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GM repays LOANS
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SumOfAllFears Offline
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Post: #61
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.
04-24-2010 08:44 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #62
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
04-24-2010 08:47 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #63
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.
04-24-2010 09:58 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #64
RE: GM repays LOANS
They lie. I don't (nor does anyone else) buy their lies. I'm the problem. Got it. Or in your language "baaah".
04-24-2010 10:06 PM
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NIU05 Offline
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Post: #65
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Powerline- Lying through Ommision - SEC

Not only lying, but did not repay the loan thru EARNINGS. Repayment was made with funds from another TARP program.

Bunch of frickin liars, and most of the main stream media just goose step right in behind the BS since it helps their candidate.
04-25-2010 02:09 PM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #66
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 09:58 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.


Seriously... how is it anyone's fault but the administration when they "applaud" GM for paying back one loan from the government by taking out another loan from the government. I realize this is factual, but how is it commendable??
04-25-2010 04:25 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #67
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 04:25 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 09:58 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.


Seriously... how is it anyone's fault but the administration when they "applaud" GM for paying back one loan from the government by taking out another loan from the government. I realize this is factual, but how is it commendable??
Are you basing your opinion on the BLOG that was posted on here?
04-25-2010 05:10 PM
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NIU05 Offline
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Post: #68
RE: GM repays LOANS
Answer the question, this is not dodge ball .....
04-25-2010 05:13 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #69
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 05:10 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-25-2010 04:25 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 09:58 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.


Seriously... how is it anyone's fault but the administration when they "applaud" GM for paying back one loan from the government by taking out another loan from the government. I realize this is factual, but how is it commendable??
Are you basing your opinion on the BLOG that was posted on here?

Do you mean the blog that quotes sworn Senate testimony? The one that quotes TARP Special Inspector General Neil Barofsky?

Quit being a putz.
(This post was last modified: 04-25-2010 05:25 PM by Paul M.)
04-25-2010 05:23 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #70
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 05:13 PM)NIU05 Wrote:  Answer the question, this is not dodge ball .....
Well, I can't answer the question because I can't honestly say that is what they did. A blog is not exactly the most accurate source of informetion. Is it possible that is how they did it? Sounds possible. If that is what they did, I don't like it but it was pretty creative. Hopefully the put that creativity into their new products.
04-25-2010 05:43 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #71
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 05:23 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-25-2010 05:10 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-25-2010 04:25 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 09:58 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.


Seriously... how is it anyone's fault but the administration when they "applaud" GM for paying back one loan from the government by taking out another loan from the government. I realize this is factual, but how is it commendable??
Are you basing your opinion on the BLOG that was posted on here?

Do you mean the blog that quotes sworn Senate testimony? The one that quotes TARP Special Inspector General Neil Barofsky?

Quit being a putz.
Quotes taken out of context by someone with an agenda don't prove anything.
04-25-2010 05:45 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #72
RE: GM repays LOANS
Keep arguing against the facts if you must, putz.


Did General Motors Really Repay Its Taxpayer Bailout?
By Sen. Charles "Chuck" Grassley

General Motors announced this week that it repaid its multibillion-dollar taxpayer-backed TARP loans. GM even bragged that it was able to “repay the taxpayers in full, with interest, ahead of schedule, because more customers are buying [GM] vehicles.” There was great fanfare, including expensive, around-the-clock GM TV commercials nationwide. But, the hype is not the reality. In fact, GM did not repay the loans with money it earned from selling cars. Instead, GM repaid the TARP loans with money it withdrew from another TARP fund at the Treasury Department.

The day before the GM story broke, Neil Barofsky, the government TARP watchdog, testified before the Senate Finance Committee. He explained that GM did not use earnings to repay its TARP debt. The April quarterly report to Congress from his office stated: “The source of funds for these quarterly [debt] payments will be other TARP funds currently held in an escrow account.”

GM filings with the SEC reveal that GM was paying 7 percent interest on a $6.7 billion TARP debt. The filings also confirm that the source of funds for GM’s debt repayments was a multibillion-dollar TARP-funded escrow account at Treasury; that means it was taxpayer money — not earnings.

Meanwhile, in all the fanfare and patting themselves on the back, Treasury and GM made no mention of what happened to the $2.5 billion loan GM owes its union health care plan. The union loan carries a 9 percent interest rate and runs until 2017. Don’t most Americans try to pay off their higher-interest debts first? Well, the union loan was not paid off. Why not? Does the union get to keep collecting 9 percent from GM until 2017, courtesy of the American taxpayer, while taxpayers give up a 7 percent return over the next five years in exchange for the hope that GM stock will be worth more than what we paid for it, someday down the road?

