Red-Faced Orange
With the so-called middle of the Big East (USF, Cincinnati) accelerating to stay in the slipstream of conference heavyweights West Virginia, Louisville and Rutgers, the current state of Syracuse football sticks out like a forehead zit.

Get this stat: The Big East has won 28 of its past 30 nonconference games. That's impressive. Sure, it includes a bunch of softies. But it also includes a 5-0 bowl record last season. Oh, and the only two losses in the past 30 nonleague games? They belong to Syracuse. It's not a huge problem for the league, but still.

Big East coaches won't say it on the record, but they shake their heads at how a program with as much long-term tradition as any in the conference (and more than most) has gotten so out of step with the league's forward momentum. Beware: The Big East is the only league I can recall to jettison a program for not pulling its weight. Not that Syracuse will taste Temple's fate, of course.

Syracuse has tried to market itself as "New York's Team." It's an effort to lessen the foothold that Rutgers has gained across the Hudson River. Many in Manhattan now view the Scarlet Knights as "their" college team. That tweaks a few folks on the river's western banks, but hey, with Rutgers on the radar and "Jersey Boys" still the hottest ticket on Broadway, the 201 is not short on respect in the post-"Sopranos" era. Other than alums of this distinguished school, there are not many in "The City" flying 'Cuse colors these days. New York loves a winner, folks. If they want to follow struggling teams, well, that's what the Jets and Giants are for.

Back to the rough start for the university of Jim Brown, Ernie Davis, Donovan McNabb, et al.
At Iowa on Saturday, the Orange emerged from the pink locker room and stumbled to exactly 1 yard of total offense in the first half. They didn't move the chains for the first time until midway through the third quarter! The offense was seemingly so eager to get off the field that they produced almost as many false-start penalties (four) as total first downs (five)! When the ugliness was over, Syracuse had completed a total of seven passes and generated 103 total yards.

True, the opening home beatdown from Washington no longer seems as embarrassing with further proof that U-Dub has turned it around. But unless coach Greg Robinson's crew can beat visiting Illinois on Saturday, wins look hard to find. For the 'Cuse, there are no gimmes in the Big East, because they are the gimme.

Illinois, which has won exactly one road game in four years and lost at home to the Orange last year, is almost a two-touchdown favorite in the Dome on Saturday. Ouch.

But, please, for the love of Jordan Tirico, go get 'em Orange. ESPN broadcaster Mike Tirico's second-grade son is a passionate and informed fan of his dad's alma mater. He knows his stuff. Maybe he'll follow his dad's footsteps. Then again, maybe he'll aim a little higher than sportscasting. It's been a real tough two weeks for Jordan. You see, he's also a fanatic for the hometown Wolverines.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/st...id=3017005

SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

This kind of attention albeit negative has an upside for Syracuse. It keeps the pressure on the Syracuse administration and makes it more likely that it will be forced to make a change in the leadership of its football program at the end of the season.

The football program at Syracuse is not broken. It just needs competent leadership.

wvucrazed Wrote:SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

MichaelSavage Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

Nebraska and Alabama are not shells of what they used to be.

Alabama brought 93k to their spring game, as I recall. Nebraska is a very good team and has a chance to prove they are a great team by beating USC at home this weekend.

They are both still national programs that could contend for a national title in any given year.

The problem isn't that they've slipped, but others have gained ground. There are more national-title caliber programs now than when it was Bama, Nebraska, Oklahoma, and a few others.

But Nebraska and Alabama are still Nebraska and Alabama.

As for Miami - they've slipped, but they'll be back as well, I predict.

Teams like Alabama and Nebraska contended for the national title on an annual basis. Those days are long gone. The old Nebraska would've dropped 60 on Wake Forest last weekend. Yes, they're still good, but they're nowhere near what they used to be. And I'm not sure if they'll ever be.

MichaelSavage Wrote:Teams like Alabama and Nebraska contended for the national title on an annual basis. Those days are long gone. The old Nebraska would've dropped 60 on Wake Forest last weekend. Yes, they're still good, but they're nowhere near what they used to be. And I'm not sure if they'll ever be.

I disagree. Alabama and Nebraska are among the elite programs in college football, and are serious national title contenders in any given year.

