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MTPiKapp Offline
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Post: #21
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-10-2011 10:25 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  Why do y'all care so much? LaTech is committed to their conference barring an invite from Conference USA... which can be said for every single Sun Belt team.

Get. Over. It.

There's a big difference between Sun Belt schools being committed to the Sun Belt and La Tech being committed to the WAC. Neither conference is great, but at least in the Sun Belt we all make geographical sense. The administration at Tech has to take a hard line about being committed to the WAC because they backed themselves into a corner with all their trash talk about the Sun Belt when the WAC actually did make sense for La Tech, despite being a geographical oddity, because the top of the conference was dramatically better than the Sun Belt. That dramatically better top half of the conference is now gone, La Tech had a chance to display some humility and to make nice and they could be in a conference that made much more sense for them. They decided to continue the hard line and be in a conference no better than the Sun Belt, with worse geography. They made their choice, personally I don't really care one way or the other if Tech joins our conference nor do I really care what they say about us, but I understand why some people do.
07-10-2011 08:04 PM
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westcoastwolf Offline
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Post: #22
RE: denigrating the conference
I'm too young to get the ASU-LA Tech hatred first-hand, but those comments are changing that.

Piss on LA Tech.
07-10-2011 08:31 PM
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Post: #23
RE: denigrating the conference
There are two reasons La.Tech hasn't joined the Sun Belt and don't believe any BS about the quality of the league because there are only two reasons.

#1. Wright Waters tried to talk Reneau out of going to the WAC and told Reneau that the WAC wasn't stable and would fall apart around him. No way Reneau is going to ever admit that he was wrong by bring Tech back.

#2. ULM is in the conference. In football Tech leads ULM 29-14 but when the two were in the same conference together in the Southland, ULM went 5-1 vs. Tech. The leadership at Tech knows ULM is in a precarious situation and if they rejoin ULM has a greater chance of survival. The irony of that is that if Tech had stuck with the Sun Belt, it is unlikely ULM would be an FBS school today because ULM would have never gotten in the Sun Belt and with the changes to FBS criteria would likely have not been able to meet them.
07-10-2011 08:52 PM
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BlueRaiderFan. Offline
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Post: #24
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-10-2011 08:31 PM)westcoastwolf Wrote:  I'm too young to get the ASU-LA Tech hatred first-hand, but those comments are changing that.

Piss on LA Tech.

Interact with their fans for a bit and you'll think you are talking to Florida fans. They have a GREATLY exagerated opinon of themselves.
(This post was last modified: 07-13-2011 05:56 PM by BlueRaiderFan..)
07-10-2011 09:00 PM
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Adler Offline
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Post: #25
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-10-2011 06:44 AM)SpaceRaider Wrote:  while looking for news on the Sun Belt, came across this article from the Shreveport Times. Excerpt:

Quote:In line with his fans, Van De Velde doesn't think moving to the Sun Belt would be a smart move for Tech, despite the WAC's football teams often being rated at or below those in the Sun Belt.

"When you look at the conference we're competing in, it's not just about football "» it's also about academics and how things fit the vision of the institution "» graduation rates," Van De Velde said. "No one wants to compete in a league that takes short cuts academically and that faces a lot of APR problems. For the most part, we don't have that in the WAC."

Where do they get these ideas that there are Sun Belt schools that "take short cuts academically and face a lot of APR problems"?

(05-24-2011 02:01 PM)SkullyMaroo Wrote:  Best I can tell, here are the programs that are suffering a penalty due to not meeting APR requirements per sport:

ASU -none

DENVER - none

FAU
- Football - 3 scholarship reduction

FIU
- Football - 1 scholarship reduction

MTSU - none

TROY - none

UALR - none

ULL - none

ULM
- Women's Outdoor Track - .45 scholarship reduction
- Women's Indoor Track - .45 scholarship reduction
- Men's Outdoor Track - 1.1 scholarship reduction
- Men's Indoor Track - 1.1 scholarship reduction
- Men's Basketball - 3 scholarship reduction
- Football - 7 scholarship reduction

UNT - none

USA - none

WKU - none
07-10-2011 11:20 PM
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westcoastwolf Offline
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Post: #26
RE: denigrating the conference
Didn't LA Tech have APR issues for basketball based on the 2010 report?

As did:

Idaho - football
New Mexico State - football
San Jose State - women's basketball
UT-San Antonio - Women's indoor track, women's outdoor track, baseball
07-10-2011 11:50 PM
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YouCanUseaMint Offline
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Post: #27
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-10-2011 05:19 PM)trojanbrutha Wrote:  
(07-10-2011 10:25 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  Why do y'all care so much? LaTech is committed to their conference barring an invite from Conference USA... which can be said for every single Sun Belt team.

Get. Over. It.

