Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
Author Message
WoodlandsOwl Offline
Up in the Woods
*

Posts: 11,813
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 115
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location:

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #1
Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
Sounds like this will go down if the IDF heads East, which means a very stern warning will soon be delivered very soon to Mr. Assad as to what will have to him individually if he participates in this BS. Its next to impossible to reason with Terrorists and the States that support them. They only understand one thing...

Hezbollah Gets SCUDS

October 19, 2009: Arab media in the Persian Gulf have been reporting that Syria, apparently on the orders of Iran, has turned over about 300 long range ballistic missiles to Hezbollah control.

The missiles have apparently not left Syria (they would be hard to miss, being driven around southern Lebanon). The reports add that Hezbollah personnel are being trained to operate the missiles.

Syria has underground storage and launch facilities for its arsenal of over a thousand SCUD missiles. Armed with half ton high explosive and cluster bomb warheads, the missiles have ranges of 500-700 kilometers. Syria also has some 90 older Russian Frog-7 missiles (70 kilometer range, half ton warhead) and 210 more modern Russian SS-21 missiles (120 kilometer range, half ton warhead) operating with mobile launchers. There are also 60 mobile SCUD launchers.

The Syrians have a large network of camouflaged launching sites for the mobile launchers. Iran and North Korea have helped Syria build underground SCUD manufacturing and maintenance facilities.

The Syrian missiles are meant to hit Israeli airfields, missile launching sites and nuclear weapons sites, as well as population centers. Syria hopes to do enough damage with a missile strike to cripple Israeli combat capability. Hezbollah is more interested in killing civilians, and would aim their missiles at Israeli cities.

Israel has long been aware of the Syrian missile capabilities and any war with Syria would probably result in some interesting attacks on the Syrian missile network.

The SCUD is a liquid fuel missile and takes half an hour or more to fuel and ready for launch. So underground facilities are a major defensive measure against an alert and astute opponent like Israel.

In the past, Israel has threatened to use nukes against anyone who fired chemical weapons at Israel (which does not have any chemical weapons).

Over the last year or so, the Israeli government has been passing around, to local governments, a war planning document. This study assumes a future war with Syria, and gives the local officials an idea of what to expect.

Currently, the Israelis estimate that there would be as many as 3,300 Israeli casualties (including up to 200 dead) is Syria tried to use its long range missiles against Israel.

If the Syrians used chemical warheads, Israeli casualties could be as high as 16,000. Over 200,000 Israelis would be left homeless, and it's believed about a 100,000 would seek to leave the country. Hezbollah apparently wants to be part of this, or maybe Iran just ordered the whole thing.

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htart/a...91019.aspx
10-19-2009 05:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Lord Stanley Offline
L'Étoile du Nord
*

Posts: 19,103
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 994
I Root For: NIU
Location: Cold. So cold......
Post: #2
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
A Scud with a cluster warhead? Who needs to be accurate with a 150 bomblets dispersed from 500 ft?
10-19-2009 07:28 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
smn1256 Offline
I miss Tripster
*

Posts: 28,878
Joined: Apr 2008
Reputation: 337
I Root For: Lower taxes
Location: North Mexico
Post: #3
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
On orders from Iran???
10-19-2009 08:41 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
RobertN Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 35,485
Joined: Jan 2003
Reputation: 95
I Root For: THE NIU Huskies
Location: Wayne's World
Post: #4
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-19-2009 05:02 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  Sounds like this will go down if the IDF heads East, which means a very stern warning will soon be delivered very soon to Mr. Assad as to what will have to him individually if he participates in this BS. Its next to impossible to reason with Terrorists and the States that support them. They only understand one thing...

Hezbollah Gets SCUDS

October 19, 2009: Arab media in the Persian Gulf have been reporting that Syria, apparently on the orders of Iran, has turned over about 300 long range ballistic missiles to Hezbollah control.

The missiles have apparently not left Syria (they would be hard to miss, being driven around southern Lebanon). The reports add that Hezbollah personnel are being trained to operate the missiles.

Syria has underground storage and launch facilities for its arsenal of over a thousand SCUD missiles. Armed with half ton high explosive and cluster bomb warheads, the missiles have ranges of 500-700 kilometers. Syria also has some 90 older Russian Frog-7 missiles (70 kilometer range, half ton warhead) and 210 more modern Russian SS-21 missiles (120 kilometer range, half ton warhead) operating with mobile launchers. There are also 60 mobile SCUD launchers.

