Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Vatican endorses stem-cell research
Author Message
DrTorch Offline
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
*

Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:

CrappiesDonatorsBalance of Power Contest
Post: #1
Vatican endorses stem-cell research
04-26-2010 11:43 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


cb4029 Offline
The spoon that stirs the pot.
*

Posts: 18,793
Joined: Jun 2007
Reputation: 353
I Root For: Deez Nuts
Location: B'ham

Donators
Post: #2
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
[Image: pope-remain-silent.jpg]

[Image: pope-drinks.jpg]
04-26-2010 12:21 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
RobertN Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 35,485
Joined: Jan 2003
Reputation: 95
I Root For: THE NIU Huskies
Location: Wayne's World
Post: #3
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 12:21 PM)cb4029 Wrote:  [Image: pope-remain-silent.jpg]

[Image: pope-drinks.jpg]
03-lmfao Be nice. At least they are realizing the good that can come from this: the longer we live, the more $$$ for the church. Of course they like it. As long as it isn't the potentially more effective stem cells-"embryonic".
04-26-2010 01:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ummechengr Offline
C'mon....really!?!?!
*

Posts: 4,274
Joined: Aug 2005
Reputation: 221
I Root For: Memphis Tigers
Location: Memphis, TN
Post: #4
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 01:11 PM)RobertN Wrote:  03-lmfao Be nice. At least they are realizing the good that can come from this: the longer we live, the more $$$ for the church. Of course they like it. As long as it isn't the potentially more effective stem cells-"embryonic".

By contrast, adult stem cells could be transplanted directly without genetic modification or pre-treatments. They simply differentiate according to cues from the surrounding tissues and do not give uncontrollable growth or tumours. The adult stem cells also show high degrees of genomic stability during culture. There is no problem with immune rejection because the cells can readily be isolated from the patients requiring transplant. And there is no moral objection involved. Better yet, research can be directed towards encouraging adult stem cells to regenerate and repair damaged tissues in situ, without the need for cell isolation and in vitro expansion. By minimising intervention, risks are reduced, as well as cost, making the treatment available to everyone and not just the rich.

More
04-26-2010 02:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #5
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 02:13 PM)ummechengr Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 01:11 PM)RobertN Wrote:  03-lmfao Be nice. At least they are realizing the good that can come from this: the longer we live, the more $$$ for the church. Of course they like it. As long as it isn't the potentially more effective stem cells-"embryonic".

By contrast, adult stem cells could be transplanted directly without genetic modification or pre-treatments. They simply differentiate according to cues from the surrounding tissues and do not give uncontrollable growth or tumours. The adult stem cells also show high degrees of genomic stability during culture. There is no problem with immune rejection because the cells can readily be isolated from the patients requiring transplant. And there is no moral objection involved. Better yet, research can be directed towards encouraging adult stem cells to regenerate and repair damaged tissues in situ, without the need for cell isolation and in vitro expansion. By minimising intervention, risks are reduced, as well as cost, making the treatment available to everyone and not just the rich.

More

Setting aside the possibility that the above statements might be correct, do you have a more credible site than one that's reason for being is to fight GM foods?

About I-SIS
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/about.php Wrote:About I-SIS

What is ISIS?

The Institute of Science in Society (ISIS) is a not-for-profit organization founded in 1999 by Mae-Wan Ho and Peter Saunders to work for social responsibility and sustainable approaches in science. A major part of our work is to promote critical public understanding of science and to engage both scientists and the public in open debate and discussion. ISIS has been providing inputs into the GM debate that would have been conspicuously lacking otherwise.

...
Mae-Wan Ho (CV), Director of ISIS, gained her B.Sc. in Biology and Ph. D. in Biochemistry from Hong Kong University and began postdoctoral research in human biochemical genetics in University of California at San Diego. ... She is well-known as a leading exponent of a new science of the organism which has implications for holistic health and sustainable systems, and is currently visiting Professor of Biophysics in University of Catania, Sicily. She became scientific advisor to the Third World Network in 1994, and co-founded the Institute of Science and Society with her husband and long time collaborator, Prof. Peter Saunders of King’s College, London who shares her concerns about social accountability of science and science for sustainability. ...

