Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)


Post Reply 
Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
FIUFan Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,498
Joined: Aug 2009
Reputation: 96
I Root For: FIU
Location: Coral Gables, FL
Post: #1
Exclamation Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
It is clear that since 2005 more and more blue-chip football players are now coming to the Sun Belt.

Here's the breakdown of rivals 3*** football recruits since then:

2005 - 10
2006 - 4
2007 - 14
2008 - 33...increase = 136%
2009 - 32
2010 - 53...increase = 66%
2011 - 56


Why did the Sun Belt do so poorly in OOC games this year (beyond the difficult schedule)? Well just looking at the recruiting statistics tells me that the senior class this year were from 2007 (14 3***'s in the entire class). Starting this year there will be more quality Sun Belt atheltes on the field than ever before....and the pipeline only gets thicker from here.

There are potentially 174 3*** athletes, from the four previous recruiting classes, making up the 9 Sun Belt teams right now (that's ~19 per team) .

Anybody want to go to the WAC? 03-lmfao
02-03-2011 10:07 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


BlueRaiderFan. Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,223
Joined: May 2010
Reputation: 92
I Root For: Middle Tennesse
Location:
Post: #2
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 10:07 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  It is clear that since 2005 more and more blue-chip football players are now coming to the Sun Belt.

Here's the breakdown of rivals 3*** football recruits since then:

2005 - 10
2006 - 4
2007 - 14
2008 - 33...increase = 136%
2009 - 32
2010 - 53...increase = 66%
2011 - 56


Why did the Sun Belt do so poorly in OOC games this year (beyond the difficult schedule)? Well just looking at the recruiting statistics tells me that the senior class this year were from 2007 (14 3***'s in the entire class). Starting this year there will be more quality Sun Belt atheltes on the field than ever before....and the pipeline only gets thicker from here.

There are potentially 174 3*** athletes, from the four previous recruiting classes, making up the 9 Sun Belt teams right now (that's ~19 per team) .

Anybody want to go to the WAC? 03-lmfao

Interesting!
02-03-2011 11:16 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
TeKERaider Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,413
Joined: Oct 2009
Reputation: 78
I Root For: MTSU
Location:
Post: #3
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.
02-03-2011 11:39 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
FIUFan Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,498
Joined: Aug 2009
Reputation: 96
I Root For: FIU
Location: Coral Gables, FL
Post: #4
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Do you have a link? Just in a cursory look at the first 3 conferences (ACC, B12, BE) from 2007 to 2008, there doesn't appear to be a marked increase in the number of 3*'s in those conferences (maybe slight decrease). I'd like to have the database to be able to get the exact totals for each of those years; but I'm sure it's proprietary.

Anyways, would like to see something more definitive so that we can get a more accurate picture.

p.s. this rivals blogger ranked the AQ conferences based on signings from the 2006-2010 periods and made no mention of this "adjustment".
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-312875
(This post was last modified: 02-03-2011 11:55 AM by FIUFan.)
02-03-2011 11:54 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
MG61 Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,137
Joined: Jun 2010
Reputation: 79
I Root For: UNT
Location:
Post: #5
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 10:07 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  It is clear that since 2005 more and more blue-chip football players are now coming to the Sun Belt.

Here's the breakdown of rivals 3*** football recruits since then:

2005 - 10
2006 - 4
2007 - 14
2008 - 33...increase = 136%
2009 - 32
2010 - 53...increase = 66%
2011 - 56


Why did the Sun Belt do so poorly in OOC games this year (beyond the difficult schedule)? Well just looking at the recruiting statistics tells me that the senior class this year were from 2007 (14 3***'s in the entire class). Starting this year there will be more quality Sun Belt atheltes on the field than ever before....and the pipeline only gets thicker from here.

There are potentially 174 3*** athletes, from the four previous recruiting classes, making up the 9 Sun Belt teams right now (that's ~19 per team) .

Anybody want to go to the WAC? 03-lmfao

What's the WAC ? Women's Auxillary Corps ?:odie:
02-03-2011 11:55 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Fanof49ASU Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,813
Joined: Jul 2004
Reputation: 258
I Root For: stAte
Location: Nashville, TN
Post: #6
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 11:55 AM)MG61 Wrote:  What's the WAC ? Women's Auxillary Corps ?:odie:

Here's a classic thread from the WAC board. If you can't laugh at yourself, you'll be miserable....especially in the WAC.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=451&f=2368&t=7126068

"Will Anyone Care".....my favorite. "Welcome Anyone Conference"...a close 2nd.
02-03-2011 12:03 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