The Syrians have a large network of camouflaged launching sites for the mobile launchers. Iran and North Korea have helped Syria build underground SCUD manufacturing and maintenance facilities.

The Syrian missiles are meant to hit Israeli airfields, missile launching sites and nuclear weapons sites, as well as population centers. Syria hopes to do enough damage with a missile strike to cripple Israeli combat capability. Hezbollah is more interested in killing civilians, and would aim their missiles at Israeli cities.

Israel has long been aware of the Syrian missile capabilities and any war with Syria would probably result in some interesting attacks on the Syrian missile network.

The SCUD is a liquid fuel missile and takes half an hour or more to fuel and ready for launch. So underground facilities are a major defensive measure against an alert and astute opponent like Israel.

In the past, Israel has threatened to use nukes against anyone who fired chemical weapons at Israel (which does not have any chemical weapons).

Over the last year or so, the Israeli government has been passing around, to local governments, a war planning document. This study assumes a future war with Syria, and gives the local officials an idea of what to expect.

Currently, the Israelis estimate that there would be as many as 3,300 Israeli casualties (including up to 200 dead) is Syria tried to use its long range missiles against Israel.

If the Syrians used chemical warheads, Israeli casualties could be as high as 16,000. Over 200,000 Israelis would be left homeless, and it's believed about a 100,000 would seek to leave the country. Hezbollah apparently wants to be part of this, or maybe Iran just ordered the whole thing.

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htart/a...91019.aspx
So where did they get this info? Maybe that Israeli spy that was just caught?
10-20-2009 02:36 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Machiavelli Offline
Back to Reality. Oh there goes Gravity

Posts: 25,357
Joined: Apr 2006
I Root For: BGSU
Location:
Post: #5
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
I watched Shindler's list last night on HBO. Imagine the pyschological damage that was done to these people? Knowing a whole continent basically went along with eradicating them like a disease. You would think rational people could understand why the Isreali's act like they do and on the flip side of that you would think Isreal would use a velvet glove in negotiations instead of an iron fist. Such a screwed up world.
10-20-2009 08:36 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Rebel
Unregistered

 
CrappiesNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #6
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 08:36 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  you would think Isreal would use a velvet glove in negotiations instead of an iron fist. Such a screwed up world.

How'd that work out for them before?
10-20-2009 08:51 AM
Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,655
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #7
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 08:36 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I watched Shindler's list last night on HBO. Imagine the pyschological damage that was done to these people? Knowing a whole continent basically went along with eradicating them like a disease. You would think rational people could understand why the Isreali's act like they do and on the flip side of that you would think Isreal would use a velvet glove in negotiations instead of an iron fist. Such a screwed up world.

You're applying western thought processes. Arabs don't think like westerners. Rational to a westerner and rational to an easterner are two different things.

Israel does most of what they do out of self-preservation. That is one instinct that transcends the east/west dichotomy.
10-20-2009 09:46 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #8
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 09:46 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Israel does most of what they do out of self-preservation. That is one instinct that transcends the east/west dichotomy.

Not entirely. Suicide bombers don't do what they do out of a desire for self-preservation. Sheiks Yassin and Nasrallah et al have stated on multiple occasions that what separates Muslims from Westerners is that Westerners love life while they love death. That doesn't sound like self-preservation has much value to them. That said, I understand that Islamists don't speak for all Muslims, but they have done a pretty good job of dictating the agenda of the entire region.
10-20-2009 11:04 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,655
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #9
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 11:04 AM)I45owl Wrote:  
(10-20-2009 09:46 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Israel does most of what they do out of self-preservation. That is one instinct that transcends the east/west dichotomy.
Not entirely. Suicide bombers don't do what they do out of a desire for self-preservation. Sheiks Yassin and Nasrallah et al have stated on multiple occasions that what separates Muslims from Westerners is that Westerners love life while they love death. That doesn't sound like self-preservation has much value to them. That said, I understand that Islamists don't speak for all Muslims, but they have done a pretty good job of dictating the agenda of the entire region.

Actually it is self-preservation in a way. But that's coming out of the eastern thought process, not the western. And that's the difference between the two.

This is something that took me a while to understand, and I'm not sure it is understandable unless you've been there to see what things are really like. Basically, in the east, there isn't enough food to go around. So some people have to die so the rest can have enough food to live. So you glorify death. In that context, glorifying death is really a sort of self-preservation instinct--self-preservation of the society as a whole, instead of individual people.

