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nomad2u2001 Offline
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Post: #1
Pretty much open and shut...
Detainees Say They Planned Sept. 11
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By WILLIAM GLABERSON
Published: March 9, 2009
The five detainees at Guantánamo Bay charged with planning the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks have filed a document with the military commission at the United States naval base there expressing pride at their accomplishment and accepting full responsibility for the killing of nearly 3,000 people.

Related
Times Topics: Sept. 11, 2001

The document, which may be released publicly on Tuesday, uses the Arabic term for a consultative assembly in describing the five men as the “9/11 Shura Council,” and it says their actions were an offering to God, according to excerpts of the document that were read to a reporter by a government official who was not authorized to discuss it publicly.

The document is titled “The Islamic Response to the Government’s Nine Accusations,” the military judge at the Guantánamo Bay detention camp said in a separate filing, obtained by The New York Times, that describes the detainees’ document.

The document was filed on behalf of the five men, including Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, who has described himself as the mastermind of the Sept. 11 attacks.

President Obama halted the military proceedings at Guantánamo in the first days after his inauguration, and the five men’s case is on hiatus until the government decides how it will proceed.

Several of the men have earlier said in military commission proceedings at Guantánamo that they planned the 2001 attacks and that they sought martyrdom. The strategic goal of the five men in making the new filing, which reached the military court on March 5, was not clear.

In their filing, the men describe the planning of the Sept. 11 attacks and the killing of Americans as a model of Islamic action, and say the American government’s accusations cause them no shame, according to the excerpts read by the government official.

“To us,” the official continued reading, “they are not accusations. To us they are a badge of honor, which we carry with honor.”

It appears that the men wrote the document at meetings they are permitted to conduct periodically at the detention camp without lawyers.

In his brief court order describing the filing, the military judge who has been handling the case, Col. Stephen R. Henley of the Army, said the men sought no specific legal action. Judge Henley ordered that the filing be released immediately, but officials said objections from lawyers for two of the men had held up release Monday.

All five of the men have said they want to represent themselves, but in the case of these two men, Ramzi bin al-Shibh and Mustafa Ahmed al-Hawsawi, the military judge had not yet determined their competency when the proceedings were halted

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/10/us/10gitmo.html
03-09-2009 09:26 PM
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WoodlandsOwl Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
I'm sure they can find a gurney, a couple of bags of IV saline, and a few cc of pentothal and potassium chloride down there at Gitmo.

What are we waiting for? To make sure there aren't any water stains on these confessions?

Do it.
03-09-2009 09:46 PM
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SumOfAllFears Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
The LeftyWingNuts want to protect the terrorist murderers rights. And since they aspire to martyrdom, they play right into their wheelhouse.
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 09:41 AM by SumOfAllFears.)
03-10-2009 09:40 AM
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GGniner Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
'progressives' touted the Soviet Policy line for years as well, its why Lenin coined the term "Useful Idiot".

Probably why the ACLU was founded by Commies(i.e. to exploit what Civil Liberties really are to meet their ends) and of course why they tried to take over Hollywood and the power of that platform.
03-10-2009 09:44 AM
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Tripster Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
.

Oh yes !!!!! These guys now will need to be Saved because of their "Inner Courage to Admit their Guilt" .... they will become Pop Icons.

MTV will host a Special Award Show in their honor and Sean Penn, Alec Baldwin, Edward Norton, Danny Glover, and all of Hollywood will Revel in the Streets in great celebration ..... Obama will be Master of Ceremonies (if he is not too awful tired that is)

And of course Ward Churchill will call for Tax Payer Funded Research into the Mental Fascinations of these fine fellows.

It will truly be a Martyrs Feast .... 04-bow

.
03-10-2009 10:27 AM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
I'm offended that you all aren't outraged about how Cheney and his puppet Bush have trampled on the Constitution by keeping these men in prison this long while denying them their constitutional rights.
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 10:36 AM by Ninerfan1.)
03-10-2009 10:33 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
I say try them, then kill them. Just don't hold them without a trial. Not that complicated.
03-10-2009 11:17 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 11:17 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I say try them, then kill them. Just don't hold them without a trial. Not that complicated.

I'd be more inclined to kill them, then try them.
And there is absolutely nothing in the Geneva Conventions or anywhere else in international law to preclude that.
There would be nothing in the US constitution to preclude it either, if they had not been brought to Gitmo.
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 12:05 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
03-10-2009 11:26 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
I think everyone agrees that these are evil people and should be punished to fullest extent...but...what about those that have been in Gitmo that posed no threat and were just caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. Does the end justify the means? Should not these cases have been addressed long ago and those that posed no threat released?

I have no problem with Gitmo or the jailing of potential bad actors. I do have a problem with foot dragging in many of the cases.
03-10-2009 11:27 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 10:33 AM)Ninerfan1 Wrote:  I'm offended that you all aren't outraged about how Cheney and his puppet Bush have trampled on the Constitution by keeping these men in prison this long while denying them their constitutional rights.

Obama had months druing him campaign to figure out what to do with them and now that he's president all he's done is halt all court action against them. Obama's president and they're still in prison. Don't complain about Bush and Cheney, they can't do anything about this now. Complain to your Partier in Chief.
03-10-2009 12:01 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 10:33 AM)Ninerfan1 Wrote:  I'm offended that you all aren't outraged about how Cheney and his puppet Bush have trampled on the Constitution by keeping these men in prison this long while denying them their constitutional rights.