MG61 Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,137
Joined: Jun 2010
Reputation: 79
I Root For: UNT
Location:
Post: #7
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 12:03 PM)Fanof49ASU Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:55 AM)MG61 Wrote:  What's the WAC ? Women's Auxillary Corps ?:odie:

Here's a classic thread from the WAC board. If you can't laugh at yourself, you'll be miserable....especially in the WAC.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=451&f=2368&t=7126068

"Will Anyone Care".....my favorite. "Welcome Anyone Conference"...a close 2nd.

if they move too soon on UNT again, it could be "We Annoy Candidates".01-france
02-03-2011 12:10 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Fanof49ASU Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,813
Joined: Jul 2004
Reputation: 258
I Root For: stAte
Location: Nashville, TN
Post: #8
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 12:10 PM)MG61 Wrote:  if they move too soon on UNT again, it could be "We Annoy Candidates".01-france

03-lmfao
02-03-2011 12:12 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
FIUFan Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,498
Joined: Aug 2009
Reputation: 96
I Root For: FIU
Location: Coral Gables, FL
Post: #9
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Just located the actual number of 3*'s from rivals extensive database (thanks fanatic). Shows there was actually a drop in 3*'s from '07 to '08 of 45 athletes. However, from 2009 to 2010 there was a net increase of 25% in 3*'s year-over-year (and a corresponding decrease in 2*'s).

So this may tell us that rivals has thrown more resources into recruiting in the past 12/24 months, meaning that fewer recruits are going unranked and hence only receiving a 2* (all FBS signees get at least 2*'s). The college signings may also be a derivative of the economy as a whole as there was 10% drop in signings in 2008 from 2007 which then came back up in 2009 and 2010.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830
02-03-2011 05:03 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
InjunJohn Offline
Sun Belt Nationalist
*

Posts: 935
Joined: Jul 2009
Reputation: 51
I Root For: ULM
Location:
Post: #10
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 05:03 PM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Just located the actual number of 3*'s from rivals extensive database (thanks fanatic). Shows there was actually a drop in 3*'s from '07 to '08 of 45 athletes. However, from 2009 to 2010 there was a net increase of 25% in 3*'s year-over-year (and a corresponding decrease in 2*'s).

So this may tell us that rivals has thrown more resources into recruiting in the past 12/24 months, meaning that fewer recruits are going unranked and hence only receiving a 2* (all FBS signees get at least 2*'s). The college signings may also be a derivative of the economy as a whole as there was 10% drop in signings in 2008 from 2007 which then came back up in 2009 and 2010.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830

There is a difference between being unrated and getting a 2* as a default at the end or being rated and getting a legitmate 2*. But I don't buy the "more assets meaning more 3*" arguement. If that is the case, that is saying that Rivals is saying there are more and more kids that are legitmate mid major stars in the making which I don't buy. If you raise the number of the 3* population, it cheapens the meaning of that star ranking.

If you are stuck on stars, then I would say look at Scout, Rivals, ESPN, and whoever. If all of them are in the same ball park, then you probably got a good feel for where this kid is at. If they are all over the board, then probably not so much.

IMHO the best way to gauge is look at who is offering to see where that player may lay. I will tell you this, I would much rather have a 2* that is offered by a couple of SEC teams as opposed to a 3* that none are offering.
02-03-2011 05:12 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
FIUFanatic Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,961
Joined: May 2004
Reputation: 52
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #11
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 11:54 AM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Do you have a link? Just in a cursory look at the first 3 conferences (ACC, B12, BE) from 2007 to 2008, there doesn't appear to be a marked increase in the number of 3*'s in those conferences (maybe slight decrease). I'd like to have the database to be able to get the exact totals for each of those years; but I'm sure it's proprietary.

Anyways, would like to see something more definitive so that we can get a more accurate picture.

p.s. this rivals blogger ranked the AQ conferences based on signings from the 2006-2010 periods and made no mention of this "adjustment".
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-312875

Very interesting stuff, based on statistics, FIUFan.

Actually, the year that rivals started increasing their 3-stars was in 2009 and 2010, with a 21.7% increase in 2009 over 2008, and a 24.9% increase in 2010 over 2009. However, in 2009 there was only a 1% decrease in 2-star players compared to 2008, and in 2010 there was a major drop, of 20% of 2-stars players signing with FBS teams, compared to that of 2009. 2010 was the first year in the 5-year period studied, where there were more 3-stars signed by FBS teams than 2-stars.