In the west, we've never had to face the issue of mass starvation if we didn't kill a few people off. It makes us think differently from them.
(This post was last modified: 10-20-2009 11:26 AM by Owl 69/70/75.)
10-20-2009 11:20 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Lord Stanley Offline
L'Étoile du Nord
*

Posts: 19,103
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 994
I Root For: NIU
Location: Cold. So cold......
Post: #10
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
I think you can argue that self-preservation is an instict in Islamist thought, since death is the path to martyrdom / salvation, which is the real goal. "Self-preserve the soul" maybe?
10-20-2009 12:20 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,655
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #11
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 12:20 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  I think you can argue that self-preservation is an instict in Islamist thought, since death is the path to martyrdom / salvation, which is the real goal. "Self-preserve the soul" maybe?

Yes, but I'm convinced that's the product, not the source. I really started to understand things a little better once I put it in the "some die so all can live" context. And making the religion tout that is a great way to ingrain it into society.
10-20-2009 12:48 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #12
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 12:48 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(10-20-2009 12:20 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  I think you can argue that self-preservation is an instict in Islamist thought, since death is the path to martyrdom / salvation, which is the real goal. "Self-preserve the soul" maybe?

Yes, but I'm convinced that's the product, not the source. I really started to understand things a little better once I put it in the "some die so all can live" context. And making the religion tout that is a great way to ingrain it into society.

There is a collectivist strain there. But, Islamist thought is not so utilitarian - it is death in service to god, not death for the greater good. I'm not sure what you mean by source/product.
10-20-2009 03:06 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,655
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #13
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 03:06 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(10-20-2009 12:48 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(10-20-2009 12:20 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  I think you can argue that self-preservation is an instict in Islamist thought, since death is the path to martyrdom / salvation, which is the real goal. "Self-preserve the soul" maybe?

Yes, but I'm convinced that's the product, not the source. I really started to understand things a little better once I put it in the "some die so all can live" context. And making the religion tout that is a great way to ingrain it into society.

There is a collectivist strain there. But, Islamist thought is not so utilitarian - it is death in service to god, not death for the greater good. I'm not sure what you mean by source/product.

I think the source of "death in service to god" was originally "death for the greater good." They just had to figure out a way to package it.

So, out of a need to encourage death for the greater good, they figured out that the way to sell it to the people was death in service to god. Does that clarify?
10-20-2009 03:39 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #14
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 03:39 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I think the source of "death in service to god" was originally "death for the greater good." They just had to figure out a way to package it.

So, out of a need to encourage death for the greater good, they figured out that the way to sell it to the people was death in service to god. Does that clarify?

If by "they", you mean Muhammed, and by "figured it out" you mean ensconced in dogmatic form in the Kuran, then I can see your point. But, as a recent phenomenon, I do not see that jihad in the larger sense (much less suicide bombing) does not really serve the greater good - either in intent or effect. You could argue that Colonialism came and went and left Muslim societies more or less intact because of the cultural/religious resistance to foreign control, but regarding Israel, it's not accomplishing much for Arab societies. So, yeah, I think it clarifies things well enough.
10-20-2009 04:35 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Offline
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 80,655
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 3192
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #15
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
(10-20-2009 04:35 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(10-20-2009 03:39 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I think the source of "death in service to god" was originally "death for the greater good." They just had to figure out a way to package it.

So, out of a need to encourage death for the greater good, they figured out that the way to sell it to the people was death in service to god. Does that clarify?

If by "they", you mean Muhammed, and by "figured it out" you mean ensconced in dogmatic form in the Kuran, then I can see your point. But, as a recent phenomenon, I do not see that jihad in the larger sense (much less suicide bombing) does not really serve the greater good - either in intent or effect. You could argue that Colonialism came and went and left Muslim societies more or less intact because of the cultural/religious resistance to foreign control, but regarding Israel, it's not accomplishing much for Arab societies. So, yeah, I think it clarifies things well enough.

Yes, I'm talking about a historic "them" and "figured it out." Agree that it's not all that productive an approach today, but that's just one of many places where modern reality and historic Islam clash.
10-20-2009 05:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
I45owl Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #16
RE: Here comes your preemptory air strike by Israel.
Yea. I can say I completely agree with you then... I don't think Arab/Muslim society is unique in the collective resistance to invasion, but they have institutionalized it like no other society this side of "Dune".
10-20-2009 05:41 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.