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College clout and U of I
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RobertN Offline
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College clout and U of I
05-29-2009 02:46 AM
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HuskiemobileMan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
Keep up the good work DUofI!
05-29-2009 07:44 AM
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Dog Fan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
The number of students involved comprise less than .5% of total admissions. This is not unique to the U of I by far. It goes on everywhere in different forms. For colleges funded by state tax dollars in the hands of legislators, you comply with their wishes (within reason) or you see your funding drop. Same with the trustees (who are appointed by the governor). I'm sure it goes on to a lesser extent at NIU. The legislators have the state schools by the nuts - just as they do with any institution that receives state funding. If the U of I tells the clouters to stick it, guess what happens to their funding?

At private schools, "clout" is based a little less on political influence and more on donations to the university. I do not give one penny to Northwestern. If my son were to exceed minimum quals for acceptance into NU and the barely-qualified (or not qualified) kid of someone else who donated thousands to the university were both up for admission, guess who would first be admitted?

I have seen this stuff happening for years. It is totally not right, but it's the way the "system" works. Nothing new or earth-shattering here. Must be a slow news day for the Tribune. Time for the Trib to wake up and smell the coffee. 07-coffee3
05-29-2009 07:47 AM
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Lord Stanley Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
Patronge is important to colleges - how else can they get Miffy's rich alumni dad donate?

Also, there are special admissions process for Athletes, special admission process for Minorities, special admissions process for really good Tuba players etc..... you just have to make sure you are a person the U wants, not just another good all around tuba playing minority student athlete....
05-29-2009 08:28 AM
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Dog Fan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 08:28 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Patronge is important to colleges - how else can they get Miffy's rich alumni dad donate?

Also, there are special admissions process for Athletes, special admission process for Minorities, special admissions process for really good Tuba players etc..... you just have to make sure you are a person the U wants, not just another good all around tuba playing minority student athlete....

Correct. Plus, when a university trustee tells you that he wants someone admitted, do you tell him (the university president's boss) no? If you value your job, you will do as the trustee says.
05-29-2009 08:35 AM
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RobertN Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 07:47 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  The number of students involved comprise less than .5% of total admissions. This is not unique to the U of I by far. It goes on everywhere in different forms. For colleges funded by state tax dollars in the hands of legislators, you comply with their wishes (within reason) or you see your funding drop. Same with the trustees (who are appointed by the governor). I'm sure it goes on to a lesser extent at NIU. The legislators have the state schools by the nuts - just as they do with any institution that receives state funding. If the U of I tells the clouters to stick it, guess what happens to their funding?

At private schools, "clout" is based a little less on political influence and more on donations to the university. I do not give one penny to Northwestern. If my son were to exceed minimum quals for acceptance into NU and the barely-qualified (or not qualified) kid of someone else who donated thousands to the university were both up for admission, guess who would first be admitted?

I have seen this stuff happening for years. It is totally not right, but it's the way the "system" works. Nothing new or earth-shattering here. Must be a slow news day for the Tribune. Time for the Trib to wake up and smell the coffee. 07-coffee3
I know it is generally known that it happens. I just didn't expect the Tribune to do a story on it. I also think back to all those his board who say that U of I fairly gets the money it gets from the state and wonder if they still believe that by giving favors to lawmakers that they don't get that lawmakers pocketbook(which doesn't go to any of the other state schools).
05-29-2009 12:00 PM
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GeorgeBorkFan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 12:00 PM)RobertN Wrote:  I know it is generally known that it happens. I just didn't expect the Tribune to do a story on it. I also think back to all those his board who say that U of I fairly gets the money it gets from the state and wonder if they still believe that by giving favors to lawmakers that they don't get that lawmakers pocketbook(which doesn't go to any of the other state schools).

I agree with Robert regarding why/how U of I gets so much favor with funding.

I do think this is a moderately big deal. Isn't this type of attitude (who sent you, political connections, etc.) the exact mentality that has created the mess of Crook County, including the city, and the overall mess of our state? While I don't believe U of I is administratively corrupt, as is most of our state, I think it is wrong of us to be so accepting of these favors. It also illustrates how far the tentacles of political slime like the Rezkos of the world, really reach.