Tell you what...since you feel like your conference-mates and your teams, as a whole, are far superior than that of the SBC, let's get some games going and we'll put those WHACK theories to the test. Honestly, I care far less than one crap about the politics of it all...what I do care about is an up-start in a dying conference coming to the defense of a moron that doesn't even have a clue as to why tech is doing anything they're doing...
Few things here.

I don't think our teams are "far superior" than that of the Sun Belt. I'm in fact very aware that football in the Western Athletic Conference is going to suck.. but I'm extremely grateful for our opportunity to transition in such a league where we aren't losing all games. I just don't understand 1) your desire for LaTech and 2) your obsession for LaTech. They don't want to go to the Sun Belt just as UNT doesn't want the WAC. Both want into Conference USA and both are sticking with what they have currently until that golden opportunity opens up.

And FWIW, I would love to start series with several belt schools. I think the WAC could spark a lot more fire as a rival conference compared to the MAC.
07-11-2011 12:53 AM
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thetastygreek Offline
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Post: #28
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-10-2011 11:20 PM)Adler Wrote:  Where do they get these ideas that there are Sun Belt schools that "take short cuts academically and face a lot of APR problems"?

I'm not saying that the criticism is accurate, but I do think that just looking at this year's APR penalties doesn't paint an accurate picture of where that criticism is coming from.

This year... There is at least one athletics program that has three sports below the 925 mark, with no current penalties applied.

Last year, we had several teams that had scholarship reductions and/or restricted practice time in Men's Basketball. I don't know for sure that I remember them all off the top of my head, so I won't name names... But I can think of at least 3 schools (and I'm pretty sure there was a 4th) that were under penalty last year. That doesn't include schools that were below the 925 mark but weren't penalized.

There's one athletics department, which I won't name because I don't want it to seem like I'm ripping them in a year when they've taken a huge (and VERY commendable) APR leap forward... But one of our member schools sponsors 15 sports. Last year, SEVEN of them were hit with APR penalties. Another one of their programs was below 925, but was given a conditional waiver to avoid penalties in that year. Another program was 39 points below the 925 mark, but also unpenalized. Add it up, and 9 of their 15 sports were below par according to APR benchmarks. And this isn't ancient history... It's last year.

Anyway... I don't know how this compares to the WAC, but anyone looking at our conference APR history ***prior to this year's reports*** could, if they were looking to find fault, conceivably hit the conference overall with a bad APR label. And when you consider the source of the quote, and which school that source was undoubtedly looking at first and most intently... I'm not shocked that the reputation lingers in his mind.

It's not the problem it was in recent years, but it WAS a problem in recent years. Improving doesn't mean it never happened.
07-11-2011 01:17 AM
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trojanbrutha Offline
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Post: #29
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 12:53 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  
(07-10-2011 05:19 PM)trojanbrutha Wrote:  
(07-10-2011 10:25 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  Why do y'all care so much? LaTech is committed to their conference barring an invite from Conference USA... which can be said for every single Sun Belt team.

Get. Over. It.

Tell you what...since you feel like your conference-mates and your teams, as a whole, are far superior than that of the SBC, let's get some games going and we'll put those WHACK theories to the test. Honestly, I care far less than one crap about the politics of it all...what I do care about is an up-start in a dying conference coming to the defense of a moron that doesn't even have a clue as to why tech is doing anything they're doing...
Few things here.

I don't think our teams are "far superior" than that of the Sun Belt. I'm in fact very aware that football in the Western Athletic Conference is going to suck.. but I'm extremely grateful for our opportunity to transition in such a league where we aren't losing all games. I just don't understand 1) your desire for LaTech and 2) your obsession for LaTech. They don't want to go to the Sun Belt just as UNT doesn't want the WAC. Both want into Conference USA and both are sticking with what they have currently until that golden opportunity opens up.

And FWIW, I would love to start series with several belt schools. I think the WAC could spark a lot more fire as a rival conference compared to the MAC.

How can you be grateful for a dying conference grasing for any straw willing to be stuck down in a Heineken bottle? But, hey, low-hanging fruit ain't that hard to get and it could be pretty hot 01-rivals 04-cheers
07-11-2011 08:28 AM
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FIUFan Offline
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Post: #30
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 12:53 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  Few things here.
I don't think our teams are "far superior" than that of the Sun Belt. I'm in fact very aware that football in the Western Athletic Conference is going to suck.. but I'm extremely grateful for our opportunity to transition in such a league where we aren't losing all games. I just don't understand 1) your desire for LaTech and 2) your obsession for LaTech. They don't want to go to the Sun Belt just as UNT doesn't want the WAC. Both want into Conference USA and both are sticking with what they have currently until that golden opportunity opens up.
And FWIW, I would love to start series with several belt schools. I think the WAC could spark a lot more fire as a rival conference compared to the MAC.

