http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/wo...644883.ece


July 6, 2009

Barack Obama makes basic error over balance of power in Kremlin

President Obama has made his first mistake in Russia even before he arrives in Moscow today. His attempt to cast Vladimir Putin as yesterday’s man and to drive a wedge between the Prime Minister and President Medvedev demonstrates a misreading of relations in the Kremlin.

Mr Medvedev is in office but not in power and whether he becomes President in more than name depends on Mr Putin’s support and intentions. Mr Medvedev may represent a more accommodating face of Russia but this is only because Mr Putin wants him to.

Mr Obama declared: “I think that it’s important that even as we move forward with President Medvedev that Putin understand that the old Cold War approaches to US-Russian relations is outdated . . . Putin has one foot in the old ways of doing business and one foot in the new.” That suggests that Mr Medvedev’s outlook differs from that of his mentor despite a lack of evidence. Mr Putin is not known as a bad judge of character and he himself described his successor as “no less a Russian nationalist than I am”.

Mr Putin’s dominance was evident at the start of last year’s war in Georgia, when he directed operations in South Ossetia. Foreign relations are also the responsibility of the President. But Mr Putin has been an active globetrotter and does not hesitate to involve himself in policy in a way that would have been unthinkable for any of his prime ministers.


He told Japanese leaders during a recent visit that Tokyo would have to meet Moscow’s terms for a formal peace treaty ending the Second World War, adding that Mr Medvedev would raise the issue at next week’s G8 summit in Italy. Nobody would have dared dictate his presidential agenda for him. One Western diplomat told The Times that Mr Putin continued to hold 90 per cent of power. Mr Obama’s decision to meet him is an admission that he holds sway and everyone from President Hu Jintao of China to European Union leaders make the same journey.

Mr Medvedev’s utterances about enforcing the rule of law remain just that — and are tainted by the blatantly rigged manner of his election. Mr Obama will ignore that detail in talking up their “very good relationship”. But if Mr Putin decides to return to the presidency in 2012 — and it is his decision — then Mr Obama will be dealing directly by the end of his first term with a man he has dismissed.

He may have played into Mr Putin’s hands. Despite the old pals’ act with George W. Bush, the Kremlin became increasingly anti-American over Nato expansion, missile defence in Eastern Europe, and Washington’s support for pro-Western leaders in Georgia and Ukraine.

Mr Obama’s pledge to press the reset button in relations was seen by Moscow as confirmation that Russia was right all along. Russia did not offer to change its attitudes.

Unless the US is preparing to abandon those policies, Mr Putin will feel justified in declaring that there is no sign of the new era. This would be a gift for the Kremlin as it struggles to decide how to deal with the phenomenon of a globally popular US president after Mr Bush.

It would allow Mr Putin to pursue Moscow’s strategic goal of dividing Europe from the US by casting America as unreasonable over Russian security concerns, and then using energy politics to keep Europe divided against itself.

Mr Obama is coming to the table like a card sharp to a casino, ready to charm his hosts and pull aces from his sleeve to win support for crucial objectives in Afghanistan and Iran. But Russia is a land of chess players, cautious and calculating. Mr Putin does not respond to charm — and he has just closed Russia’s casinos.

What a putz.

Maybe he can give Putin an Ipod with some of his speeches on them.

Putin will own Obama. Thank God the cold war is over.

Obama will have to cancel the US missile defense bases in Eastern Europe if he wants the Russians to renew the START Treaty on strategic
weapons.

He will have to abandon Georgia and the Ukraine to Russia if he wants Russian "help" on the Iranian nuclear issue.

Be prepared for Obamagog to give up the farm. :muttering:

I bet Obama will just gaze into his eyes and see the man's soul. That's a great way to start off a relationship I hear.

Obama and Putin, huh, Guess we are just gonna have to wait and see who is pitching and who is catching.

(07-05-2009 07:26 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I bet Obama will just gaze into his eyes and see the man's soul. That's a great way to start off a relationship I hear.

I wonder which one will make the first move for a French Kiss then ???

Man Mach, you would have made one hell of a Hippy there Dawg !!!!

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you guy's don't remember W sayin that?????

Well, if you can point it out, you would already have done it.

(07-05-2009 11:46 PM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  Well, if you can point it out, you would already have done it.

?

"I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straight forward and trustworthy and we had a very good dialogue. I was able to get a sense of his soul."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1392791.stm

The Cold War is over neocons, get over it. You can masturbate to pictures of Reagan if it makes you feel better.

In the end, there will need to be a peace between the both countries. I still don't get why you aren't mad at China instead? They still have communism and Bush bowed down to them at the Olympics. Your hate is misdirected.