A little sunlight is always a good thing.
05-29-2009 12:19 PM
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Dog Fan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 12:00 PM)RobertN Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 07:47 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  The number of students involved comprise less than .5% of total admissions. This is not unique to the U of I by far. It goes on everywhere in different forms. For colleges funded by state tax dollars in the hands of legislators, you comply with their wishes (within reason) or you see your funding drop. Same with the trustees (who are appointed by the governor). I'm sure it goes on to a lesser extent at NIU. The legislators have the state schools by the nuts - just as they do with any institution that receives state funding. If the U of I tells the clouters to stick it, guess what happens to their funding?

At private schools, "clout" is based a little less on political influence and more on donations to the university. I do not give one penny to Northwestern. If my son were to exceed minimum quals for acceptance into NU and the barely-qualified (or not qualified) kid of someone else who donated thousands to the university were both up for admission, guess who would first be admitted?

I have seen this stuff happening for years. It is totally not right, but it's the way the "system" works. Nothing new or earth-shattering here. Must be a slow news day for the Tribune. Time for the Trib to wake up and smell the coffee. 07-coffee3
I know it is generally known that it happens. I just didn't expect the Tribune to do a story on it. I also think back to all those his board who say that U of I fairly gets the money it gets from the state and wonder if they still believe that by giving favors to lawmakers that they don't get that lawmakers pocketbook(which doesn't go to any of the other state schools).

Yes, it is wrong. It probably affected the funding the U of I receives from the state. I don't think it helped to increase their funding as much as allow it to keep receiving the level of funding it was getting. But, I can't attest to this.

Put yourself in the shoes of the U of I. A powerful legislator comes to you and pushes a potential student. Or, a member (or chairman) of the U of I Board of Trustees pushes a potential student. What do you do? Deny the legislator, and your funding could diminish. Deny the board member, and you lose your job. What do you do, run to the press and report it? What will that do to the U of I's status (read: future funding) with the state legislature?

The U of I was (and is) between a rock and a hard place. If NIU were the flagship university in Illinois, don't you think that NIU would be exposed to the same thing and act in the same way?

The real culprits - the politicians - should be exposed and prevented from doing this. But then, you'd have to go after every major state university and private university in the country who are doing the exact same thing.

No question that this is terrible and unjust. But, what can and are we going to do to stop this? Continual reporting of this in the press to foment public anger may help, but do you really think that the politician's give a rat's arse? To many voters, this is not such a big scandal in the grand scheme of things. Plus, get rid of the crooked politician and another one will step up to take his/her place.
05-29-2009 12:42 PM
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Nigel Incubator-Jones Offline
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Post: #9
RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 08:35 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 08:28 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Patronge is important to colleges - how else can they get Miffy's rich alumni dad donate?

Also, there are special admissions process for Athletes, special admission process for Minorities, special admissions process for really good Tuba players etc..... you just have to make sure you are a person the U wants, not just another good all around tuba playing minority student athlete....

Correct. Plus, when a university trustee tells you that he wants someone admitted, do you tell him (the university president's boss) no? If you value your job, you will do as the trustee says.


You hit the nail on the head.
05-29-2009 12:45 PM
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North Center Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 07:44 AM)HuskiemobileMan Wrote:  Keep up the good work DUofI!

Get over yourself.
05-29-2009 02:35 PM
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Nigel Incubator-Jones Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 02:35 PM)North Center Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 07:44 AM)HuskiemobileMan Wrote:  Keep up the good work DUofI!

Get over yourself.

Amen brother.
05-29-2009 05:11 PM
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NIUGAHuskie Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
Dang, I should have worked as hard as I could to become good friends with a state legislator before I applied to U of I. I might have gotten in.
05-29-2009 06:34 PM
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GeorgeBorkFan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 12:45 PM)Nigel Incubator-Jones Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 08:35 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 08:28 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Patronge is important to colleges - how else can they get Miffy's rich alumni dad donate?

Also, there are special admissions process for Athletes, special admission process for Minorities, special admissions process for really good Tuba players etc..... you just have to make sure you are a person the U wants, not just another good all around tuba playing minority student athlete....

Correct. Plus, when a university trustee tells you that he wants someone admitted, do you tell him (the university president's boss) no? If you value your job, you will do as the trustee says.


You hit the nail on the head.

If you value your values, you say no.

At some point, "we" have to start saying "no." We can't keep doing the same thing, accepting this as ok, and expecting our state to clean up.
05-29-2009 09:52 PM
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cyberdawg Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
We live in a state known for it's traditions and systems of clout being at the core of so many decisions.

None of this should come as much of a surprise to most who follow politics, public education policies and funding disparities.

Stretching of facts - whether in resumes, job applications , or a HS athlete's SAT score is only the tip of a huge iceberg lacking a moral compass.