There's another article on this same subject, but based on how many All Americans each "star" produces, and it lists how many 5, 4, 3, and 2 -stars signed with FBS teams.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830

EDIT: FIUFan, I see you already incorporated these numbers into your analysis....Thanks
(This post was last modified: 02-03-2011 05:20 PM by FIUFanatic.)
02-03-2011 05:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


FIUFanatic Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,961
Joined: May 2004
Reputation: 52
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #12
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 05:12 PM)InjunJohn Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 05:03 PM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Just located the actual number of 3*'s from rivals extensive database (thanks fanatic). Shows there was actually a drop in 3*'s from '07 to '08 of 45 athletes. However, from 2009 to 2010 there was a net increase of 25% in 3*'s year-over-year (and a corresponding decrease in 2*'s).

So this may tell us that rivals has thrown more resources into recruiting in the past 12/24 months, meaning that fewer recruits are going unranked and hence only receiving a 2* (all FBS signees get at least 2*'s). The college signings may also be a derivative of the economy as a whole as there was 10% drop in signings in 2008 from 2007 which then came back up in 2009 and 2010.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830

There is a difference between being unrated and getting a 2* as a default at the end or being rated and getting a legitmate 2*. But I don't buy the "more assets meaning more 3*" arguement. If that is the case, that is saying that Rivals is saying there are more and more kids that are legitmate mid major stars in the making which I don't buy. If you raise the number of the 3* population, it cheapens the meaning of that star ranking.

If you are stuck on stars, then I would say look at Scout, Rivals, ESPN, and whoever. If all of them are in the same ball park, then you probably got a good feel for where this kid is at. If they are all over the board, then probably not so much.

IMHO the best way to gauge is look at who is offering to see where that player may lay. I will tell you this, I would much rather have a 2* that is offered by a couple of SEC teams as opposed to a 3* that none are offering.

I generally agree with you in terms of your first argument as well as looking at which teams are actually really offering scholarships to a player, which I don't feel is necessarily contrary to what FIUFan is saying, but he didn't mention that some are actually evaluated. There are 2-stars assigned (subjectively, of course) because that is what the evaluator thought, but also there are some because the player wasn't really evaluated, and they automatically "assign" 2 stars to an FBS signee.

As for how you perceive that the increase of 3-stars "cheapens" the value of the ranking, I guess that is one valid way to look at it, from a 2 vs. 3 star players' viewpoint. However, if you suscribe to that theory, then it only makes it look worse for a team...and conference...full of only 2-star players that were actually evaluated by the same evaluator.
(This post was last modified: 02-03-2011 05:40 PM by FIUFanatic.)
02-03-2011 05:38 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
InjunJohn Offline
Sun Belt Nationalist
*

Posts: 935
Joined: Jul 2009
Reputation: 51
I Root For: ULM
Location:
Post: #13
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 05:38 PM)FIUFanatic Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 05:12 PM)InjunJohn Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 05:03 PM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Just located the actual number of 3*'s from rivals extensive database (thanks fanatic). Shows there was actually a drop in 3*'s from '07 to '08 of 45 athletes. However, from 2009 to 2010 there was a net increase of 25% in 3*'s year-over-year (and a corresponding decrease in 2*'s).

So this may tell us that rivals has thrown more resources into recruiting in the past 12/24 months, meaning that fewer recruits are going unranked and hence only receiving a 2* (all FBS signees get at least 2*'s). The college signings may also be a derivative of the economy as a whole as there was 10% drop in signings in 2008 from 2007 which then came back up in 2009 and 2010.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830

There is a difference between being unrated and getting a 2* as a default at the end or being rated and getting a legitmate 2*. But I don't buy the "more assets meaning more 3*" arguement. If that is the case, that is saying that Rivals is saying there are more and more kids that are legitmate mid major stars in the making which I don't buy. If you raise the number of the 3* population, it cheapens the meaning of that star ranking.

If you are stuck on stars, then I would say look at Scout, Rivals, ESPN, and whoever. If all of them are in the same ball park, then you probably got a good feel for where this kid is at. If they are all over the board, then probably not so much.

IMHO the best way to gauge is look at who is offering to see where that player may lay. I will tell you this, I would much rather have a 2* that is offered by a couple of SEC teams as opposed to a 3* that none are offering.

I generally agree with you in terms of your first argument as well as looking at which teams are actually really offering scholarships to a player, which I don't feel is necessarily contrary to what FIUFan is saying, but he didn't mention that some are actually evaluated. There are 2-stars assigned (subjectively, of course) because that is what the evaluator thought, but also there are some because the player wasn't really evaluated, and they automatically "assign" 2 stars to an FBS signee.

