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SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
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bearcat29 Offline
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Post: #1
SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college...&eref=sihp

It is an interesting read.

Spoiler...
And that's precisely why the Big East will probably remain ahead of the Mountain West going forward.
(This post was last modified: 02-20-2013 09:27 PM by bearcat29.)
02-20-2013 09:23 PM
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UConn-SMU Offline
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
This thread won't get much attention because the article doesn't bash the Big East.

You'll get more responses if you post a childish anti-Big East rant.
02-20-2013 10:02 PM
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Pony94 Offline
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Post: #3
SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
Tallgrass says we suck
02-20-2013 10:05 PM
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gocards#1 Offline
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?
02-20-2013 10:18 PM
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bearcat29 Offline
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:02 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  This thread won't get much attention because the article doesn't bash the Big East.

You'll get more responses if you post a childish anti-Big East rant.

That isn't my style. I'll save that crap for the Miko's of the board.

I thought it was an interesting article. I am not sure I can agree with the final conclusion. If everything stays how it is (UC, USF, UCONN stay) they will be fairly even. I think with Boise and eventually they may get a better TV deal, it will give MWC the edge.
(This post was last modified: 02-20-2013 10:23 PM by bearcat29.)
02-20-2013 10:21 PM
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HuskieTap22 Offline
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
Too much back and not enough forward analysis in the article. Once Cinci leaves the pendulum undoubtedly swings toward the MWC.
02-20-2013 10:26 PM
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Post: #7
RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:26 PM)HuskieTap22 Wrote:  Too much back and not enough forward analysis in the article. Once Cinci leaves the pendulum undoubtedly swings toward the MWC.

MWC is in unpopulated areas, but actually owns many of them. Other than UConn and Navy, BE doesn't. BE is more subject to poaching.

Top of MWC is better, so they will be perceived much better despite the weakness at the bottom.
02-20-2013 10:32 PM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:26 PM)HuskieTap22 Wrote:  Too much back and not enough forward analysis in the article. Once Cinci leaves the pendulum undoubtedly swings toward the MWC.

MWC is in unpopulated areas, but actually owns many of them. Other than UConn and Navy, BE doesn't. BE is more subject to poaching.

Top of MWC is better, so they will be perceived much better despite the weakness at the bottom.

Big East football will have weakness at the bottom, too -- for starters, they have Memphis and Tulane.
02-20-2013 10:53 PM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:26 PM)HuskieTap22 Wrote:  Too much back and not enough forward analysis in the article. Once Cinci leaves the pendulum undoubtedly swings toward the MWC.

MWC is in unpopulated areas, but actually owns many of them. Other than UConn and Navy, BE doesn't. BE is more subject to poaching.

Top of MWC is better, so they will be perceived much better despite the weakness at the bottom.

Agreed. The media and fan perception of group of five conference hierarchy will be driven by which conference's champion earns the access bowl slot, regardless of that conference's top-to-bottom strength.

I think an undefeated BE team will be selected over a one-loss MWC team, and vice-versa. If both the BE and MWC champions are undefeated, the nod will likely go to whoever has the more impressive OOC wins. And if both have a loss, and the MAC or CUSA champ is undefeated, it's quite possible both will be passed over.
02-20-2013 11:55 PM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good as gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right?

The major sticking point of this whole analysis, is that with all of the crap the Big East has endured for the last 12 months, from the media and their own members alike, there is still a clear competitive advantage top to bottom over the MWC. You can talk about Boise's individual BCS runs in the WAC all you like, but the numbers as a league don't lie. The MWC needed historic seasons in the past 5 years from three schools who all lost their head coaches this off season, in order to even make it close with a conference who just added a couple of schools who have been not only CUSA, but national bottom dwellers for these past several years.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2013 12:14 AM by Texas2Step.)
02-21-2013 12:09 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 12:09 AM)Texas2Step Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good a gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right.

The major sticking point of this whole analysis, is that with all of the crap the Big East has endured for the last 12 months, from the media and their own members alike, there is still a clear competitive advantage top to bottom over the MWC. You can talk about Boise's individual BCS runs in the WAC all you like, but the numbers as a league don't lie.