Peter Timothy Saunders, co-founder of ISIS, obtained his first degree in Mathematics in the University of Toronto, Canada, and his Ph.D. in Relativity and Cosmology in King’s College, London, where he is now Professor of Applied Mathematics. He has more than 35 years experience in teaching and scientific research, and is a world authority on complex dynamical systems, with key contributions to Gaia theory and physiological regulation.

Science of the organism? Gaia Theory? Do these folks think that Avatars were generated from adult stem cells?

So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Back to the topic at hand, it's pretty rare that the real-world works such that you can have your cake and eat it too. If the information from the website above were credible or true, then great - theres nothing to discuss. If "mainstream medicine" (which is surely loathe to the Homeopathic medicine advocates of ISIS) says that there is value or potential value in embryonic research, then attempts to evade the moral and ethical issues involving its research doesn't really help.

For my part, I'd suggest that embryos produced in artificial insemination attempts that are otherwise discarded should be allowed to be used for research. I understand that there is substantial proportion of our society that has objections to any use of embryonic stem cells for research or medicinal purposes and I believe that the ethical rules involved in using them should be correspondingly strict in terms of creating embryos that would otherwise not have been created.
04-26-2010 03:01 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


DrTorch Offline
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
*

Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:

CrappiesDonatorsBalance of Power Contest
Post: #6
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 03:01 PM)I45owl Wrote:  So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

"Rustum Roy – Distinguished Prof of Materials at Arizona State University and Professor of the Solid State and of Geochemistry at Pennsylvania State University - who followed up the research, and held a public demonstration in September 2007, which was reported in the National Geographic News"

What more do you need to know? 02-13-banana

As for the stem cell research, there's plenty of info here:
http://www.stemcellresearch.org/
04-26-2010 03:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ummechengr Offline
C'mon....really!?!?!
*

Posts: 4,274
Joined: Aug 2005
Reputation: 221
I Root For: Memphis Tigers
Location: Memphis, TN
Post: #7
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 03:01 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 02:13 PM)ummechengr Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 01:11 PM)RobertN Wrote:  03-lmfao Be nice. At least they are realizing the good that can come from this: the longer we live, the more $$$ for the church. Of course they like it. As long as it isn't the potentially more effective stem cells-"embryonic".

By contrast, adult stem cells could be transplanted directly without genetic modification or pre-treatments. They simply differentiate according to cues from the surrounding tissues and do not give uncontrollable growth or tumours. The adult stem cells also show high degrees of genomic stability during culture. There is no problem with immune rejection because the cells can readily be isolated from the patients requiring transplant. And there is no moral objection involved. Better yet, research can be directed towards encouraging adult stem cells to regenerate and repair damaged tissues in situ, without the need for cell isolation and in vitro expansion. By minimising intervention, risks are reduced, as well as cost, making the treatment available to everyone and not just the rich.

More

Setting aside the possibility that the above statements might be correct, do you have a more credible site than one that's reason for being is to fight GM foods?

About I-SIS
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/about.php Wrote:About I-SIS

What is ISIS?

The Institute of Science in Society (ISIS) is a not-for-profit organization founded in 1999 by Mae-Wan Ho and Peter Saunders to work for social responsibility and sustainable approaches in science. A major part of our work is to promote critical public understanding of science and to engage both scientists and the public in open debate and discussion. ISIS has been providing inputs into the GM debate that would have been conspicuously lacking otherwise.

...
Mae-Wan Ho (CV), Director of ISIS, gained her B.Sc. in Biology and Ph. D. in Biochemistry from Hong Kong University and began postdoctoral research in human biochemical genetics in University of California at San Diego. ... She is well-known as a leading exponent of a new science of the organism which has implications for holistic health and sustainable systems, and is currently visiting Professor of Biophysics in University of Catania, Sicily. She became scientific advisor to the Third World Network in 1994, and co-founded the Institute of Science and Society with her husband and long time collaborator, Prof. Peter Saunders of King’s College, London who shares her concerns about social accountability of science and science for sustainability. ...

Peter Timothy Saunders, co-founder of ISIS, obtained his first degree in Mathematics in the University of Toronto, Canada, and his Ph.D. in Relativity and Cosmology in King’s College, London, where he is now Professor of Applied Mathematics. He has more than 35 years experience in teaching and scientific research, and is a world authority on complex dynamical systems, with key contributions to Gaia theory and physiological regulation.