As for how you perceive that the increase of 3-stars "cheapens" the value of the ranking, I guess that is one valid way to look at it, from a 2 vs. 3 star players' viewpoint. However, if you suscribe to that theory, then it only makes it look worse for a team...and conference...full of only 2-star players that were actually evaluated by the same evaluator.

or it could be argued as to where Rivals puts its assets and how much support they have. Some schools have a big presence on Rivals and a lot of support for their pages. Others have a token presence. Quite frankly, the only thing that the ULM rivals page gets is what if mines from the Scout page.

I am a firm believer that Rivals is geared more towards the big schools and "name" athletes. I don't think they re-evaluate during the year. I personally feel that Scout does a better job of looking and evaluating more players. Just my opinion and it is probably skewed because of the work our Scout page guy does and the information we get from that site.

Bottom line: Do they qualify and do they make the field and do they make you competitive. We will know in a couple of years.
02-03-2011 07:08 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
FIUFanatic Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,961
Joined: May 2004
Reputation: 52
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #14
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
Agree with that latest notion, and that's what it comes down to, who actually qualifies and plays for each team and his development through the years. Still, the facts those articles bring are no less interesting and telling.
02-03-2011 07:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CajunT Offline
Basement Dweller Hater

Posts: 2,333
Joined: May 2007
I Root For: Louisiana
Location:
Post: #15
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-03-2011 05:03 PM)FIUFan Wrote:  
(02-03-2011 11:39 AM)TeKERaider Wrote:  From what i understand starting in 08 rivals almost doubled the amount of 3* given so take that into consideration.

Just located the actual number of 3*'s from rivals extensive database (thanks fanatic). Shows there was actually a drop in 3*'s from '07 to '08 of 45 athletes. However, from 2009 to 2010 there was a net increase of 25% in 3*'s year-over-year (and a corresponding decrease in 2*'s).

So this may tell us that rivals has thrown more resources into recruiting in the past 12/24 months, meaning that fewer recruits are going unranked and hence only receiving a 2* (all FBS signees get at least 2*'s). The college signings may also be a derivative of the economy as a whole as there was 10% drop in signings in 2008 from 2007 which then came back up in 2009 and 2010.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/bl...aaf-311830

I don't see how Rivals grading out more athletes with 3-stars means they are putting more resources into recruiting. That's a huge assumption on your part, without actual proof. The decussion has been that Rivals has changed its grading scale and is more liberal in rating athletes 3-stars. Until Rivals makes some kind of statement in regards to the direction of their scouting department, either could be true.
02-03-2011 08:33 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
statefanatic Offline
Howl at the Moon
*

Posts: 3,380
Joined: Feb 2009
Reputation: 95
I Root For: stAte
Location: jonesboro
Post: #16
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
It's not about star, but about who offered them. That's what I look at when ASU signs a kid. We have many this class that were offered by SEC and Big 12 schools.
02-04-2011 07:09 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


dahbeed Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,205
Joined: Jan 2005
Reputation: 507
I Root For: wku toppahs!!!
Location: in womans fantasies
Post: #17
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
i think i know what happened.

deep in the bowels of 'rivals h.q.' there is a map of the united states on a wall in the 'rivals war room'.

the president of rivals made a visit in one day and stuck a push pin into a little dot representing bowling green kentucky/wku......

he then spoke in a measured tone and said.....

'lets make these guys look good'.....'i don't care what it takes...who it pisses off.....that, gentlemen....is your task'

******author sidebar: well done amigos.
02-04-2011 07:46 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Fanof49ASU Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,813
Joined: Jul 2004
Reputation: 258
I Root For: stAte
Location: Nashville, TN
Post: #18
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
(02-04-2011 07:09 AM)statefanatic Wrote:  It's not about star, but about who offered them. That's what I look at when ASU signs a kid. We have many this class that were offered by SEC and Big 12 schools.

I agree.
If the AQ schools think he's good enough to offer one of their sacred scholies to, then that says more than some young writers.
02-04-2011 09:16 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BlueRaiderFan. Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,223
Joined: May 2010
Reputation: 92
I Root For: Middle Tennesse
Location:
Post: #19
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
From what I understand they take the kids word for it as to who offered and who didn't. Nothing like saying an SEC/BIG12 school offered to get you noticed. On the other hand, it is good to see the conference garner more three star players.
02-04-2011 09:28 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
trojanbrutha Offline
Beltbbs Troy Football INsider
*

Posts: 4,622
Joined: Nov 2007
Reputation: 82
I Root For: TROY
Location: Greenville, AL
Post: #20
RE: Recruiting: Sun Belt on the Rise
02-04-2011 09:33 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.