The bottom of the MWC has been really bad, but the top of the BE has been really mediocre. Those numbers say the MWC has a better future.
02-21-2013 12:12 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 12:12 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-21-2013 12:09 AM)Texas2Step Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good a gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right.

The major sticking point of this whole analysis, is that with all of the crap the Big East has endured for the last 12 months, from the media and their own members alike, there is still a clear competitive advantage top to bottom over the MWC. You can talk about Boise's individual BCS runs in the WAC all you like, but the numbers as a league don't lie.

The bottom of the MWC has been really bad, but the top of the BE has been really mediocre. Those numbers say the MWC has a better future.

Memphis and Tulane have been just as bad, if not worse, than the worse MWC teams. Both leagues have teams rated sub-100 over the last 5 years. Clearly nothing to brag about, but this can't be the reason to give one league better prospects over another going forward.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2013 12:40 AM by Texas2Step.)
02-21-2013 12:19 AM
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Post: #13
RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 12:09 AM)Texas2Step Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good as gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right?

The major sticking point of this whole analysis, is that with all of the crap the Big East has endured for the last 12 months, from the media and their own members alike, there is still a clear competitive advantage top to bottom over the MWC. You can talk about Boise's individual BCS runs in the WAC all you like, but the numbers as a league don't lie. The MWC needed historic seasons in the past 5 years from three schools who all lost their head coaches this off season, in order to even make it close with a conference who just added a couple of schools who have been not only CUSA, but national bottom dwellers for these past several years.

My point is that the Big East is unstable, the MWC is not. The thread was about the future of the two conferences, and I think the fact that everyone in the Big East wants to jump ASAP proves it doesn't have a very bright future. Compare that to the MWC, who just had two members thumb their noses at the Big East.

The Big East with Louisville and Rutgers gives it a competitive advantage over the MWC, without them the MWC is a better conference. Yes, the MWC has some God awful teams, but the top half of the conference is much better than the top half of the Big East going forward. The Big East is mostly average programs and crappy programs, the MWC is an elite program, a bunch of average programs, and a bunch of crappy programs. The two are similar, but the MWC is slightly better.
02-21-2013 09:10 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
What a shock, a Louisville fan talking down to current and former conference mates. 04-jawdrop
02-21-2013 09:17 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 09:10 AM)gocards#1 Wrote:  
(02-21-2013 12:09 AM)Texas2Step Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  The MWC is less likely to lose members in the future. The Pac 12 and Big 10 don't want anybody from that conference, and it's a step above CUSA, the MAC, and the Sun Belt and at worst on equal footing with the Big East.

Meanwhile there isn't a team in the Big East right now that can't wait to jump. UConn is as good as gone at this point. That alone makes the MWC better in the long term. Who knows what the Big East will look like tomorrow?

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good as gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right?

The major sticking point of this whole analysis, is that with all of the crap the Big East has endured for the last 12 months, from the media and their own members alike, there is still a clear competitive advantage top to bottom over the MWC. You can talk about Boise's individual BCS runs in the WAC all you like, but the numbers as a league don't lie. The MWC needed historic seasons in the past 5 years from three schools who all lost their head coaches this off season, in order to even make it close with a conference who just added a couple of schools who have been not only CUSA, but national bottom dwellers for these past several years.

My point is that the Big East is unstable, the MWC is not. The thread was about the future of the two conferences, and I think the fact that everyone in the Big East wants to jump ASAP proves it doesn't have a very bright future. Compare that to the MWC, who just had two members thumb their noses at the Big East.

The Big East with Louisville and Rutgers gives it a competitive advantage over the MWC, without them the MWC is a better conference. Yes, the MWC has some God awful teams, but the top half of the conference is much better than the top half of the Big East going forward. The Big East is mostly average programs and crappy programs, the MWC is an elite program, a bunch of average programs, and a bunch of crappy programs. The two are similar, but the MWC is slightly better.