Exactly what rights do they have under the Constitution?
And what status gives them those rights?

Actually, the act of taking them to Gitmo may have conferred such rights. That's why taking them to Gitmo was a mistake. Kill them in the desert, bury them in a hole with a bunch of pigs, and let Allah search for their souls.
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 12:08 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
03-10-2009 12:07 PM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
Owl/smn,

Given my posts do you really think I was being serious?05-nono
03-10-2009 12:18 PM
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WoodlandsOwl Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
Looking at the past 8 months of CIA Drone attacks, I have a feeling that we have in custody an Al Qaeda operative the media doesn't know about.

They are probably stashed away in a secret prison somewhere in Afghanistan spilling their guts.

Since July of last year we have taken down their top bomb expert, their chemical weapons expert, the guy that designed the "shoe bomb" and the guy that designed the liquid bombs that the British caught at the airports, and a bunch of other mid level people in their Operations Branch.

We have a source that is providing accurate actionable intelligence that is rolling up the Operations people.

Now if we can only get the #1 and #2...
03-10-2009 12:29 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 12:29 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  Looking at the past 8 months of CIA Drone attacks, I have a feeling that we have in custody an Al Qaeda operative the media doesn't know about.
They are probably stashed away in a secret prison somewhere in Afghanistan spilling their guts.
Since July of last year we have taken down their top bomb expert, their chemical weapons expert, the guy that designed the "shoe bomb" and the guy that designed the liquid bombs that the British caught at the airports, and a bunch of other mid level people in their Operations Branch.
We have a source that is providing accurate actionable intelligence that is rolling up the Operations people.
Now if we can only get the #1 and #2...

Yes, but as long as we can keep rolling up the Ops folks, they're pretty much out of service. We just need to make sure we can keep doing that, unlike what happened when we split our focus in 2003.
03-10-2009 12:34 PM
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GGniner Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
Al-Qaeda has been defensive and in ruins since the success of the Surge. They made their stand, we made ours and we won. We probably have some high level guy who is spilling the beans in exchange for money and an island somewhere.

Quote:"the most serious issue today for the whole world is this Third World War that is raging in Iraq." - Osama Bin Laden

Quote:Al-Qaeda's No. 2, Ayman al-Zawahiri declared Iraq "is now the place for the greatest battle of Islam in this era.''

and more importantly what they did during this period, in funneling their recruits into Iraq, instead of Afghanistan at the time.

and the Brits lucked up into having British born and breed Muslims deciding to wage Jihad in Afghan and Iraq instead of at home(minus a few exceptions).

Petraus for Vice President 2012!
(This post was last modified: 03-10-2009 12:42 PM by GGniner.)
03-10-2009 12:41 PM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 12:18 PM)Ninerfan1 Wrote:  Owl/smn,

Given my posts do you really think I was being serious?05-nono

Sorry bro.....confused you with someone else on the board.
03-10-2009 12:46 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 10:27 AM)Tripster Wrote:  .

Oh yes !!!!! These guys now will need to be Saved because of their "Inner Courage to Admit their Guilt" .... they will become Pop Icons.

MTV will host a Special Award Show in their honor and Sean Penn, Alec Baldwin, Edward Norton, Danny Glover, and all of Hollywood will Revel in the Streets in great celebration ..... Obama will be Master of Ceremonies (if he is not too awful tired that is)

And of course Ward Churchill will call for Tax Payer Funded Research into the Mental Fascinations of these fine fellows.

It will truly be a Martyrs Feast .... 04-bow

.
01-wingedeagle
03-10-2009 01:21 PM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 11:26 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-10-2009 11:17 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I say try them, then kill them. Just don't hold them without a trial. Not that complicated.

I'd be more inclined to kill them, then try them.
And there is absolutely nothing in the Geneva Conventions or anywhere else in international law to preclude that.
There would be nothing in the US constitution to preclude it either, if they had not been brought to Gitmo.

I think we should have them make a naked human pyramid, then throw shoes at them.
03-10-2009 02:00 PM
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Tripster Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 01:21 PM)RobertN Wrote:  01-wingedeagle
.

See Forest ..... errr ...... Robert, that's what we all knew you'd say .... 03-lmfao 03-lmfao 03-lmfao

.
03-10-2009 04:04 PM
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DrTorch Offline
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RE: Pretty much open and shut...
(03-10-2009 11:27 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  I think everyone agrees that these are evil people and should be punished to fullest extent...but...what about those that have been in Gitmo that posed no threat and were just caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. Does the end justify the means? Should not these cases have been addressed long ago and those that posed no threat released?

I have no problem with Gitmo or the jailing of potential bad actors. I do have a problem with foot dragging in many of the cases.

I understand this position. I'm inclined to agree w/ it in many ways. The US should have resolved to do something about this early on. But it was/is a two-edged sword. Indecision is what happens when you go w/ pragmatism, instead of principle.

I am disgusted by the quotes that the US fights from behind roadblocks rather than face-to-face. So hijacking a civilian aircraft and flying it into civilian buildings is honorable?

Off 'em and feed them to pigs.
03-10-2009 04:18 PM
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