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White racism may cost Obama the election
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Rebel
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Post: #21
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
IMO, and IMO only, there are only two races in this country. Liberal and conservative. Color matters not one bit and it seems the "racism" issue seems to be coming from the Democrats. Sad, but it's the cards you're dealt when you encompass SO many issues. Ever seen a liberal protest? You can't keep up with the signs. They're all over the page. Blacks are pissed off, but they continue to vote for the SAME party who put them in the position to be pissed off. Futility. How's Nagin working out for NO? He was voted in for the simple FACT that he was a black Democrat. My co-worker, who sits right NEXT to me, lived in NO for about 45 years, aside from his time in Vietnam. He shows me the Times-Picayune every damn day. Murders left and right. Yeah, like I want someone like Nagin, a liberal, running the country. Sorry, Chocolate city? Fine. Liberal chocolate city? Not no, but HELL no.
09-22-2008 08:57 PM
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Post: #22
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Rebel Wrote:IMO, and IMO only, there are only two races in this country. Liberal and conservative. Color matters not one bit and it seems the "racism" issue seems to be coming from the Democrats. Sad, but it's the cards you're dealt when you encompass SO many issues. Ever seen a liberal protest? You can't keep up with the signs. They're all over the page. Blacks are pissed off, but they continue to vote for the SAME party who put them in the position to be pissed off. Futility. How's Nagin working out for NO? He was voted in for the simple FACT that he was a black Democrat. My co-worker, who sits right NEXT to me, lived in NO for about 45 years, aside from his time in Vietnam. He shows me the Times-Picayune every damn day. Murders left and right. Yeah, like I want someone like Nagin, a liberal, running the country. Sorry, Chocolate city? Fine. Liberal chocolate city? Not no, but HELL no.

I doesnt matter squat what party blacks vote for. Neither of them are going to address the problems that face them daily. Its impossible. Governments cant stop racism. Hell...Government doesnt do anything very well except steal and kill.
09-22-2008 09:33 PM
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DrTorch Offline
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Post: #23
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Fo Shizzle Wrote:
DrTorch Wrote:There is very little racism in America. The divides are cultural. Racism is simply a play by the media to get readers/ratings.

Ummm.....Not so sure about that. I understand the cultural divide, but I think if I was a black man Id say racism still exists all over.

Just saying it doesn't make it true. And that's assuming that everyone accpts the definition of culture vs race. It's not in many people's best interest to accept that...so it defaults back to "racism".

And I stand corrected by Rebel, there is a fair bit of racism from the DNC.
09-22-2008 09:42 PM
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Rebel
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Post: #24
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
I'm sorry, but what do blacks face every day that ALL Americans don't face themselves? ...and if you can answer that, when did black people stop being "Americans"?
09-22-2008 09:42 PM
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Post: #25
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
DrTorch Wrote:And I stand corrected by Rebel, there is a fair bit of racism from the DNC.

Torch, we've had our differences, but if said I didn't miss you, I'd be lying. I actually went into your account about a month ago to see if you were still active.
09-22-2008 09:44 PM
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Post: #26
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Fo Shizzle Wrote:Ive been supervising a predominately black industrial workforce of between 60 to 70 employees for the past 25 years and listening to the things that they have relayed to me about the way they are treated (and have observed)qualifies me to understand that ...Yes...racism is still around.

I understand your point about black men that become successful. I have heard the "uncle tom" comments...but...That has nothing to do with the racism that most blacks encounter on a daily basis.
I think if you walk in their shoes for a few days...your opinion would change.

I could be wrong. I don't know exactly what eachof these men experience daily...but my observations lead me to believe that much of the "racism" they percieve, is just that...thier perception. They may experience animosity, but I don't think it's race-based. For example, I will gesture toward anybody who cuts me off in traffic, or holds me up at a light...it's not race based! But, their perception may be different.

Furthermore, even if they are experience unique animosity, it's very pssible it's culturally based, not race. Those are hard things to distinguish, but I guarantee you I was mocking the guy on the playground basketball court w/ his pants around his thighs, NOT because he was black (so were 8 of the other 9)...but b/c he looked like a dumb***.
09-22-2008 09:49 PM
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DrTorch Offline
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Post: #27
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Rebel Wrote:
DrTorch Wrote:And I stand corrected by Rebel, there is a fair bit of racism from the DNC.

Torch, we've had our differences, but if said I didn't miss you, I'd be lying. I actually went into your account about a month ago to see if you were still active.

Thanks Kev. I toasted to you when Eli led the Giants to their SB victory.
09-22-2008 09:51 PM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #28
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Rebel Wrote:I'm sorry, but what do blacks face every day that ALL Americans don't face themselves? ...and if you can answer that, when did black people stop being "Americans"?

So...You have had racial slurs tossed at you?...You have been pulled over by the cops because you were driving on a public street that happened to be in white neighborhood?...Cabs drive by you when you hail them because you are white?...You have been passed over for a job because you are white?...Reb...These things still occur.