It is far from clear how GM and the Obama administration could honestly say, much less trumpet in prime-time television ads, that GM repaid its TARP loans in any meaningful way. The reality is that GM got additional TARP billions from a Treasury escrow account filled with taxpayer dollars. Taxpayers have not been paid back “in full” and are still on the hook for the TARP stock investment in GM. Whether taxpayer funds are ultimately recovered depends upon the administration’s ability to sell GM stock at a profit some day. Of course, we all hope it works out that way, and it might. But, the American people deserve more than puffed-up press releases and misleading commercials claiming that GM paid its loans back to the government with money it earned. I recognize that one of the goals of the GM ad campaign is to build trust, but GM did it all wrong, apparently with some help from the administration. Shifting bailout money from GM debt to GM stock is not the same as repaying it. Stock is riskier than debt. Maybe it’s a good idea. Maybe it’s a step in the right direction, maybe not. Only time will tell. But, we should be clear with the American people about what happened here.

The Wall Street Journal reports that Treasury is beginning to admit the truth. Treasury claims the source of the funds was “clearly disclosed” all along. Well, that might be technically true. However, to understand the disclosure you have to be a sophisticated investor with time to pore over the fine print buried in massive SEC filings and government reports prepared by independent watchdogs with teams of auditors. The average citizen, on the other hand, just sees the GM CEO saying that GM has paid back the taxpayer “in full.” The truth is that GM originally received over $49 billion from the US government and many billions remain to be recouped. That is why we were told at the Senate Finance Committee hearing that TARP losses related to the auto companies are expected to exceed $30 billion.

The timing of this maneuver also is troubling. The administration’s so-called Financial Crisis Responsibility Fee, a TARP excise tax intended to recover TARP losses, was the subject of the Finance Committee hearing. The Office of Management and Budget, and the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office, estimate that overall taxpayer TARP losses will exceed $100 billion, and the auto companies will account for over 30 percent of that amount, more than $30 billion. So why does the president exclude the auto companies from his TARP excise tax proposal? I raised this issue at the hearing. I noted that GM refused to testify. The next day we learned that GM, with the permission of Treasury, withdrew billions from the TARP escrow fund and accelerated the repayment of the entire GM TARP loan. Immediately, GM and the administration launched a public relations campaign touting “repayment.”

Regardless of the motive, this situation is a perfect example of the shenanigans caused by excessive government intervention in the economy. Being honest with the American people is not optional. The sooner these extraordinary entanglements between taxpayer and the private sector are over, the better.

U.S. Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa is the ranking member of the Senate Finance Committee and a senior member of the Judiciary and Budget Committees.
04-25-2010 06:23 PM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #73
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 05:10 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-25-2010 04:25 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 09:58 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:47 PM)Paul M Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:44 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  
(04-24-2010 08:40 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Just saw the commercial. How the hell could Whitacre get on tv with a straight face and tell such a blatant lie? The company you keep, I guess.

Obama told the same lie.

Tru dat.

What's wrong with these people?
There is nothing wrong with "these people". The problem is you.


Seriously... how is it anyone's fault but the administration when they "applaud" GM for paying back one loan from the government by taking out another loan from the government. I realize this is factual, but how is it commendable??
Are you basing your opinion on the BLOG that was posted on here?
if you're considering what I said, my opinion.... then no. I'm baing on a simple review of he corporate balance sheet as given in the 10-k... but
i suppose that is only gm's "opinion" of their financial status

(04-25-2010 05:43 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(04-25-2010 05:13 PM)NIU05 Wrote:  Answer the question, this is not dodge ball .....
Well, I can't answer the question because I can't honestly say that is what they did. A blog is not exactly the most accurate source of informetion. Is it possible that is how they did it? Sounds possible. If that is what they did, I don't like it but it was pretty creative. Hopefully the put that creativity into their new products.
you could have saved yourself embarassment by simply apologizing.

it's a lie... a spin. All those things you accuse the right of constantly doing... and here you are applauding one. It's not creative at all. They merely transferred the balance of their credit card to another card... and your beloved should have known this. They made him look like a moron to anyone with 3 hours of undergraduate accounting
04-25-2010 07:24 PM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #74
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-24-2010 10:37 AM)RobertN Wrote:  I understand that quality drops when car companies start building cars in the south.

Why do you hate black people so much?
04-25-2010 08:08 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #75
RE: GM repays LOANS
Robert's not into facts.
04-25-2010 08:10 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #76
RE: GM repays LOANS
Jeez, the ad is still running. Now that everyone ('cept Robert) knows it's a lie, you'd think shame or embarrassment, decency, something would make them stop.
04-25-2010 10:20 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #77
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 06:23 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Keep arguing against the facts if you must, putz.