I have worked for managers who boasted of their deep religious values and convictions but often when it came to business and money - lied or asked others to lie to customers, colleagues etc.....

Talking a good but less than honest game to achieve an objective has been elevated to a contemporary art form.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2009 10:25 PM by cyberdawg.)
05-29-2009 10:20 PM
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niuhuskie84 Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/colum...637.column
Quote:How you doin' on that free ride to college?

John Kass
May 31, 2009

If the Tribune's series on political clout influencing University of Illinois admissions hasn't made you angry enough, try this one:

Kurt Berger is a corrupt former Chicago Buildings Department supervisor now in federal prison for taking bribes. A couple of years ago, he had a problem. It wasn't just the FBI.

In 2007, Berger's son was a student at a state school, as Berger was facing time in the federal pen. The feds shut down his bribe operation, and he needed some extra cash for the tuition.

But he didn't have enough. So he gladly accepted the gift of your cash. That's right, yours. And who helped him to your cash?

Why, none other than state Sen. James DeLeo (D-How You Doin?), the eminent philanthropist.

Under a little publicized program called the Illinois General Assembly Scholarships, DeLeo provided a year's free tuition for the son of the bribe-taker at Northern Illinois University.

The program is available to all Illinois legislators. Each lawmaker receives the equivalent of two four-year scholarships (actually tuition waivers) for state schools every year. Legislators may parcel these out in any way they wish.

State records show that in 2008, DeLeo handed out eight one-year scholarships, including the one to the Bergers.

Other recipients were the son of Chicago Fire Department Battalion Chief Edward Doherty, whose son attends the University of Illinois at Chicago. Chief Doherty is the brother of Far Northwest Side Ald. Brian Doherty (41st).

Another DeLeo waiver went to the son of James McKay, the chief of death penalty prosecutions at the Cook County state's attorney's office.

Berger doesn't have much of an income in prison. But Chief Doherty makes $120,000 a year, city records show. The county lists McKay's salary at $150,000 a year.

McKay said that he hardly knew DeLeo and that his position had nothing to do with it. He said his son, whom he described as an A student, applied on his own. "I don't have any clout," McKay said. "He's not the son of some politically connected person."

Doherty said his son has received the tuition waiver from DeLeo for the last two years. The chief has known DeLeo for years, and Doherty's wife, Gina, is an aide to state Rep. Michael McAuliffe (R-Chicago).

"My son's achievements got him the scholarship. He excels," Doherty said. "It's open to anybody who lives in the district and it's up to DeLeo. Were we happy? Absolutely."

The political tuition program has been around for decades, dispensing millions of dollars each year. Those who receive the tuition waivers are eager young people who want to go to college. But some are also clout kids.

The Tribune investigative series "Clout Goes to College" -- by reporters Jodi Cohen, Tara Malone and Stacy St. Clair -- has been detailing a different aspect of political influence in higher education. Politicians, lobbyists and university trustees frequently use clout to win admission to the U. of I. for students who wouldn't otherwise qualify.

But what of high school seniors with top grades and exceptional ACT scores who aren't accepted at U. of I. because somebody's somebody who doesn't belong got their spot? DeLeo and his obedient sidekick, state Rep. Angelo "Skip" Saviano (R-Jimmy), are big players in the admissions game. Sunday's "Clout Goes to College" installment shows that in the last five years alone, the two have backed at least 50 students who ended up on the admissions clout list.

That list is called "Category I."

But the one I'm writing about today -- the money part -- also needs a cool name. How about we call it the "We Don't Want Nobody Nobody Sent Scholarship Fund?"

I figure that, for some clout kids, the two lists intersect.

It's nothing new for DeLeo. A few years ago, he helped the daughter of one of the Chicago Outfit's favorite law enforcement officers, corrupt former Cook County Undersheriff James "The Bohemian" Dvorak. With Dvorak in prison, DeLeo waived tuition for Dvorak's daughter at Eastern Illinois University, though she didn't live in Jimmy's district.

Records show that in the past, DeLeo has accepted campaign donations from mob-controlled businesses. In 2001, the Sun-Times asked him if this meant he was connected.

"What does that mean, mob-associated?" he said. "In the year 2001 is there really a mob in Chicago?"

That was years before DeLeo was mentioned in the recent Family Secrets trial of Outfit chiefs, when mob widow Annie Spilotro testified that DeLeo and zoning lawyer James Banks purchased her husband Michael's restaurant, in a building owned by mob boss Joey "the Clown" Lombardo.