Both conferences are unstable. In both conferences, any team will leave for an AQ-conference. Neither conference is in any danger of losing schools to gang of 5 conferences. The BE can no longer pull MW teams. The MW was rebuffed by BE teams. The MW is more stable simply because the nBE teams have a better chance of getting into an AQ conference.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2013 10:13 AM by Attackcoog.)
02-21-2013 09:39 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 09:17 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  What a shock, a Louisville fan talking down to current and former conference mates. 04-jawdrop

You mean like ECU fans did to CUSA teams for the past year or two? Not that he should be doing it, but you guys were basically the CUSA equivalent of Louisville to the Big East so you really have no room to talk...

As for the topic at hand, I still do think the Big East is a bit better, but I imagine if they lose a few more the MWC will once again cement itself as the best non AQ conference. I do think the attitude of the teams in the 2 conferences is vastly different. All NBE teams seem to be publicly trying to leave the conference, which I could only imagine hurt their TV deal. While several MWC want in the PAC/Big 12, most realize that it won't happen in the next few years and are content with the current situation. While NBE fans like to baselessly call us "classless," I've yet to see our administration or fans trash either conference and say they are better than it and that they can't wait to get out, etc.

With that being said, if they get a few more defections and teams scrambling for the lifeboats, the MWC should be better in a few years time.
02-21-2013 09:43 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
The depth of the league doesn't really matter, what does matter is that Boise State is clearly the best program out of the two leagues and so they will likely be getting the spot more often than not. The MWC will reap the benefits of the extra $$$ that the Big East will not be getting.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2013 09:54 AM by Riptsa.)
02-21-2013 09:53 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 09:10 AM)gocards#1 Wrote:  
(02-21-2013 12:09 AM)Texas2Step Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:18 PM)gocards#1 Wrote:  

When did UConn receive an invite? When did Cincinnati receive an invite? The only thing a reputable journalist can do is talk about reality, not hypothetical futures, when comparing the futures of two or more leagues. How would you react if he were comparing the Big 12 and ACC, and said "Well UNC/UVA/VTech/etc. are as good as gone, so let's just take them out of our analysis". Wouldn't make sense right?

My point is that the Big East is unstable, the MWC is not. The thread was about the future of the two conferences, and I think the fact that everyone in the Big East wants to jump ASAP proves it doesn't have a very bright future. Compare that to the MWC, who just had two members thumb their noses at the Big East.

The Big East with Louisville and Rutgers gives it a competitive advantage over the MWC, without them the MWC is a better conference. Yes, the MWC has some God awful teams, but the top half of the conference is much better than the top half of the Big East going forward. The Big East is mostly average programs and crappy programs, the MWC is an elite program, a bunch of average programs, and a bunch of crappy programs. The two are similar, but the MWC is slightly better.

The MWC is not stable, It simply only has 2 or 3 teams worth taking. 2nd, They didn't have 2 members thumb their nose at BE, Boise was bribed to the ill effect of all the rest of the MWC. It needs to be renamed the Blue nose conf. SD had its hand forced, It didn't want to go back.

Louisville in football up until last year had been very average for a few years, so quit puffing your feathers, and go back to flying into windows and mirrors like a stupid lil red bird should. Enjoy your ride in football it won't last real long.
02-21-2013 10:06 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-21-2013 09:17 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  What a shock, a Louisville fan talking down to current and former conference mates. 04-jawdrop

including cincy which has won as many BE champs as they have, and UCONN who I think also has 1 and a tie. Louisville has not been a monster of the BE, and will be even less of one in the ACC.
02-21-2013 10:09 AM
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RE: SI.com nBE vs. MWC Who has better long term future?
(02-20-2013 10:53 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-20-2013 10:26 PM)HuskieTap22 Wrote:  Too much back and not enough forward analysis in the article. Once Cinci leaves the pendulum undoubtedly swings toward the MWC.

MWC is in unpopulated areas, but actually owns many of them. Other than UConn and Navy, BE doesn't. BE is more subject to poaching.

Top of MWC is better, so they will be perceived much better despite the weakness at the bottom.

Big East football will have weakness at the bottom, too -- for starters, they have Memphis and Tulane.

Memphis FB is down...but they are not a weak fanbase. They win, they'll get a legit 35-40k fans for BE games.
02-21-2013 10:10 AM
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