Im with you though....Hyphenated-Americanism makes me sick.
09-22-2008 09:59 PM
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firmbizzle Offline
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Post: #29
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Rebel Wrote:
firmbizzle Wrote:Explain to me how it's any different than when 95% of black people voted for Clinton, Gore, or Kerry. Not sure, but I think they were white. No Farrakhan ties at all. The church wasn't anti-white, Phlegler and many other white preachers preached in it. In fact, the church is part of the predominately white United Church of Christ which has give Wright many awards. Anyway what does that have to do with Barack Obama, I've never seen or heard him say malicious things. I don't consider the "bitter" comment malicious.

95% of black people didn't vote for Clinton, Gore, or Kerry. Next?

You're right it's more like 84-91%, the same as those voting for Obama.

1984 91-10 Mondale http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/electio...ed_04.html

1996 84-10 Clinton http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/electio...ed_96.html


2000 90-10% Gore http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/electio...ed_00.html

2004 88-11% Kerry http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/electio...ed_04.html

2008 90-7% Obama http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/camp...ccain.html
09-22-2008 10:27 PM
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Rebel
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Post: #30
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Fo Shizzle Wrote:So...You have had racial slurs tossed at you?

Oh, hell yeah.

Quote:...You have been pulled over by the cops because you were driving on a public street that happened to be in white neighborhood?

Yes. I was pulled over driving down Wiggins road in Jackson for the simple fact of me being white. The cop actually asked me if I was there to buy drugs.

Quote:...Cabs drive by you when you hail them because you are white?

Don't know. I don't hail cabs. I would venture to say what you're insinuating happens in certain areas. Sorry, the crime rate in the black community isn't something that can be ignored. Would YOU pick up a black person in a crime-riddled area that happened to be black? PC and **** like that doesn't protect your life, homes.

Quote:...You have been passed over for a job because you are white?...Reb...These things still occur.

Don't know. To be honest, I don't know how many jobs I, as a defense contractor with 3 degrees, and a US Army veteran, with a secret clearance, who's HELD a TS-SCI/SSBI, I've missed out on since I'm just a cracka.

Quote:Im with you though....Hyphenated-Americanism makes me sick.

Werd.
09-22-2008 10:55 PM
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BlazerFan11 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Fo Shizzle Wrote:So...You have had racial slurs tossed at you?...You have been pulled over by the cops because you were driving on a public street that happened to be in white neighborhood?...Cabs drive by you when you hail them because you are white?...You have been passed over for a job because you are white?...Reb...These things still occur.

I'm white and I've been in a restaurant and been refused service by an all-black staff while they immediately served a black man who walked in ten minutes after me (although judging from how filthy the place was, they were probably doing me a favor). Not to mention the thousands and thousands of people who got scholarships over me because of the color of their skin, even though I had better grades and standardized test scores, and had to work various crappy part-time jobs to help pay my way through school, which took away from my studies and hurt my grades, which could end up costing me a lot of money over the course of many years. I think I'd rather have a cab driver pass me by. I have also known deserving white guys get passed over for medical school because the school needed to fill its "quotas" for certain minorities. Again, I'm sure they would have rather been called a cracker a few times than have that happen.
09-23-2008 08:53 AM
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Post: #32
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Wow, a lot has been written in the 2 days I've been gone.

jh Wrote:Again, you need to read the article a little more closely. The survey was conducted over the Internet because studies have found people are more willing to give truthful responses when they aren't talking to someone. But what you are suggesting would tend to make the numbers higher, not lower.
After reading this story, but prior to creating this thread, I heard on talk radio that this was, indeed, a phone poll and that (favorable?) respondents were given a website to go to.

I would also agree with those who believe that racism is based on perception. A black guy gets mugged in a seedy white neighborhood and race will immediately become a factor. A white guy gets mugged in a seedy black neighborhood and the white guy is called an idiot for going there.

Black leaders don't help the matter at all. Folks like Jackson, Sharpton, Wright, et al don't want to help blacks solve their problems, they want to tell them who to blame for thier problems. After the Imus thing Bill O"Rielly interviewed Sharpton and O'Rielly asked him if there's black on white racism and Sharpton said 'NO." When asked why, Sharpton said racism only comes from people who hold power.

Yesterday Rush Limbaugh spent the last 15 minutes of his show talking about this story and two afternoon radio talk show hosts spent an hour on it and they, like me, think that if Obama loses the left will cry racism and this story advances that excuse.
09-23-2008 12:02 PM
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Post: #33
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
smn1256 Wrote:Yesterday Rush Limbaugh spent the last 15 minutes of his show talking about this story and two afternoon radio talk show hosts spent an hour on it and they, like me, think that if Obama loses the left will cry racism and this story advances that excuse.
So the left will cry that their own prejudice cost Obama the election, and this will benefit them how? As the article notes, although the percentages of Republicans with unfavorable views of blacks is similar, that's not why they aren't voting for Obama. They're Republicans, after all, and are much more likely to vote for a candidate from their own party. I just don't see how claiming that their own side is too prejudiced to elect a black man gains the left anything at all.
09-23-2008 01:53 PM
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Post: #34
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
jh Wrote:I just don't see how claiming that their own side is too prejudiced to elect a black man gains the left anything at all.
If Obama loses it gives him an excuse and it won't be because of his stance on the issues, it will be because of racism.
09-23-2008 02:45 PM
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Post: #35
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
smn1256 Wrote:
jh Wrote:I just don't see how claiming that their own side is too prejudiced to elect a black man gains the left anything at all.
If Obama loses it gives him an excuse and it won't be because of his stance on the issues, it will be because of racism.
Ok, so that explains why Obama would want to push the idea (not that I agree he would), but why would the rest of the left go along with it? Why would the dreaded left-wing-ivory-tower-liberal-media-elite push this idea? It makes them look worse. It makes it harder for them to muster minority votes in the future. It makes it harder for them to win future elections. Yet they are willing to sacrifice all this to make Obama feel better about himself?