It's true that they are not as dominant as they used to be, but that is more a reflection of the changing landscape in college football.

There's no reason to think that Syracuse can't make it back to being an elite team in the Big East. It will be a challenge, sure, but the right coach can turn it around in a hurry.

If that "any given year" was during the '70s, '80s or '90s, I'd agree with you. But they have looked nothing like that of late. When was the last time those schools were serious national title contenders? Nebraska in 2001 I guess.

WacoBearcat Wrote:This kind of attention albeit negative has an upside for Syracuse. It keeps the pressure on the Syracuse administration and makes it more likely that it will be forced to make a change in the leadership of its football program at the end of the season.

The football program at Syracuse is not broken. It just needs competent leadership.

I agree completely! I think negative attention is the best thing for a struggling program because it essentially forces a change...although the local fan base and alumni also add pressure to the administration as well. I hope we see more press about Syracuse's struggles because the more visible it is, the sooner a change will happen.

MichaelSavage Wrote:I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

Dude, you need to calm down about this. Nebraska is already on its way back up and I guarantee Miami will be a force again in a few years. A lot of things like this go in cycles and a program will return again. Trust me, the alumni and Syracuse locals will not allow the administration to keep the program down for much longer. A change will be made.

It's all about getting the right coach in place. Syracuse has the history, fan support, & bcs access. West Virginia & Rutgers have the best coaches for their schools. It will be interesting to see if the Louisville coach keeps the Cardinals at their current level. Cincy appear to have a good one. The jury is still out on the Pitt coach. USF has a topnotch coach. The only advice I'd give the Syracuse AD is not to give the current Syracuse coach too long to prove himself. It's a waste of time & money to do so.

MichaelSavage Wrote:Teams like Alabama and Nebraska contended for the national title on an annual basis. Those days are long gone. The old Nebraska would've dropped 60 on Wake Forest last weekend. Yes, they're still good, but they're nowhere near what they used to be. And I'm not sure if they'll ever be.

I agree about the Nebraska part as an old Nebraska team would of destroyed Wake Forest last week.

Alabama will probably be back in another 2-3 years...as Saban is cleaning up recruiting wise in the state and it will take 2-3 years to recruit HIS style of player to fit his system.

Now Bama will do well...but I think in another 2 years they will be challenging for the top spot in the SEC and the Nation.

Nebraska?

They are still a very distant third in the Big 12...and I don't think Texas and OU will drop from the Top 2 spots anytime soon.

PS. Weird Nebraska factoid: Huskers game at Wake Forest was the smallest stadium (32,000) Nebraska had played in over the past 35 (approx) years.

MichaelSavage Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

Nebraska is ranked #14 in the country how are they a shell of their former selves? Syracuse will be back with the right coach.

MichaelSavage Wrote:If that "any given year" was during the '70s, '80s or '90s, I'd agree with you. But they have looked nothing like that of late. When was the last time those schools were serious national title contenders? Nebraska in 2001 I guess.

There isn't a program out there that has ever contended for a national title EVERY year. Period. I mean it's stupid to say that just because Nebraska isn't blowing people out they are a shell of their former selves. They had a few downs years. Again I'm asking, what national title contender has blown out every team they have played?

KnightLight Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:Teams like Alabama and Nebraska contended for the national title on an annual basis. Those days are long gone. The old Nebraska would've dropped 60 on Wake Forest last weekend. Yes, they're still good, but they're nowhere near what they used to be. And I'm not sure if they'll ever be.

I agree about the Nebraska part as an old Nebraska team would of destroyed Wake Forest last week.

Alabama will probably be back in another 2-3 years...as Saban is cleaning up recruiting wise in the state and it will take 2-3 years to recruit HIS style of player to fit his system.

Now Bama will do well...but I think in another 2 years they will be challenging for the top spot in the SEC and the Nation.

Nebraska?

They are still a very distant third in the Big 12...and I don't think Texas and OU will drop from the Top 2 spots anytime soon.

PS. Weird Nebraska factoid: Huskers game at Wake Forest was the smallest stadium (32,000) Nebraska had played in over the past 35 (approx) years.

