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Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
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cleburneslim Offline
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Post: #271
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
Note that he left off liberty and Jax st. Attendance
05-08-2014 03:51 PM
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asupatch Offline
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Post: #272
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 03:51 PM)cleburneslim Wrote:  Note that he left off liberty and Jax st. Attendance

Why would he bring that up? Its damming to his case. Cherry picking things to make you look better is so much more fun.
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2014 04:00 PM by asupatch.)
05-08-2014 03:59 PM
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LUSportsFan Offline
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Post: #273
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 03:09 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:59 PM)LUSportsFan Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:32 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:30 PM)LUSportsFan Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:11 PM)asupatch Wrote:  Cause they did it with winning seasons. You have yet to experience a winning season. You had high averages when it was new and shiney, so does everyone else. Check what UNCC's attendance does over the next couple years if they continue to lose like you guys. MSU also brings good basketball. EKU has 2 national titles. All things Lamar does not have.

We've been to the NCAA tournament two times since MSU's last time. Our last appearance was in 2012. We've won 5 NCAA tournament games vs MSU's 3. We've both been to the NCAA tournament 6 times. We both made the Sweet 16.

In football, a national title didn't exist when we played football before, but we do have a win over a top 20 D-1A (FBS) in our history. Before we went independent D-1AA (FCS), we were consistently drawing 16,000-17,000 in attendance (in a 17,500 seat stadium). Attendance dropped off during the independent period. That's what killed the program.

8k and 4 consecutive losing seasons is all I need to see. Nothing to see here people, move on.

The 4 consecutive losing seasons were during our first four seasons back. Being a start up is heck! Ask Georgia State who is starting the program with an FBS schedule. At least last year we were more competitive than we had been in previous seasons. We lost to one 10-2 playoff team by 4 points. We lost to another 9-5 playoff team by 11 points. Those type of games had been blowouts in their favor in the other three seasons. The year before we lost to those same playoff teams 35-0 and 56-7 respectively. Next, we need to turn those close losses into wins.

I am no Georgia State support either, I prefer teams to earn their way in, like Troy, App, Georgia Southern, Arkansas State. I get the Georgia State gets the Atlanta market argument even though they are obviously behind GT and UGA in ATL, but Lamar would be 8th in the pecking order, Texas,TT,TCU, SMU, Rice, TAMU, Houston, Texas State.

RE Earning their way: I agree with you there. I was not in favor of dropping the program in 1989, but I didn't get to make the decisions. 03-pissed It took me awhile to get over that. I always wondered how things would have turned out if the Lamar administrators had waited at least one more year before pulling the plug.

We have had some success in other sports. Baseball has been relatively consistent over the years with numerous NCAA appearances, the last one in 2010. I think it is up to 13 NCAA appearances now. In basketball, if the university can avoid train wrecks like the last couple of years, basketball is supported. It has been a very good money sport for us in the past. We have a way to go to get back to the 6,000 - 7,000 average attendance that I have experienced, but if we get a decent run, I think we could get to the 5,000 range and build from there. The Montagne Center capacity was originally increased to 10,080 because of the demand. Like other programs, the demand has dropped in recent years, but the program has been in a lull.

In the non-revenue sports, women's basketball is on the rise making one of the tournaments 4 of the last 5 years (NCAA-1, NIT-2, WBI-1). We even made it to the Elite 8 in 1990. Golf has consistently been a good sport for us. The men had a disappointing end this year, but the women start NCAA regional play tomorrow after winning the conference tournament. Men's Tennis had its best season since 1987 this year making it to the conference championship match. Cross country and distance running (both indoor and outdoor) have had some success also.

RE Market Share: I'm not sure what validity market share based on teams in the market has. It always seemed a little like voodoo to me except for the very large programs, but exposure helps. I never watched teams like Central Florida, South Florida, or East Carolina until those programs moved up. I think that is one of the benefits of moving up. I knew about the Sun Belt teams because I've followed the conference since it first began. Interest increased in the conference with the American South/Sun Belt merger. Also, four of the universities playing football in the conference were former conference members with us. The two non-football universities were also in the same conference with us at one time. Other than those exceptions, I have to confess over the years, I concentrated on SWC, Big 8, Big 12, and SEC with a little PAC 8, PAC 10, PAC 12, Big 10, B1G, and ACC thrown in. I got interested in the WAC during the "Wacky" football years and kept up with that conference until it dropped football. I also liked to watch certain teams out of my area.
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2014 04:21 PM by LUSportsFan.)
05-08-2014 04:10 PM
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LUSportsFan Offline
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Post: #274
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 03:59 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 03:51 PM)cleburneslim Wrote:  Note that he left off liberty and Jax st. Attendance

Why would he bring that up? Its damming to his case. Cherry picking things to make you look better is so much more fun.

I left Liberty and Jacksonville State off because those two have had a well known consistent history of good attendance. Both also had winning seasons every year of the period. Given our self imposed death penalty, I would have to go back to the '70's and early '80's to have that model (attendance vs winning record) for us, but that is admittedly too far back.