Time for me to chime in here.03-melodramatic

If you look hard at your own situation (that of the WAC's issues with expansion), you begin to see the answer to your own question (why the SBC obsession with LTU). Quality football programs are a rare commodity, therefore they have a very high value. FCS and start-up programs are a dime-a-dozen these days, however, to get to where we want to go, higher up the non-AQ pecking order, you must add 'quality' football programs...or none at all.

This is clearly the WAC's weakness right now. Their quality has left and there are very few programs which want to be associated with this carrion. Also note that there aren't any non-AQ's that would look at the SBC seriously right now and lord knows we don't want any more FCS programs (aside from Appy.). Hence, the only water in the desert, La Tech.

So there's you answer, La Tech has the potential to take the Belt to the next level (i.e. above the MAC and challenging C-USA). There just seems to be too much bad blood at this time. However, give the Techsters a couple years in the new-WAC, with huge, lopsided scores being posted by their conference mates and I believe you will begin to see a thawing of relations.

p.s. why doesn't UL-L and UL-M merge and become the real 'University of Louisiana'.
07-11-2011 09:34 AM
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Fanof49ASU Offline
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Post: #31
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 09:34 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  So there's you answer, La Tech has the potential to take the Belt to the next level (i.e. above the MAC and challenging C-USA).

How would they do that? Putting us in a better financial situation?
I don't see them as better athletically as the top of our conference.
07-11-2011 10:35 AM
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FIUFan Offline
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Post: #32
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 10:35 AM)Fanof49ASU Wrote:  
(07-11-2011 09:34 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  So there's you answer, La Tech has the potential to take the Belt to the next level (i.e. above the MAC and challenging C-USA).
How would they do that? Putting us in a better financial situation?
I don't see them as better athletically as the top of our conference.

BCS football units.
07-11-2011 10:51 AM
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Side Show Joe Offline
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Post: #33
RE: denigrating the conference
I think LA Tech gave the finger to the only lifeboat out there, when they insulted the academics of the Sun Belt in this article. C-USA will never invite LA Tech. This was the only chance for LA Tech to escape the new WAC. I don't see the Sun Belt extending an offer to LA Tech after reading those statements. Within 5-10 years, UTSA will be the best expansion option in the WAC. Even if they stink as an FBS football team, the market of San Antonio will make them more attractive then even a good LA Tech in Ruston, and LA Tech will be back to where they are today, trying to find FCS football programs and rebuilding the WAC.
07-11-2011 11:02 AM
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NCowl Offline
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Post: #34
RE: denigrating the conference
maybe LaTech just wants to stay in the WAC so they can finally have a chance for a conference championship with all those nonthreatening FCS teams. 03-idea

let them stay!
07-11-2011 11:17 AM
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YouCanUseaMint Offline
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Post: #35
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 11:17 AM)NCowl Wrote:  maybe LaTech just wants to stay in the WAC so they can finally have a chance for a conference championship with all those nonthreatening FCS teams. 03-idea

let them stay!
Don't they have a conf title?
07-11-2011 11:34 AM
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CajunT Offline
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Post: #36
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 09:34 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(07-11-2011 12:53 AM)YouCanUseaMint Wrote:  Few things here.
I don't think our teams are "far superior" than that of the Sun Belt. I'm in fact very aware that football in the Western Athletic Conference is going to suck.. but I'm extremely grateful for our opportunity to transition in such a league where we aren't losing all games. I just don't understand 1) your desire for LaTech and 2) your obsession for LaTech. They don't want to go to the Sun Belt just as UNT doesn't want the WAC. Both want into Conference USA and both are sticking with what they have currently until that golden opportunity opens up.
And FWIW, I would love to start series with several belt schools. I think the WAC could spark a lot more fire as a rival conference compared to the MAC.

Time for me to chime in here.03-melodramatic

If you look hard at your own situation (that of the WAC's issues with expansion), you begin to see the answer to your own question (why the SBC obsession with LTU). Quality football programs are a rare commodity, therefore they have a very high value. FCS and start-up programs are a dime-a-dozen these days, however, to get to where we want to go, higher up the non-AQ pecking order, you must add 'quality' football programs...or none at all.

This is clearly the WAC's weakness right now. Their quality has left and there are very few programs which want to be associated with this carrion. Also note that there aren't any non-AQ's that would look at the SBC seriously right now and lord knows we don't want any more FCS programs (aside from Appy.). Hence, the only water in the desert, La Tech.

So there's you answer, La Tech has the potential to take the Belt to the next level (i.e. above the MAC and challenging C-USA). There just seems to be too much bad blood at this time. However, give the Techsters a couple years in the new-WAC, with huge, lopsided scores being posted by their conference mates and I believe you will begin to see a thawing of relations.

p.s. why doesn't UL-L and UL-M merge and become the real 'University of Louisiana'.