Science of the organism? Gaia Theory? Do these folks think that Avatars were generated from adult stem cells?

So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Back to the topic at hand, it's pretty rare that the real-world works such that you can have your cake and eat it too. If the information from the website above were credible or true, then great - theres nothing to discuss. If "mainstream medicine" (which is surely loathe to the Homeopathic medicine advocates of ISIS) says that there is value or potential value in embryonic research, then attempts to evade the moral and ethical issues involving its research doesn't really help.

For my part, I'd suggest that embryos produced in artificial insemination attempts that are otherwise discarded should be allowed to be used for research. I understand that there is substantial proportion of our society that has objections to any use of embryonic stem cells for research or medicinal purposes and I believe that the ethical rules involved in using them should be correspondingly strict in terms of creating embryos that would otherwise not have been created.

I respect your request for better sources...
http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/ar..._cell.html
http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/09/news/com.../index.htm
http://newsblaze.com/story/2009031005503...story.html

Hopefully this puts more validity behind the claim.
04-26-2010 03:54 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #8
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 03:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 03:01 PM)I45owl Wrote:  So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

"Rustum Roy – Distinguished Prof of Materials at Arizona State University and Professor of the Solid State and of Geochemistry at Pennsylvania State University - who followed up the research, and held a public demonstration in September 2007, which was reported in the National Geographic News"

What more do you need to know? 02-13-banana

I wasted plenty of time before I realized that Roy was associated with Andrew Weil and Deepak Chopra. I assume you were kidding?

(04-26-2010 03:54 PM)ummechengr Wrote:  I respect your request for better sources...
http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/ar..._cell.html
http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/09/news/com.../index.htm
http://newsblaze.com/story/2009031005503...story.html

Hopefully this puts more validity behind the claim.

Thanks. I didn't intend to ridicule you, but the folks behind ISIS are another matter...

It seems to me that to ethically justify using embryonic cells, the criteria would rest on whether they provide a benefit that is not otherwise available under reasonable circumstances. Unless you can prove that everything an embryonic cell can do could instead be done with adult stem cells, the question of whether adult cells are themselves valuable is almost a side-question. But, it seems prudent to exhaust research on adult stem cells - at least in specific research topics - before you go down the path of using embryonic cells in that topic of research. But, I think that option should remain open.

I understand some of the concerns of anti-abortionists with regards to embryos. I don't understand why organ donation for transplant or research is considered morally valiant whilst use of embryos for essentially the same purpose is considered morally reprehensible. There is a substantial ethical leap between considering using embryos that already exist versus the possibility of embryo farms for the express purpose of manufacturing stem cells. Note however, that creating human beings for the express purpose of organ transplant is already done in practice (while in moderation). These human farms are referred to as "families".
04-26-2010 06:44 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Fo Shizzle Offline
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
*

Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina

Balance of Power Contest
Post: #9
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
Thanks Pope!04-cheers

Now...Stop your priests from diddling young boys.03-puke
04-26-2010 07:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


DrTorch Offline
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
*

Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:

CrappiesDonatorsBalance of Power Contest
Post: #10
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 06:44 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 03:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 03:01 PM)I45owl Wrote:  So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

"Rustum Roy – Distinguished Prof of Materials at Arizona State University and Professor of the Solid State and of Geochemistry at Pennsylvania State University - who followed up the research, and held a public demonstration in September 2007, which was reported in the National Geographic News"

What more do you need to know? 02-13-banana

I wasted plenty of time before I realized that Roy was associated with Andrew Weil and Deepak Chopra. I assume you were kidding?

(04-26-2010 03:54 PM)ummechengr Wrote:  I respect your request for better sources...
http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/ar..._cell.html
http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/09/news/com.../index.htm
http://newsblaze.com/story/2009031005503...story.html

Hopefully this puts more validity behind the claim.

Thanks. I didn't intend to ridicule you, but the folks behind ISIS are another matter...

It seems to me that to ethically justify using embryonic cells, the criteria would rest on whether they provide a benefit that is not otherwise available under reasonable circumstances.

It's not obvious to me that even that criterion justifies their use.