I was mainly trying to pick programs that have been discussed favorably on this board that have had results similar or worse than ours on the field over the last four seasons. In retrospect, based on that criteria, I guess I should have left EKU off the original list when I looked up their won-loss record. Lamar vs Missouri State would have been a better comparison in retrospect since both of our programs had similar results on the field the last four years.

Just to complete the list here are the attendance numbers for Liberty and Jacksonville State.

2010
Liberty 14,310 (8-3)
Jacksonville State 17,330 (9-3)

2011
Liberty 16,419 (7-4)
Jacksonville State 17,226 (7-4)

2012
Liberty 16,318 (6-5)
Jacksonville State 16,006 (6-5)

2013
Liberty 15,031 (8-4)
Jacksonville State 15,814 (11-4)
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2014 05:08 PM by LUSportsFan.)
05-08-2014 05:00 PM
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LUSportsFan Offline
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Post: #275
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 03:46 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 03:39 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 01:39 PM)LUSportsFan Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 01:15 PM)asupatch Wrote:  Lamar Student Support 8379 showed up per game to watch you guys play football. That would put you 9th in the nation in attendance. If you were DIVISION II that is.

Lamar is not a serious option outside of LamarLand.

Here is our attendance compared with some other universities discussed at length on this site. I guess the others get a pass on attendance. At least we've shown that we can average 15,000 over a two year period.

2010
Lamar 16,079
MSU 9,028
EKU 6,220

2011
Lamar 14,443
MSU 10,804
EKU 6,570

2012
Lamar 11,119
MSU 8,710
EKU 9,800

2013
Lamar 8,379
MSU 8,700
EKU 8,617

So, basically you are saying that Lamar is on a long term downward slide in attendance, MSU is on a shallower downward trend, while EKU is on an upward trend?

In a word............YES!

If a four year history with our first real stabilized recruiting class taking the field next season since the self imposed death penalty from 1989-2009 can be termed as long term, then I would have to agree. That's all our program has unless we go back before 1990.

Personally, I would be interested in a little more data.
05-08-2014 05:15 PM
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LUSportsFan Offline
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Post: #276
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 03:33 PM)ARSTATEFAN1986 Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 03:09 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:59 PM)LUSportsFan Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:32 PM)asupatch Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 02:30 PM)LUSportsFan Wrote:  We've been to the NCAA tournament two times since MSU's last time. Our last appearance was in 2012. We've won 5 NCAA tournament games vs MSU's 3. We've both been to the NCAA tournament 6 times. We both made the Sweet 16.

In football, a national title didn't exist when we played football before, but we do have a win over a top 20 D-1A (FBS) in our history. Before we went independent D-1AA (FCS), we were consistently drawing 16,000-17,000 in attendance (in a 17,500 seat stadium). Attendance dropped off during the independent period. That's what killed the program.

8k and 4 consecutive losing seasons is all I need to see. Nothing to see here people, move on.

The 4 consecutive losing seasons were during our first four seasons back. Being a start up is heck! Ask Georgia State who is starting the program with an FBS schedule. At least last year we were more competitive than we had been in previous seasons. We lost to one 10-2 playoff team by 4 points. We lost to another 9-5 playoff team by 11 points. Those type of games had been blowouts in their favor in the other three seasons. The year before we lost to those same playoff teams 35-0 and 56-7 respectively. Next, we need to turn those close losses into wins.

I am no Georgia State support either, I prefer teams to earn their way in, like Troy, App, Georgia Southern, Arkansas State. I get the Georgia State gets the Atlanta market argument even though they are obviously behind GT and UGA in ATL, but Lamar would be 8th in the pecking order, Texas,TT,TCU, SMU, Rice, TAMU, Houston, Texas State.

Why did the exploding WAC not bring you aboard when they were trying to survive?

If you are referring to Lamar, it could have been our administration say "No" because they could see what was happening. It was frustrating, as an outsider, seeing what was happening to a conference that I had followed for years.
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2014 05:27 PM by LUSportsFan.)
05-08-2014 05:27 PM
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GoApps70 Offline
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Post: #277
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
Why take Lamar? Aren't they just going to be snatched up by the SEC at any time?
05-08-2014 05:47 PM
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SHWISH Offline
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Post: #278
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
(05-08-2014 02:07 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(05-08-2014 01:35 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  My issue was he never actually said what I would win if I won the bet.

I went simple... If I win, he has to go and buy a Texas State shirt, and wear it to a Lamar home game (game of his choosing).

If he wins, I have to defend Lamar's inclusion on this board for... I think it was like 3 months. Mainly the ROTN photos.
GOOD GRIEF. Must we tell the whole world, what we do, together, behind close doors. jerk. 01-lauramac2
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2014 08:43 PM by SHWISH.)
05-08-2014 08:34 PM
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TheRevSWT Offline
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Post: #279
RE: Karl Benson interview from today about realignment
BAHAHAHA
05-08-2014 09:22 PM
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