Your misdirected. The topic is Obama.

(07-06-2009 01:29 AM)RockyMtnRamfan Wrote:  The Cold War is over neocons, get over it. You can masturbate to pictures of Reagan if it makes you feel better.

In the end, there will need to be a peace between the both countries. I still don't get why you aren't mad at China instead? They still have communism and Bush bowed down to them at the Olympics. Your hate is misdirected.

Wow, and here I thought Robert was the only loon on here that could miss the point entirely so thoroughly.

W may have made a quote early on about Putin being a good guy, wrongly as it turns out....but he never bent over and grabbed the ankles on Missle Defense like Obama is doing.

(07-06-2009 01:29 AM)RockyMtnRamfan Wrote:  The Cold War is over neocons, get over it. You can masturbate to pictures of Reagan if it makes you feel better.

In the end, there will need to be a peace between the both countries. I still don't get why you aren't mad at China instead? They still have communism and Bush bowed down to them at the Olympics. Your hate is misdirected.

AND BOY - - that frekkin wall is DOWN between East and West Germany BECAUSE of Ronald Reagan you popcorn fart ....

The 'Old Soviet Union' has been dissolved for "2 Decades" because of Ronald Reagan - - but since you are just a Teenager, you were not here to see it happen in Real Time so you think you Know Something.

I 'despise' China, North Korea, along with Russia and most all of the Old Soviet Union (since they are all almost totally fck'd up from being under Soviet Rule all those Decades.

I F'CKING HATE VIETNAM, Laos, and Cambodia with a passion that only Mel Gibson could put into his movie.

I despise Chavez, Castro's Cuber (a little Ted Lingo there), Ortega, or Most of the South and Central American Leaders since they almost unanimously all want to go Marxist Communist.

I hate Iran and Yeman - - Saudi Arabia is an Enigma (at least for the time) - I don't care a lot for fake ass Pakistan and Turkey is hanging by a Chad, and since mentioning Chad, I don't like 99% of the African Nations (OH GOD, he is a Racist) with their Wanton Murderous Rages.

A White Man and a Black Man get into a Regular Old Fight on the streets of the United States and it matters not who started it or why, the White Guy automatically becomes a Racist and a Hate Crimes perpetrator - - but in Africa (you know, the Home of "African-Americans") they are Raping, Murdering, and Razing entire Tribes of peoples homes and villages - - it is in Africa and is Black on Black, so who in the United States gives a Sh't HUH ???

Unless it is for a Sound Bite Moment like for Jesse and Al and ALL those fake ass Busta's to whine about and get some Air Time.

Hey son, most of these Countries hate our guts, so why not give a little of the same love back to them ???

They can ALL GO TO HELL and burn bright with their Bullsh't Glowing like Eternal Embers in a Lovers Fire.

It makes no difference what I think until the Revolution Starts, then the Real Disenfranchised of this Nation will be heard around the World.

Let the Rockets Red Glare and the Bombs Burst in Air and it Proof thru the Night that the CHAD's are Still There .... ( )

And as for GW saying that, I don't recall it, but it sounds just as Gay in his voice as it does in Obamagog's ... 'Butt' Putin is in for a shock when the KY comes out and the Fist Roll Up ...

And I liked Ronald Reagan's "Evil Empire" quote much better ... it hits the Truth on the Head and is STILL TRUE TODAY.

Grow up FeverTick or at least get your facts straight since you were NOT THERE to witness History as it was being made.

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(07-06-2009 01:29 AM)RockyMtnRamfan Wrote:  In the end, there will need to be a peace between the both countries. I still don't get why you aren't mad at China instead? They still have communism and Bush bowed down to them at the Olympics. Your hate is misdirected.

If Nixon and Bush didn't soften up China Obama never could have sold our country to them.

Obama calls Putin "President"

Imagine if Bush had done this. What would the media reaction have been?

(07-05-2009 07:26 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I bet Obama will just gaze into his eyes and see the man's soul. That's a great way to start off a relationship I hear.

Funny stuff Mach.

(07-05-2009 10:03 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  you guy's don't remember W sayin that?????

I remember W getting out of the START treaty as one of his big early successes, and to get there he completely out-maneuvered the Dems on that.

But that wasn't covered so much in the MSM.

(07-06-2009 01:29 AM)RockyMtnRamfan Wrote:  The Cold War is over neocons, get over it. You can masturbate to pictures of Reagan if it makes you feel better.

In the end, there will need to be a peace between the both countries. I still don't get why you aren't mad at China instead? They still have communism and Bush bowed down to them at the Olympics. Your hate is misdirected.

What are you talking about? You're a poli sci major? Wow, they grow them ignorant these days.