Quote: Unless you can prove that everything an embryonic cell can do could instead be done with adult stem cells, the question of whether adult cells are themselves valuable is almost a side-question. But, it seems prudent to exhaust research on adult stem cells - at least in specific research topics - before you go down the path of using embryonic cells in that topic of research.

Agreed

Quote: But, I think that option should remain open.

Again, that's a pretty serious ethical question.

Quote:I understand some of the concerns of anti-abortionists with regards to embryos. I don't understand why organ donation for transplant or research is considered morally valiant whilst use of embryos for essentially the same purpose is considered morally reprehensible.

It destroys a unique human entity.

Quote: There is a substantial ethical leap between considering using embryos that already exist versus the possibility of embryo farms for the express purpose of manufacturing stem cells. Note however, that creating human beings for the express purpose of organ transplant is already done in practice (while in moderation). These human farms are referred to as "families".

And members of those families aren't destroyed to harvest the organ. Even at that, "savior siblings" do raise ethical questions.
04-26-2010 07:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #11
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 07:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 06:44 PM)I45owl Wrote:  It seems to me that to ethically justify using embryonic cells, the criteria would rest on whether they provide a benefit that is not otherwise available under reasonable circumstances.

It's not obvious to me that even that criterion justifies their use.

But without it, I would concede there is no justification. That's kind of the first step in a decision tree that would allow you to justify there use in treatment.

In making the decision on ethics, it is also clear to address whether their use can be justified if that is the case. In addressing whether it's acceptable for research using embryonic stem cells, I'd expect the researchers to make the case there there is potential such a benefit.

What you didn't address is that the embryos will be destroyed one way or the other, and they were not created for the purpose of research or treatment. I would argue there is greater net harm to human life (at least to the donor) with organ donation than the correlating hypothetical life-saving treatment provided by embryonic stem cells.
04-26-2010 07:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,643
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #12
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
Good move.
04-26-2010 07:32 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Know Nothing Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 344
Joined: Nov 2009
Reputation: 8
I Root For: Big East
Location: Illinois
Post: #13
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
The Church has always endorsed the use of adult stem cells for medical research, it has only ever been opposed to embryonic stem cell research which involves the destruction of a human life.

Recent scientific breakthroughs have made it so modified adult stem cells can behave in a same manner as embryonic stem cells with needing destroy human life in the process. The Vatican is using all of its political influence and some financing to support this method to avoid the need for using embryonic stem cell.

I think this is a rare case where everyone can be happy. Secularists for the contributions to medical research and Christians for the contributions as well as the saving of human lives.
04-26-2010 07:47 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Paul M Offline
American-American
*

Posts: 21,196
Joined: May 2008
Reputation: 649
I Root For: OU
Location: Next to Boomer
Post: #14
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 07:47 PM)Know Nothing Wrote:  The Church has always endorsed the use of adult stem cells for medical research, it has only ever been opposed to embryonic stem cell research which involves the destruction of a human life.

I wasn't sure but I was thinking the same thing. I didn't recall them being against adult stem cell research.
04-26-2010 10:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
RobertN Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 35,485
Joined: Jan 2003
Reputation: 95
I Root For: THE NIU Huskies
Location: Wayne's World
Post: #15
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 07:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 06:44 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 03:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 03:01 PM)I45owl Wrote:  So, what do you think, Dr. Torch? Can Water Burn?

"Rustum Roy – Distinguished Prof of Materials at Arizona State University and Professor of the Solid State and of Geochemistry at Pennsylvania State University - who followed up the research, and held a public demonstration in September 2007, which was reported in the National Geographic News"

What more do you need to know? 02-13-banana

I wasted plenty of time before I realized that Roy was associated with Andrew Weil and Deepak Chopra. I assume you were kidding?

(04-26-2010 03:54 PM)ummechengr Wrote:  I respect your request for better sources...
http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/ar..._cell.html
http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/09/news/com.../index.htm
http://newsblaze.com/story/2009031005503...story.html

Hopefully this puts more validity behind the claim.

Thanks. I didn't intend to ridicule you, but the folks behind ISIS are another matter...

It seems to me that to ethically justify using embryonic cells, the criteria would rest on whether they provide a benefit that is not otherwise available under reasonable circumstances.

