) then that is their right. Contrary to what the thought police of any conference represented here may wish to suppress, they are not going to be able to change whatever it is that will happen.

3. Every time you say "with all due respect" since it is followed by some kind of backhanded insult that is "hypocrisy".

4. The distinctions about how the GOR's are perceived is a factor.

5. Whether or not I'm wrong will at least be born out by what does or doesn't transpire and I'll live with that because it is just sports and not geopolitical matters, health, a family crisis, or something else imminently more important and consequential.

6. A little bit of friendly debate and difference of opinion is what makes a talk board fun. It sure helps tally the number of posts when things are dry as a bone, like right now.

7. If a number of folks think I'm crazy for holding an opinion that usually makes me happy and a bit more certain of my position. In life the herd is usually traveling together for one reason, to go to the slaughter house. I am not a follower of the herd mentality. Travelling alone, even in opinion, is usually the safer and better option. It works in investing too.

8. I always find those who get angry at the opinions of others to be those who are really just displacing their anger because they can't address the things in life that truly bother them. So, they pick a target and vent. And folks are angry about a lot of different things these days that they can't do anything about. So the level of personal discourse and hostility is up.

9. I have nothing against you or your posts, or ideas, when you bother to express them.

10. Other than my ideas what is it that makes you seek me out to post your criticisms instead of engaging in constructive conversation?

I meant I was not going to reply to any more of your posts on that particular thread.

AS I have repeatedly said, my thoughts on the direction of the Big12, is it will stay at 10.

When I say with all due respect,I am truly trying not to be rude or disrespectful or indicate any anger or hostility, but keep a civil conversation.. I do not know how else to say it. I am certainly not angry at you are anything you post. Most of this stuff is meaningless anyway.

I do not seek out your posts, in fact I ignore a lot of them because frankly, they so are too long and wordy for me. However, you do have a lot of interesting thoughts.

One reason I respond to some of your posts, is it seems to me instead of stating.... this is my opinion are what I believe, you are tellling us "this is how it is" as though it was facts not opinions. Anyway that is how I read it. . So when I feel they are incorrect I try to help clear the air with information that I am aware of. Where I live, I am saturated with Big12 information and I simply try to pass it along. You seem to very knowledgeable about sports on this board and I do not have enough information to respond on many of your thoughts, but like I say, I am flooded with Big12 info.

I am sorry if I have offended you in any way and I wish you would not take any of it personal.

Remember in the Department Store of Life.......Sports is the toy department.

Thanks, feel free to disagree anytime. I have a better sense I think of where you are coming from in all of this. I have no ill will toward the Big 12. I do think the networks will push us into a more balanced structure to facilitate their advertising packages so that all regions stand a better chance of maxing out the target price range. I do see the halt in realignment more as a network issue right now between ESPN and FOX than I do as the abatement of activity by the conferences. When the networks offer more money for more expansion that is what we will have. If they don't, we won't.

It only seems like I'm picking on the Big 12 because they have returned to the more vulnerable position. Last Fall it was the ACC that seemed to be most vulnerable. Two years ago it was the Big East. I do know that we have gradually been moving toward 4 major conferences. Whether or not they will have 16 members each is another matter and whether we get there sooner or later is another matter.

And you are correct in that staying at 10 should have been a 4th option. But, how GOR's are perceived is going to play a part in all of this before it is over. Right now the perception is that they may be stronger than they really are. But neither do I believe that you can just walk over them. If there is future realignment it will require cooperation between conferences and accommodation to most if not all of the teams of the Big 12. Anyway that is my opinion and how I see it right now. Have a good 4th. JR

Fair enough. I do not think you are picking on the Big12. I know there are a lot of posters that would love for their school to be in the Big12 and they speculate accordingly. For example the OP of this thread. I understand that.

However, to me the the Big12 has made it very clear that it is not going to expand, if the schools added do not increase the league's value and certainly not if they dilute the league. Neither will they add a school just to give West Virginia a neighbor. Therefore, I think they will stay at 10.

As for the Big12 breaking up I do not see that happening. Contrary to what many seem to believe ...ALL of the schools in the conference seem to be very happy with what they have... especially Texas.

So I do not think there is any possibility any team will defect to the BIG or the SEC.

However, I tend to agree with your last statement on any possible future realignment involving the Big12. In the remote event that happens, then I believe we would see the PAC take Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas Tech, Kansas and Kansas State. The PAC would love to have Texas, OU, and KU and would likely be willing to take the other three schoools, who match up fairly well athletically and even academically with the current lower echlon PAC schools. The LHN killed the deal last time, but the LHN seems to have failed and may no longer be an issue.

After that who knows. Would that break the GOR? Would the Big10 take Iowa State, an AAU school? Would the ACC take Iowa State as a neighbor for Louisville?....they fit the ACC academics and have a fairly well rounded sports program.

If the BIG took Missouri along with Iowa State would the SEC take West Virginia?

What would happen to Baylor and TCU? Go to ACC? SEC?. Maybe the AAC with SMU and Houston.

As I said, I think the Big12 will be around for a while.

(07-04-2013 02:21 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 01:18 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 08:36 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-04-2013 07:49 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I only see 3 moves for big 12 if they decided to move.

1. Cincy and 1 of (Ucon, USF, or BYU)
2. USF and UCF
3. go to 14 with USF/UCF/CIncy/plus one.

To me #3 makes the most sense. get WV travel partners, and USF/UCF bookend travelers.

It seems to me that the Big 12 could stay at 10. It wouldn't surprise me if WVU were to exit and be replaced with BYU.
Realistically on a long term basis West Virginia needs to move east.

and where would WVU go? the ACC doesn't want us; the SEC isn't expanding

we can't go independent and people would lynch Luck from the highest tree if we went to the AAC

Given what has transpired in the ACC I wouldn't rule out SEC interest. The question would become who is #16?

The addition of Louisville to the ACC has opened the door for West Virginia to join the ACC. As part of the old eastern independents, West Virginia could hold the key in helping the ACC to beat out the B1G in the East.
The SEC may like to have West Virginia.....the ACC needs West Virginia.