Did General Motors Really Repay Its Taxpayer Bailout?
By Sen. Charles "Chuck" Grassley

General Motors announced this week that it repaid its multibillion-dollar taxpayer-backed TARP loans. GM even bragged that it was able to “repay the taxpayers in full, with interest, ahead of schedule, because more customers are buying [GM] vehicles.” There was great fanfare, including expensive, around-the-clock GM TV commercials nationwide. But, the hype is not the reality. In fact, GM did not repay the loans with money it earned from selling cars. Instead, GM repaid the TARP loans with money it withdrew from another TARP fund at the Treasury Department.

The day before the GM story broke, Neil Barofsky, the government TARP watchdog, testified before the Senate Finance Committee. He explained that GM did not use earnings to repay its TARP debt. The April quarterly report to Congress from his office stated: “The source of funds for these quarterly [debt] payments will be other TARP funds currently held in an escrow account.”

GM filings with the SEC reveal that GM was paying 7 percent interest on a $6.7 billion TARP debt. The filings also confirm that the source of funds for GM’s debt repayments was a multibillion-dollar TARP-funded escrow account at Treasury; that means it was taxpayer money — not earnings.

Meanwhile, in all the fanfare and patting themselves on the back, Treasury and GM made no mention of what happened to the $2.5 billion loan GM owes its union health care plan. The union loan carries a 9 percent interest rate and runs until 2017. Don’t most Americans try to pay off their higher-interest debts first? Well, the union loan was not paid off. Why not? Does the union get to keep collecting 9 percent from GM until 2017, courtesy of the American taxpayer, while taxpayers give up a 7 percent return over the next five years in exchange for the hope that GM stock will be worth more than what we paid for it, someday down the road?

It is far from clear how GM and the Obama administration could honestly say, much less trumpet in prime-time television ads, that GM repaid its TARP loans in any meaningful way. The reality is that GM got additional TARP billions from a Treasury escrow account filled with taxpayer dollars. Taxpayers have not been paid back “in full” and are still on the hook for the TARP stock investment in GM. Whether taxpayer funds are ultimately recovered depends upon the administration’s ability to sell GM stock at a profit some day. Of course, we all hope it works out that way, and it might. But, the American people deserve more than puffed-up press releases and misleading commercials claiming that GM paid its loans back to the government with money it earned. I recognize that one of the goals of the GM ad campaign is to build trust, but GM did it all wrong, apparently with some help from the administration. Shifting bailout money from GM debt to GM stock is not the same as repaying it. Stock is riskier than debt. Maybe it’s a good idea. Maybe it’s a step in the right direction, maybe not. Only time will tell. But, we should be clear with the American people about what happened here.

The Wall Street Journal reports that Treasury is beginning to admit the truth. Treasury claims the source of the funds was “clearly disclosed” all along. Well, that might be technically true. However, to understand the disclosure you have to be a sophisticated investor with time to pore over the fine print buried in massive SEC filings and government reports prepared by independent watchdogs with teams of auditors. The average citizen, on the other hand, just sees the GM CEO saying that GM has paid back the taxpayer “in full.” The truth is that GM originally received over $49 billion from the US government and many billions remain to be recouped. That is why we were told at the Senate Finance Committee hearing that TARP losses related to the auto companies are expected to exceed $30 billion.

The timing of this maneuver also is troubling. The administration’s so-called Financial Crisis Responsibility Fee, a TARP excise tax intended to recover TARP losses, was the subject of the Finance Committee hearing. The Office of Management and Budget, and the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office, estimate that overall taxpayer TARP losses will exceed $100 billion, and the auto companies will account for over 30 percent of that amount, more than $30 billion. So why does the president exclude the auto companies from his TARP excise tax proposal? I raised this issue at the hearing. I noted that GM refused to testify. The next day we learned that GM, with the permission of Treasury, withdrew billions from the TARP escrow fund and accelerated the repayment of the entire GM TARP loan. Immediately, GM and the administration launched a public relations campaign touting “repayment.”

Regardless of the motive, this situation is a perfect example of the shenanigans caused by excessive government intervention in the economy. Being honest with the American people is not optional. The sooner these extraordinary entanglements between taxpayer and the private sector are over, the better.

U.S. Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa is the ranking member of the Senate Finance Committee and a senior member of the Judiciary and Budget Committees.
Who knows. Looks like it could possibly be just about politics.
04-25-2010 11:19 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #78
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 10:20 PM)Paul M Wrote:  Jeez, the ad is still running. Now that everyone ('cept Robert) knows it's a lie, you'd think shame or embarrassment, decency, something would make them stop.
Maybe it is up because the **** Cornley..er, Grassley is throwing out is just that? ****.
04-25-2010 11:22 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #79
RE: GM repays LOANS
You must get awful lonely in that little world you've created for yourself.
04-25-2010 11:30 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #80
RE: GM repays LOANS
(04-25-2010 11:30 PM)Paul M Wrote:  You must get awful lonely in that little world you've created for yourself.
It is better than living in the world of ignorant racist rednecks.
04-25-2010 11:40 PM
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