It's not obvious to me that even that criterion justifies their use.

Quote: Unless you can prove that everything an embryonic cell can do could instead be done with adult stem cells, the question of whether adult cells are themselves valuable is almost a side-question. But, it seems prudent to exhaust research on adult stem cells - at least in specific research topics - before you go down the path of using embryonic cells in that topic of research.

Agreed

Quote: But, I think that option should remain open.

Again, that's a pretty serious ethical question.

Quote:I understand some of the concerns of anti-abortionists with regards to embryos. I don't understand why organ donation for transplant or research is considered morally valiant whilst use of embryos for essentially the same purpose is considered morally reprehensible.

It destroys a unique human entity.

Quote: There is a substantial ethical leap between considering using embryos that already exist versus the possibility of embryo farms for the express purpose of manufacturing stem cells. Note however, that creating human beings for the express purpose of organ transplant is already done in practice (while in moderation). These human farms are referred to as "families".

And members of those families aren't destroyed to harvest the organ. Even at that, "savior siblings" do raise ethical questions.
Of course you wouldn't want to use the embryos that are going to get tossed in the trash because you believe in the man in the sky.
04-27-2010 01:45 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DrTorch Offline
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
*

Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:

CrappiesDonatorsBalance of Power Contest
Post: #16
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-26-2010 07:23 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 07:11 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  
(04-26-2010 06:44 PM)I45owl Wrote:  It seems to me that to ethically justify using embryonic cells, the criteria would rest on whether they provide a benefit that is not otherwise available under reasonable circumstances.

It's not obvious to me that even that criterion justifies their use.

But without it, I would concede there is no justification. That's kind of the first step in a decision tree that would allow you to justify there use in treatment.

I get what you're saying, and you make a valid point.

Quote:In making the decision on ethics, it is also clear to address whether their use can be justified if that is the case. In addressing whether it's acceptable for research using embryonic stem cells, I'd expect the researchers to make the case there there is potential such a benefit.

What you didn't address is that the embryos will be destroyed one way or the other, and they were not created for the purpose of research or treatment. I would argue there is greater net harm to human life (at least to the donor) with organ donation than the correlating hypothetical life-saving treatment provided by embryonic stem cells.

I see both sides of the argument. It's not a new one, heck they even had a Star Trek Voyager episode that dealt with the issue. I am concerned that the approach is to justify questionable practices by citing benefit for other people.
04-27-2010 07:14 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #17
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-27-2010 07:14 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  I see both sides of the argument. It's not a new one, heck they even had a Star Trek Voyager episode that dealt with the issue. I am concerned that the approach is to justify questionable practices by citing benefit for other people.

There has been plenty of demagoguery claiming real benefits that embryonic cells provide when they are in fact only hypothetical potential benefits.

The Catholic Church raises the objection that they wish the embryos to be treated with dignity. IMHO, research toward a cure meets that standard far better than "body worlds" does, not to mention freezer burn followed by biohazard disposal. I presume the church hasn't raised a blanket objection on artificial insemination, but it seems to me that if it is objectionable that fertilized embryos are discarded, then it's artificial insemination that should be the target as much as embryonic stem cell research. It's just that it's more difficult emotionally to campaign against parents trying to have kids of their own than it is to campaign against mad scientists.
04-27-2010 11:31 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


DrTorch Offline
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
*

Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:

CrappiesDonatorsBalance of Power Contest
Post: #18
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
(04-27-2010 11:31 AM)I45owl Wrote:  I presume the church hasn't raised a blanket objection on artificial insemination,

That would be wrong. They are against it, and have been quite vocal about that position.

I have quite a few objections to various RC doctrines/teaching, but I'll give them full credit for being consistent on this issue.
(This post was last modified: 04-27-2010 11:56 AM by DrTorch.)
04-27-2010 11:55 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #19
RE: Vatican endorses stem-cell research
Mea culpa. I presumed if they had such an objection, it would've been mentioned in the article (and I didn't think about their historical blanket objections to most forms of birth control). They may be consistent, but they still seem to go after the mad scientists with more vigor than the distraught mom and dad wannabes.
(This post was last modified: 04-27-2010 12:04 PM by I45owl.)
04-27-2010 12:03 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.