The short answer to your question is we don't need them to become the real "University of Louisiana'. We are working on becoming a TIER I Univeristy, once that happens no matter what name is used, we will be the "Real University of Louisiana".
07-11-2011 11:40 AM
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FIUFan Offline
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Post: #37
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 11:02 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I think LA Tech gave the finger to the only lifeboat out there, when they insulted the academics of the Sun Belt in this article. C-USA will never invite LA Tech. This was the only chance for LA Tech to escape the new WAC. I don't see the Sun Belt extending an offer to LA Tech after reading those statements. Within 5-10 years, UTSA will be the best expansion option in the WAC. Even if they stink as an FBS football team, the market of San Antonio will make them more attractive then even a good LA Tech in Ruston, and LA Tech will be back to where they are today, trying to find FCS football programs and rebuilding the WAC.

The only 'finger' this could possibly apply to is ULM. Other than them, the SBC and WAC programs have very similar APR scholarship sanctions among the remaining programs.

Yes, I'm getting tired of explaining away La Tech's foot-in-mouth disease and I can see how the rest of the Belt members might look disdainfully at them. But sooner or later the 'strengths' of mutual cooperation are going to override this pettiness.
07-11-2011 11:56 AM
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Side Show Joe Offline
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Post: #38
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 11:56 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(07-11-2011 11:02 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I think LA Tech gave the finger to the only lifeboat out there, when they insulted the academics of the Sun Belt in this article. C-USA will never invite LA Tech. This was the only chance for LA Tech to escape the new WAC. I don't see the Sun Belt extending an offer to LA Tech after reading those statements. Within 5-10 years, UTSA will be the best expansion option in the WAC. Even if they stink as an FBS football team, the market of San Antonio will make them more attractive then even a good LA Tech in Ruston, and LA Tech will be back to where they are today, trying to find FCS football programs and rebuilding the WAC.

The only 'finger' this could possibly apply to is ULM. Other than them, the SBC and WAC programs have very similar APR scholarship sanctions among the remaining programs.

Yes, I'm getting tired of explaining away La Tech's foot-in-mouth disease and I can see how the rest of the Belt members might look disdainfully at them. But sooner or later the 'strengths' of mutual cooperation are going to override this pettiness.

There will no longer be a strength of mutual cooperation in the next few years. Once UTSA is a full blown FBS program, they should be the top WAC target for any future expansion by the Sun Belt. The addition of the San Antonio market will make much more financial since, and they will provide regional road games for ULL, ULM, ASU, and UNT. The 12th school should come out of the east to create a regional program foe Troy, MTSU, USA, WKU, and FAU and FIU, if possible.
07-11-2011 12:26 PM
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FIUFan Offline
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Post: #39
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 12:26 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  There will no longer be a strength of mutual cooperation in the next few years. Once UTSA is a full blown FBS program, they should be the top WAC target for any future expansion by the Sun Belt. The addition of the San Antonio market will make much more financial since, and they will provide regional road games for ULL, ULM, ASU, and UNT. The 12th school should come out of the east to create a regional program foe Troy, MTSU, USA, WKU, and FAU and FIU, if possible.

UTSA will not be a viable FBS program for at least 10 years, if ever. The shell-shock to the road runner faithful when their sophomore/r.shirt freshman team go up against real AQ programs in a couple of years is going to knock them back to the stone age. The devastation meted out will take years for those who see instant success to recover from.

So again, take another FCS (with fingers-crossed) or take an established FBS; appears to be a no-brainer to me. I don't know about you but I don't want to wait another 10 years for respectability.
(This post was last modified: 07-11-2011 12:44 PM by FIUFan.)
07-11-2011 12:39 PM
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Post: #40
RE: denigrating the conference
(07-11-2011 12:39 PM)FIUFan Wrote:  UTSA will not be a viable FBS program for at least 10 years, if ever. The shell-shock to the road runner faithful when their sophomore/r.shirt freshman team go up against real AQ programs in a couple of years is going to knock them back to the stone age. The devastation meted out will take years for those who see instant success to recover from.

So again, take another FCS (with fingers-crossed) or take an established FBS; appears to be a no-brainer to me. I don't know about you but I don't want to wait another 10 years for respectability.

My god, once again I agree with an FIU fan. This world is turning itself upside down. 03-cloud904-cheers

This is probably the ONE chance the confrence has to shake the moniker we have of being a FCS startup confrence. It's plagued it ever since FAU/FIU had to move up to keep the confrence viable. Now it is the WAC's turn, since they are in survival mode.

They can now be known as the "startup" confrence for the next decade or so.
(This post was last modified: 07-11-2011 12:56 PM by OwlFamily.)
07-11-2011 12:55 PM
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