Of course, these conspiracy claims also have no impact on the claims of the survey (namely that Obama would be polling 6% higher if he were white). If the results are a relatively accurate reflection of reality, it's a sign that we still have a ways to go as a society.
09-23-2008 02:59 PM
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Post: #36
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
jh Wrote:
smn1256 Wrote:
jh Wrote:I just don't see how claiming that their own side is too prejudiced to elect a black man gains the left anything at all.
If Obama loses it gives him an excuse and it won't be because of his stance on the issues, it will be because of racism.
Ok, so that explains why Obama would want to push the idea (not that I agree he would), but why would the rest of the left go along with it? Why would the dreaded left-wing-ivory-tower-liberal-media-elite push this idea? It makes them look worse. It makes it harder for them to muster minority votes in the future. It makes it harder for them to win future elections. Yet they are willing to sacrifice all this to make Obama feel better about himself?

Sympathy? Other than that why would the poll be taken in the first place and then published by AP?
09-23-2008 03:16 PM
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Post: #37
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
smn1256 Wrote:
jh Wrote:
smn1256 Wrote:
jh Wrote:I just don't see how claiming that their own side is too prejudiced to elect a black man gains the left anything at all.
If Obama loses it gives him an excuse and it won't be because of his stance on the issues, it will be because of racism.
Ok, so that explains why Obama would want to push the idea (not that I agree he would), but why would the rest of the left go along with it? Why would the dreaded left-wing-ivory-tower-liberal-media-elite push this idea? It makes them look worse. It makes it harder for them to muster minority votes in the future. It makes it harder for them to win future elections. Yet they are willing to sacrifice all this to make Obama feel better about himself?

Sympathy? Other than that why would the poll be taken in the first place and then published by AP?
How is claiming that their party is prejudiced supposed to garner them sympathy?

I suspect the reason the poll was taken is exactly the reason the authors of the survey give in the article. The results of the national polls weren't matching their expectations and their line of work allows them to research these things. They came up with a hypothesis, that Obama's race was a factor in the election being closer than expected, and created a survey to determine if that was true and what effect it was having. According to their survey, Obama being black causes him to poll 6% lower than he would if he was white.

The AP reported on the survey because the AP reports on a great many things, and the fact that a candidate's race might be costing him 6% in a presidential election is certainly more newsworthy than many of the other stories they run. From the article, it appears that this is a legitimate survey, meeting the typical standards off academic rigor used in the social sciences. I understand if you don't blindly accept their conclusions, I myself would want to look at the actual survey and results before taking a side on their accuracy, but I don't see how this can be consider not to be newsworthy.
09-23-2008 04:59 PM
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Post: #38
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
I would like to see what questions were asked on the phone, what, if any, criteria was used to get people to go to a web site and what the questions on the web site were.
09-23-2008 05:24 PM
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Post: #39
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
BlazerFan11 Wrote:
Fo Shizzle Wrote:So...You have had racial slurs tossed at you?...You have been pulled over by the cops because you were driving on a public street that happened to be in white neighborhood?...Cabs drive by you when you hail them because you are white?...You have been passed over for a job because you are white?...Reb...These things still occur.

I'm white and I've been in a restaurant and been refused service by an all-black staff while they immediately served a black man who walked in ten minutes after me (although judging from how filthy the place was, they were probably doing me a favor). Not to mention the thousands and thousands of people who got scholarships over me because of the color of their skin, even though I had better grades and standardized test scores, and had to work various crappy part-time jobs to help pay my way through school, which took away from my studies and hurt my grades, which could end up costing me a lot of money over the course of many years. I think I'd rather have a cab driver pass me by. I have also known deserving white guys get passed over for medical school because the school needed to fill its "quotas" for certain minorities. Again, I'm sure they would have rather been called a cracker a few times than have that happen.

Lets cry ourselves a river over our problems...There is no comparison.
(This post was last modified: 09-23-2008 08:31 PM by Fo Shizzle.)
09-23-2008 08:28 PM
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Post: #40
RE: White racism may cost Obama the election
Fo Shizzle Wrote:Lets cry ourselves a river over our problems...There is no comparison.

Apparently there is, once you start looking at facts and get past the emotional hype.
09-23-2008 10:00 PM
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