On Friday, we called DeLeo. But not at the casino in Aruba. Instead, we called his Springfield office to ask about both of the clout lists. But no word from Jimmy.

And Kurt Berger? He'll spend the summer in Duluth, Minn., as inmate No. 19350-424, and is scheduled for release in September.

That's an exciting time, when students are eager to buy new school supplies, the crisp notebooks, pencil sharpeners, snazzy book bags.

And school begins anew, the Chicago Way.
(This post was last modified: 05-30-2009 10:41 AM by niuhuskie84.)
05-30-2009 10:40 AM
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klake87 Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
I had a general assembly scholarship for a year. When you have a Republican State Senator giving you a letter of recommendation to another Republican State Rep, it does not hurt.
05-30-2009 10:59 AM
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Dog Fan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(05-29-2009 09:52 PM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 12:45 PM)Nigel Incubator-Jones Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 08:35 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  
(05-29-2009 08:28 AM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Patronge is important to colleges - how else can they get Miffy's rich alumni dad donate?

Also, there are special admissions process for Athletes, special admission process for Minorities, special admissions process for really good Tuba players etc..... you just have to make sure you are a person the U wants, not just another good all around tuba playing minority student athlete....

Correct. Plus, when a university trustee tells you that he wants someone admitted, do you tell him (the university president's boss) no? If you value your job, you will do as the trustee says.


You hit the nail on the head.

If you value your values, you say no.

At some point, "we" have to start saying "no." We can't keep doing the same thing, accepting this as ok, and expecting our state to clean up.

If you value your job, you say yes to your boss. It may be unethical, but it's not illegal. If you can easily find another job, then you can go with your values and tell your boss to stick it. But, if you value your job in these tough economic times, you say yes to your boss. Then, at the end of the day, you go home, rinse your mouth out, and call it a day.
06-01-2009 07:43 AM
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GeorgeBorkFan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(06-01-2009 07:43 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  If you value your job, you say yes to your boss. It may be unethical, but it's not illegal. If you can easily find another job, then you can go with your values and tell your boss to stick it. But, if you value your job in these tough economic times, you say yes to your boss. Then, at the end of the day, you go home, rinse your mouth out, and call it a day.

And then we continue wonder why this state is a cesspool?

If you admit these people, you aren't doing your job. You work for the people of the state, not the guv personally.
06-01-2009 02:35 PM
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Dog Fan Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
(06-01-2009 02:35 PM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  
(06-01-2009 07:43 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  If you value your job, you say yes to your boss. It may be unethical, but it's not illegal. If you can easily find another job, then you can go with your values and tell your boss to stick it. But, if you value your job in these tough economic times, you say yes to your boss. Then, at the end of the day, you go home, rinse your mouth out, and call it a day.

And then we continue wonder why this state is a cesspool?

If you admit these people, you aren't doing your job. You work for the people of the state, not the guv personally.

Agreed. But, take it to the people responsible for this mess - the state politicians that put the U of I (and other universities) in this situation. Don't blame the little guy in admissions who is trying to keep a job to feed his family. If it's illegal, that's one thing. The whole thing just stinks. This crap goes on everywhere - and I do mean everywhere. All of this mess starts with the politicians. Unfortunately, I am guessing that there will be some class-actions suits now against the U of I. This could filter down to the other state schools (to a lesser extent). Who knows if the Tribune is not at the doorstep of the other state schools looking at their admissions?

The universities are hanging on by a shoestring budget-wise and can't afford to piss off the politicians. Those a-hole politicians are the ones who make the laws and rules. They are self-preservationists and self-protectors. Aside from getting federal prosecutors in here to purge the wayward political element in Illinois, the way you solve this situation is to make it illegal - punishable with a prison term or other severe penalty - to contribute ANY money to politicians. But, what politician would approve something like this? Graft and influence peddling is how they make their fortunes.
06-02-2009 07:57 AM
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Max Power Offline
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RE: College clout and U of I
The University of Illinois admitted and gave full rides to Blago's hacks in exchange for jobs for people at the bottom of the class, released emails suggest.

Quid Pro Blago

Quote:What does it cost to get an unqualified student into the University of Illinois law school?

Five jobs for graduating law students, suggest internal e-mails released Thursday.

The documents show for the first time efforts to seek favors -- in this case, jobs -- for admissions, the most troubling evidence yet of how Illinois' entrenched system of patronage crept into the state's most prestigious public university.
06-26-2009 06:43 PM
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