People were saying that about Ohio State in the mid-90s right before Cooper was fired. Michigan is down. Oklahoma has been down the last few year before returning this year, Texas has been down, USC has been down, EVERYONE has been down at some point. I don't know how anybody could look into a crystal ball and say that Nebraska is a distant 3rd in the Big 12. They're ranked #14 and everyone is gushing over Oklahoma beating a terrible Miami team that has been down the last few years.

CatsClaw Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:If that "any given year" was during the '70s, '80s or '90s, I'd agree with you. But they have looked nothing like that of late. When was the last time those schools were serious national title contenders? Nebraska in 2001 I guess.

There isn't a program out there that has ever contended for a national title EVERY year. Period. I mean it's stupid to say that just because Nebraska isn't blowing people out they are a shell of their former selves. They had a few downs years. Again I'm asking, what national title contender has blown out every team they have played?

Do you honestly think there is no difference between Nebraska in 2007 and the Nebraska of the '70s, '80s and '90s? Osborne's teams were national title contenders just about every single year during that time frame. Look at the caliber of players they had then and look at what they have now. It's not even close.

For teams like Alabama, Nebraska, and others a bad year is 8-4. Syracuse is looking at 0-12 and falling so far behind the rest of the Big East that they become more like Northwestern, Duke and get written off by recruits for top non-BCS schools. Carrierdome is small by BCS standards so Syracuse can't offer the money to buy cupcakes like Louisville and WV can. Syracuse also can't pay the kind of money top BCS teams do for coaches. My guess is Syracuse isn't trilled with BE dropping Temple and taking away an easy conference win. You gonna add ECU so they can kick Syracuse's butt every Saturday too. I expect Syracuse to push for a split and expansion which includes Temple and Buffalo next round and try to return the BE to its northeast roots and to get the BE to go to 12 teams pushing Louisville and West Virginia into a Southern Division which puts Syracuse in a better competitive position among the Big East North.

BE North
UConn
Buffalo
Syracuse
Rutgers
Temple
Pitt

BE South
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
South Florida
Central Florida
ECU

MichaelSavage Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

Apples and oranges. Those three schools were national title contenders on an annual basis. Syracuse was a near-elite program. So the climb back up is to basically contend for the Top 25 on an annual basis.

There's no excuse why the Orange can't get back to that level again. As pointed out before in other threads, these things go in cycles.

Syracuse has bounced back from the abyss before. It can do so again. The question really is how soon. At this point in time, I'd say it's going to take at least a decade.

Cheers,
Neil

CatsClaw Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:SU will be back. They just need the right coach.

I mentioned this in another thread, but I'll say it again: How do we know they'll be back? Nebraska, Alabama, Miami are all shells of what they used to be and don't appear to be poised to return to their past dominance. Syracuse is in a lot deeper hole than those schools now. Not saying that it can't be done, but there are no guarantees.

Nebraska is ranked #14 in the country how are they a shell of their former selves? Syracuse will be back with the right coach.

Well, as a Nebraska fan.... We will see today. Granted, USC is an elite team at this time but I am not a Callahan fan. Nebraska seems to be a "pretender" who will not join the elite teams like Oklahoma and Texas.

I was surprised when they gave Callahan an extension.

OUBOBCATJOHN Wrote:I expect Syracuse to push for a split

I expect you to keep coming on here and posting ridiculous crap you've pulled out of your ass. You want to wager on which one of us is correct first?

If SU didn't want to keep playing the Catholic schools in basketball they would have worked harder to get into the ACC. A split is going to be harder to achieve because of SU, not easier. You really think SU is going to happily give up games against Georgetown and Villanova so they can play East Bumfarkolina?

OUBOBCATJOHN Wrote:BE North
UConn
Buffalo
Syracuse

What the Hell is wrong with you people? THERE IS NO CONNECTION between Buffalo and SU. They didn't play a single game in the 1900s. Doesn't that tell you anything? And it's not for a lack of opportunity. UB didn't drop football until 1970. UConn and Buffalo have played more games against each other. SU and Buffalo are only playing now because Buffalo agreed to a 3-for-1 deal. Stop with this nonsense about anyone wanting Buffalo in the BE.